Your H and I are more alike than I thought. I would always convince my wife to let me buy more of a certain stock. She was not comfortable, but I would bully until she said yes. I have stopped buying it now.
She also would just like to be held. I have not put the "moves" on in a long time. I have just held, up until I moved out. What do you need to see in your H? Use me as the guinie pig. What do you need to see in him? Run by all of us what you want to see in him, and maybe we could all come up with ways to help him see what you need. First of all, he needs to make it all about you. It is all about what you need at this point. It has been so long that he has unbalanced the boat in his way. It is time to bring it back in balance by moving to what you need. It could be as simple as here is a list of what I need from you. You meet these needs, and we will start moving in the right direction. If you get off track, I will tell you. This is going to be hard, so if you are not up to it, I understand. It would be nice if it were that simple.
Quote: First of all, he needs to make it all about you.
Here are some things I want to see: * I need to see that H will put my needs first (meaning above his), at least for a while. * I want to know that H is listening. I mean really listening; not the half-hearted crap I have been getting. He needs to do a little paraphrasing and repeating what I say...to clarify and then actually make the changes/efforts or making another suggestion. * He needs work on his behavior toward me (mainly - anger, selfishness, his need to control, and manipulation). * I want to feel loved in the way that I feel love. It was an exercise in the videos - list the 3 things that another can do to make me feel loved.....
I have to admit: even if he does these things or more, I am not sure I want to try anymore. It's been too long of a journey down the wrong path. I am at a point where I no longer have any respect him b/c of all the nasty things that have transpired between us. Just don't wait to long before showing your W changes.
I left 8 months ago. I was bitter and resentful. I did the forgiveness exercises over the weekend. I had hoped I would feel differently about my H. I don't. The good news is that I do not feel any more bitterness, anger or resentment. I feel like it freed me from the past. I can now put the past behind me and move on with my life.
It's funny, I asked H to PLEASE leave me alone, give me time and space to sort out some things. I needed time to heal. Time to figure out if I wanted to continue to try to save our M. He is finally doing that - leaving me alone - after 8 months and I think it's having the opposite effect?
I thought that I would miss him. That I would feel lonely and want to work things out. I am not finiding that at all. I am finding that by him leaving me alone I am healing. My heart is healing.
We haven't talked to each other since Monday (last week - Jan. 17th). I was going to contact him over the weekend to tell him I forgave him, but I didn't. I figured I could wait until I saw him Saturday. It's like I continue to limit our contact.
After this weekend; reading DB, doing the forgiveness exercises, etc. I realized that I want to improve myself. I don't want to work on the R. I don't mean that to sound harsh or cold. I am just beginning to accept the reality of my sitch. No changes = no M and I don't see H doing anything to better the sitch.
All I can do is change me, and keep a PMA. That's what I am doing.
Oh yeah, I left this one out earlier - *I want no R talk from H. I would like for us just to go out and enjoy each other for a couple of times w/o having to discuss us.
H is always telling me that he is a new person and he is not the same guy who treated me badly. So, I tell him let me get to know this "new" guy. I ask him to "act as if" we have just met. Let's go out a few times, so I can see the changes and get a feel of what life would be like w/ this new person before asking me for a decision on the R.
That never happens - by the end of the night H usually brings up the question: When are you coming home? I once tried to be funny and responded that I don't move in w/ men I just met after one date. Needless to say, H didn't find it amusing.
He has a tough road to go, and he has no clue how hard it is going to be. I am sorry that your heart is getting hardened to the point of no return. It is no fun getting to this point. Your H is sounding more and more like me. Thanks for the posting in that I see myself, and how I need to be. That helps me, and some others here, but I don't know what to say about getting your heart softer towards your H. If he were to start listening to you, really listening, stop talking about the R, putting in the effort to find your needs and then putting in the effort to meet your needs, would that start to soften your heart? How do you get that across to him? He has no clue. Is there really no way you would want to get him a list of your grievances, and more importantly, needs? From my perspective it is really hard to know what to think or do, especially when you have not seen or talked with him for a week.
It really helps me. I am going to back off of my W, and let her lead the dance. I am going back to my goals. I will make our conversations light and fun. I will listen to W. I will support her life goals. I will let her control the situation (the newest goal). I really want to call her to let her know I will help financially more than what I have, but I will let her call me when she needs something and get it to her gratiously.
Michelle21, First of all I would like to congratulate you for the commitment you have shown to your marriage. I understand you are on the fence and its understandable. I very much admire your commitment, you should be proud of yourself.
Your husband is so very lucky to have a wife who is willing to think about trying.
Shortly after my divorce I stopped pushing my XW. Leading up to the D I tried to refrain from pressure, believe me everytime I was around her and even when I wasn't I wanted to convince her she was making a mistake, that she belonged with me. It is very hard not to push, even now. I also evoked some guilt and pity. All of this is natural, however and this is very important, IT IS NOT PRODUCTIVE. It is very important that your H understands this. Understand that not everything will change at once, you have said that he has made some changes, this is positive, no-one knows if he will keep it up. Have you shared this positive with him?
