Not Sure Where This Is Going

[Niall11]

10 days W has slept in the living room. Yesterday we had house painters working on the outside of our building. She came home from work mad about traffic and decided paint fumes were no good for D2 and too cold to open windows. They both spent the night at her parents' place. I got together with my friends next door.

W is off from work next week and has multiple things planned with D2 to which I apparently am not invited. This is not how I want to live. Trying to ride it out and focus on what I must, but part of me wants it to get better or just end.

I spoke to my uncle for his birthday. A few years ago he stayed with us for a while. He said he heard we are having trouble and that the idea I was controlling toward her was laughable, that she has many good qualities but is the most controlling person he knows. It helped somewhat to be reassured I'm not remembering everything wrong.

[Niall11]

Journaling here a bit because it's somewhat cathartic. I've had all sorts of thoughts the past few days but they escape me now. Mostly about how we got here and the unhealthy patterns, etc. How she came to see me as both a resented parental figure and a second child, etc.

W is on vacation this week and originally had all sorts of plans to do things with our D2. I was not included in any of these plans, which still stings a bit. Last year we all took a short trip as a family over the April break. To my chagrin but not my surprise, D2 now has been dropped from a number of W's plans, although W did spend a lot of time with D2 over the weekend and brought her to a BBQ yesterday morning that she originally didn't plan to bring her to.

Friday W had a drink with coworkers when they got out but was home by 6 or so. We put D2 to bed together.

Saturday she ran errands in the morning with D2, went to help her sister decorate a new place without D2, and stayed out most of the day. I took D2 to the park during the day. To my surprise, instead of just going home, W met us at the park. I was supposed to go to a playoff hockey game but my ticket fell through, so I went out with a friend in the evening.

Sunday W took D2 out during the day and went to a dinner/ Game of Thrones party in the evening. I went for a hike and watched a small road race near our house.

Yesterday (Monday) was a holiday here. W took D2 to the BBQ early, went to her parents' for several hours, then went out to her now-regular dance class with potential OW2 (more on that below). I went with my friend next door to watch a big event happening right near our house and we had a couple of beers. I was on kid duty from dinnertime on.

This morning I had client and networking meetings. W took D2 to a museum in town, met up with a coworker whose daughter is the same age and will be in our D2's class at preschool in the fall. Apparently they got along really well, which is great since D2 really hasn't been around enough kids her own age. W dropped D2 off with me and went off to see a movie with yet another friend. She mentioned something about trivia night tonight but I reminded her that we made a schedule and Tuesday is my night and I have plans with a friend.

Tomorrow she's got a mystery plan from 10 to 1 (in my experience things that go on the calendar with no info beyond a time involve not OW2 but my W's BFF, whom she knows I don't like these days). It was marked as "Mom + D2," but D2 has to be at the pediatrician at 1. So W is using that as her excuse for not taking D2 to her morning thing. And for asking me to handle the doctor's visit.

Thursday was on the calendar as "W-day trip with D2." She claimed her plan was to take D2 to a zoo about an hour away. I think it would be fine. Now she's saying that D2 doesn't do well with long car rides. So I said, "Do something with her closer to here." W said, "Well, I want to go far enough away from here that I feel like I had at least one day of real vacation." And apparently that means more than spending time with D2.

She tells me that, if I think D2 will be OK driving to that zoo, I should take her. I wouldn't hesitate to but, alas, I have other responsibilities on Thursday. My W thinks that, because I work mostly from home with odd hours, that I don't do anything. So W now plans to leave D2 with her mom on Thursday and drive off to do whatever she wants. Before this time frame I'd be fine with that. But under the current circumstances it seems sad and selfish.

An older couple we know invited both of us to a jazz concert next week and, to my surprise, W accepted. I have, from my POV, stopped pursuing W long ago, so I wasn't going to mention this invite. Just see how she handled it. This morning she asked me and I said it sounded like fun. She immediately wrote and told them yes. We'll see how that goes.

I will say that, as I've stopped pursuing (I let her come to me on virtually everything beyond saying, "Good morning") she has not started to chase me at all. Her attitude toward me these days (admittedly speculating because I'm not a mindreader) seems to swing between, "I've wasted enough time worrying about him and I don't care," and "I want to enjoy my life independently and I hope he will too." She's not erratic, moody, all over the place. She is pretty selfish and determined to accept as many invitations as possible.

