I honestly dont think she is having an affair. Unless she is really good at doing it while I'm at work and she is at home. She doesnt go out anywhere. She suffers major panic attacks so she is always home. I guess its possible that maybe someone comes over during the day, but I work locally and come home from time to time and I just dont think she would do that. Once again, I could be wrong, but I really dont think she is having affair. As far as moving out, I guess it was always assumed since she told me she wanted divorce that I would move since I'm the one working and she doesnt drive. I guess I always agreed maybe thinking I would be the nice one, I dont want to be selfish, and I do feel responsible for this mess from my EA years back. I caused this, so I should be the one who pays for my choices and mistakes.
Is that the general opinion though? That she is having affair of her own? I must also say, not downplaying my EA. This was done via text to someone I never met, and I was never emotionally involved. Hate to admit, it was mostly sexting someone I never saw or met. I know it doesn't paint a good picture of me. I never ever would have acted out on any of that. Stupid fantasy I had going on in my head.
Is that the general opinion though? That she is having affair of her own? I must also say, not downplaying my EA. This was done via text to someone I never met, and I was never emotionally involved. Hate to admit, it was mostly sexting someone I never saw or met. I know it doesn't paint a good picture of me. I never ever would have acted out on any of that. Stupid fantasy I had going on in my head.
Well there's 3 types of affairs- PA (physical), EA (emotional) and IA (imaginary). WAS's are always engaging in one of those. If she is staying married to you but doesn't consider you together then she's just biding her time until "someone better comes along". But she's not motivated to divorce, or separate, or actually look for that "better" person so she's content to just sit it out at home. Sometimes these type of "lazy WAS's" will continue having sex and sometimes they won't. But it can be enormously frustrating for the LBS because these "lazy" ones will stay at home forever and never make a move to change anything. Often it's the LBS that finally gets tired of the limbo and leaves. You might pick up Michele's book "The Sex-Staved Marriage", I've never read it myself but I understand it's helpful for people in situations like yours.
Just to clarify a little about what we mean by IA, the WAS imagines a knight in shining armor is going to arrive and sweep her off her feet and have toe-curling sex with her. Sometimes this knight is someone they know that doesn't actually return the interest (could be a coworker or even a celebrity or sports figure) and sometimes it's just a figure they've dreamt up. But you can imagine how hard it is for a LBS to compete with an imaginary OM because the WAS can imagine him to be as perfect as she wants. Sometimes they quit having sex with their H because they picture themselves as saving themselves for that imaginary OM.
Just to clarify a little about what we mean by IA, the WAS imagines a knight in shining armor is going to arrive and sweep her off her feet and have toe-curling sex with her. Sometimes this knight is someone they know that doesn't actually return the interest (could be a coworker or even a celebrity or sports figure) and sometimes it's just a figure they've dreamt up. But you can imagine how hard it is for a LBS to compete with an imaginary OM because the WAS can imagine him to be as perfect as she wants. Sometimes they quit having sex with their H because they picture themselves as saving themselves for that imaginary OM.
Or they read romance novels and fall in love with the hero of the novel.
For some reason, she still seems to hold onto my EA that I had. Is 4 years still normal to hold onto this? She is very admiring that she wants a divorce because of what happened years ago. I still feel awful with what I did to her. I just dont know how much more I can show her how sorry I am. I dont know what else I can do. But she loves to make me feel bad still over what I did. She always brings it up and throws it in my face. But I did do it and she has every right to make me eat it and live with it.
For some reason, she still seems to hold onto my EA that I had. Is 4 years still normal to hold onto this? She is very admiring that she wants a divorce because of what happened years ago. I still feel awful with what I did to her. I just dont know how much more I can show her how sorry I am. I dont know what else I can do. But she loves to make me feel bad still over what I did. She always brings it up and throws it in my face. But I did do it and she has every right to make me eat it and live with it.
Sad_lost,
Some advice from my struggles apologizing to my wife - not for an EA, but for some emotionally abusive things that I did. I apologize =) in advance if any of this sounds harsh, it is not meant that way. I made mistakes when I first tried to apologize. Read up on ways to apologize online. In my case I also read books about emotional abuse.
1. You have to let go of outcomes. True apologies do not insist on forgiveness, or expect anyone to eventually get over it. Accept the consequences.
2. Do you believe you have addressed the underlying issues that drove you to have the EA?
3. Have you forgiven yourself? I believe you cannot expect forgiveness from another person if you haven't forgiven yourself.