One of my biggest problems was that I never thought my W would leave. I took her for granted and treated her badly. One of the reasons I did this was because I did not realize the consequences of my actions. I unfortanately had to realize the consequences before I woke up. I lost the one person whom I truely loved, our marriage is now over. I hurt her so much. I have alot of anger and guilt for the things I have done. I pray it does not take this to get through to your husband. Does he know that you are contemplating divorce?
There are many ways to open his eyes. 1. give him the DR book and ask him to read it - the title should say it all "Divorce Remedy" 2. Keep your distance 3. Work on yourself, your H will see you moving on and this may wake him up.
Some things I wish my W had done: Tell me: "If we dont start working on our relationship, we are headed for a divorce" I wish she had conveyed her feelings to a mutual friend, while this may have humilated me, I would rather have know how serious the situation was Vs. Divorce. We both have a mutual friend which would had called me and told me to start getting serious about my relationship. I wish she had insisted on counseling I wish she had given me DR and asked me to read it. My W is a wonderfull woman, all I fault her for is enabling me, she and I both wish she would have stood up for more than she did. She let me get away with too much, this in no way excuses my behavior, however it made it easier for me to continue down the wrong path. Divorce is such a trajedy, such a senseless trajedy. I have 2 and 4 year old boys whom I feel I have let down in the worst way. XW and I still see each other, talk and joke. We are the exception to the norm. I still have hopes for us and our family.
I don't know if anything will soften my heart. Some days I feel like I am just ready to move on. Mainly b/c this is try #5 for me. I do realize that it is only try #1 for H.
I had a talk w/ my mom this weekend. She said I should NOT try to force a decision - that one day it will just come to me. That right now I am just struggling b/c of all the hurt, b/c I have Hope, b/c he says what I want to hear, etc. She said to hang tough b/c as the hurt heals; I will know just know without a doubt what the right decision for me is. She also said she hates to see me hurting. I don't really think it's hurt anymore. I think it's sadness. I am sad b/c deep down I know it's over.
I am so glad I could help others. Sometimes I think if H heard this from someone else or if he would find the various M saving websites and read through things; he might understand....but then reality sets in and I know the truth.
A few months ago, I was talking to a friend, who said that they wanted to smack him upside the head and set him straight. I told this friend to go ahead - talk to him. I said that I don't keep anything from him, so feel free to repeat anything I have said, etc. Well, later that evening I got a call from my friend. She was just a frustrated as I was after talking to my H. She said he was like a brick wall. He got defensive and wasn't listening to her either.
I don't know if I can continue to do this. It's so hard on me emotionally. I continue hanging on by a thread; I get just enough from him to have HOPE and then that hope is shattered again and again.
The whole process just makes me lose HOPE and wish it was over, so that I could finally move on.
I have to agree with your Mom. Smart lady. I am not saying that you should stay in your M or not, but when you are giving it time like this, the right decision will come to you. I do feel for you. Having someone verbally smack your H upside the head, and it still not sink in, I don't even know what to say. My W and Mom are close. My Mom also tried to verbally smack me upside the head, and I did not get it until now, so maybe there is some hope for your H, it just may be too late in your eyes even if he does come around. It makes me sad just reading your sitch, since I see so many similarities to my own. I am trying to change so hard, and it just may be too late for my W. Now I just have to work on me and worry about her and my children's happiness. Since you said your H is saying all the right things, or at least some of the right things, maybe he really is doing all that he knows right now. That is progress. But, if it is the same things he was doing the other 4 times as well, then I don't know. I wish I could smack him upside the head, and then have him smack me upside the head. Might do us both some good.
You are a good person. Everything you have said to everyone here on the board speaks volumes about you. I breaks my heart to think that your H could drive away someone who is so genuine and good. It lowers my expectations of my own M. I almost don't know how to show the changes I am working on to my W, and if it would do any good at this point if she even noticed. I am very humbled right now, and your H should be as well. It almost feels wierd in that I almost feel like begging for him, how attractive huh? I hope this is just a blue day for you, and you are feeling better about your M tomorrow. Please keep letting us know how it goes.
Quote: I wish I could smack him upside the head, and then have him smack me upside the head. Might do us both some good.
Thanks for the compliments! You are a great sounding board...for everything. It breaks my heart, too, but I try to look at it positively. All the hard times with him will make me really appreciate the small, little, positive times in a new and different R; whether w/ H or someone else.
Trust me, your W will see the changes; no matter how small. It just may take a little time. I also want to tell you that although we have similar sitch's - this is the first time your W has asked for a separation; not the 5th. Keep your chin up. Do not lower your M expectations. I once read somewhere that if we expect failure, we get failure, but if we expect winning, we become winners. I would like to see you become a winner.
As for me, I am just going to take it one day at a time. Eventually, I will know the right decision.
Michelle - Well, I don't have a lot of advice to give, as I am sitting on the other side of the fence. However, I do want to thank you for continuing to post and share your feelings. So many of the things you say I have heard from my W. Heard, but I am not sure I understood as well as when you say them here. When you talked about not being hurt but sad - that really hit home.
I do wish the best for you and your H. I hope you can find some of the feeling you had for him. But it gives me hope that you want to.
I do realize that it is only try #1 for H. 