4. There is a huge difference between remorse and feeling awful/ashamed/bad. Feeling awful or ashamed is hiding from what you did, and it is making the apology about YOU instead of the offended person. True remorse means accepting that you are not a bad person, but you made bad decisions. You own the responsibility for what you did. You express regret. You address why you made those decisions, and take actions so that the offended person understands you won't ever do that to them again. You put yourself in your W's shoes, ask how she felt, really try to understand the complexity of her emotions and why she feels that way. Empathize. Validate. If she hasn't told you, imagine how she must feel. Explain that you understand there are consequences for what you did, and you accept them no questions asked... And at the end of the day, your apology may fall on deaf ears.
I'm in a similar position. I've written apology letters and e-mails (she refuses to talk outside of MC about these things), and asked her to share her feelings so I could empathize more. And... I'm shut out, and she's preparing a BD.
Does she have every right to make you eat it? I'm not sure about that. I don't think anyone should accept being miserable the rest of their life. It just sounds like something has to change in your R. Either your W has to reach some point where she forgives you (which you can't control), or you may have to move on for your own well-being and happiness.
Sorry that you are here, but this is a wonderful community that can help you get through this and come out the other side stronger. People might say things that you don't want to hear, but listen as closely as you can. There is a wealth of experience that people here can draw on.
I can't comment about how long it takes to move past an EA. I have no idea, and imagine that it would vary greatly according to the situation and people involved. What I do know is that you have to let her go on her own path. Nothing you say or do right now is going to change her heart. Only she can do that. You have to focus on a) giving her the time and space that she needs and b) working on yourself to become the best person that you can be.
W 34 Me 42 Married 7 years together 8 0 kids 1 beloved dog BD 4/6/2018 I moved out 4/7/2018 I moved back in alone 8/05/2018 I file 3/06/2019 D official 5/7/2019
I thank everyone for their kind words. As far as forgiving myself for what I have done, I dont know if I ever can. I have moved past it, I have accepted what I have done, I have come to terms with what I have done, but I'm not sure if I can forgive myself for it. I took the easy way out 4 years ago and did not think of the consequences. I was selfish. I was wrong. It was a hard lesson to learn. I made a bad choice, but I have to move on from that and learn from it. I hope it made me a better person. As far as me trying to move on past my wife, it's hard. Its hard when she tells me she hates what I did to her, she tells me she cant wait for me to move, then next day she is laying on couch with me rubbing my knee and hand while watching a movie. Or when she makes plans for future dates and includes me in those plans. It's just confusing to me. If she moved on from me, if she doesnt love me, how does she still do these things?
The mixed messages from your wife are confusing. I have no idea what to say. I'm about 2 months into realizing how bad things are in my sitch, and I've been up and down on that roller coaster trying to interpret my W's actions and words.
What helps me sometimes is to consider all possibilities, and realize how it's impossible to narrow it down to the right choice. For instance, last night she was friendly, and brought me a snack. This could mean:
A. She wants to reconcile! B. She's only being friendly so I don't act crazy when she BDs me! C. She would do the same to a friend, I am in the FriendZone. D. She wants to maintain a friendship post-D as we have to co-parent. .... on and on
Even more, understand she is human, and probably experiencing her own wild emotional swings - hence the saying believe only half of what they do (which half? I don't know..) So on any given day her actions may change, just on a whim.
For the self-forgiveness part, again I can share my personal experience to date. Two months ago I realized my M was on the rocks, and I pulled the car over histrionically demanding my W talk to me (she was giving the silent treatment). She was frightened for her safety. This was emotionally abusive and wrong, I accept that.
I am learning and recognizing now the underlying attitudes and thoughts that drove me to pull over. First, I should have not acted on these thoughts. Impulse control. Second, the thoughts and attitudes themselves are extremely unhealthy. My fear of abandonment and losing the M is what, ironically, may have destroyed my M. I recognize the underlying anger and self-pity and passive-aggressiveness in the way I was thinking. Am I cured? Absolutely not. Do I hope that this understanding will lead me to make healthier choices going forward? Yes. At some point, I hope I can look back and both accept what I did was wrong (the easy part) and also forgive myself because I know to my very core that I would not make that same choice again (the hard part).
I also know my W may never forgive me. I haven't specifically asked for forgiveness yet, I feel like I need to forgive myself first.
That's a long-winded way of saying -- I think self-forgiveness may happen when you reach a point where you know in your heart that you would not make that same choice again. Not because you now know the consequences, but because you have fundamentally changed. You wouldn't do it even if nobody every found out.