Interesting news on OW2 front. Someone I know just told me that, a couple of weeks ago, W and her potential OW2 were at an LGBT dance event in the city. OW2 apparently kissed someone else there and seemed to be trying to help W meet people, which was a surprise to my old friend who didn't know about any of our issues. So perhaps OW2 is not hooking up with my W, but if W's not cheating it's for lack of opportunity, not lack of desire. Kind of the same difference. Not really a surprise at this point but still disappointing.

For whatever reason, when I think of this fall I still can't come to terms with the idea of potentially not living with W and D2 all together. I still see all of this as so unnecessary. I've always been the kind of person to want to talk out difference and reach an understanding. DB principles make sense, I understand that we're past the point of talking it out easily, but still hard for me to accept that.

I've felt a lot like she's been having much more fun than I am. I always had friends and was active. Lately a lot of my friends are busy and not up for meeting up much. I asked 8 or 10 old friends and relatives to describe me in one word the past couple of years. I got things "preoccupied," "withdrawn," "worried." A lot of people close to me going through really tough times, my dad has been sick, people dying, and I've had a lot on my mind. W has checked out on all of that.

W now has some new, young friends not dealing with such heaviness and is regularly invited to all sorts of fun activities. I have to push aside being a little jealous about her new social life, and resentful that it wasn't necessary to combine it with completely casting me aside. I was paid on a biggish project and we got a decent tax refund, so I'm less worried about cash flow and will start to push outside my comfort zone more.

Long, long post and I don't expect anyone to read it all but it's helpful to get some thoughts out.

[Ready2Change]

Journaling here a bit because it's somewhat cathartic....Long, long post and I don't expect anyone to read it all but it's helpful to get some thoughts out.

Always helps getiing it out of your head. I skimmed it. Let us know if we can help.

[IHCLACS]

I read it and I hear you, having it sting when the W is out with the children and taking pictures. Mine is in the same boat that selfishly going independent and having more fun than I am. My w doesn't seem like the type of person to rub it in people's faces, but today she went to the beach with MIL. She took pictures of S1 while I was at work. She did invite me and asked me about it several weeks ago, but I declined because I have to work. She never told me the actual day or that she was going today .They went to the Tiki Bar, a place I introduced my Wto many years ago. I don't know if she's just being a good parent and sending me pictures of S1, or she's on intentionally trying to rub it in my face saying hey look what you missed. Either way it makes me sad and I need to get over it. I'll schedule and sometime on my weekend to take him out to a place myself. It's amazing how they project onto us about us being selfish. But they can't see their own actions. Just tired of it, tired of the blame shifting tired of the resentments especially the parental ones. My wife's latest pathetic excuses that she couldn't do the bariatric surgery to lose weight after she flip-flopped on it four times because she couldn't trust me for a month to take care of S1. So I'm to blame for everything that's wrong in her life. Her latest Facebook post really crack me up but I'm not going to respond to any of it for her text messages unless it's an emergency. Time to detach some more and do me.

[Niall11]

Journaling here a bit because it's somewhat cathartic....Long, long post and I don't expect anyone to read it all but it's helpful to get some thoughts out.

Always helps getiing it out of your head. I skimmed it. Let us know if we can help.

Thanks. Not sure except if someone can give me the magic formula for truly GAL and detaching. She, and the overall situation, are in my head way too much. I'm still hurt every time she heads out to some social function we would have attended together at any time from 2009 to last fall.

[Niall11]

I read it and I hear you, having it sting when the W is out with the children and taking pictures. Mine is in the same boat that selfishly going independent and having more fun than I am. My w doesn't seem like the type of person to rub it in people's faces, but today she went to the beach with MIL. She took pictures of S1 while I was at work. She did invite me and asked me about it several weeks ago, but I declined because I have to work. She never told me the actual day or that she was going today .They went to the Tiki Bar, a place I introduced my Wto many years ago. I don't know if she's just being a good parent and sending me pictures of S1, or she's on intentionally trying to rub it in my face saying hey look what you missed.

Thanks for reading.

It is hard to tell sometimes. Try to go with she's just sending you photos of your son. I take a ton of photos of my kid, so when W takes her somewhere without me I'll ask her to take some and send to me. Since I asked, it doesn't seem like she's rubbing my nose in it by sending the photos. Although she does seem like she's rubbing my nose in it by going out as much as she does.

10 years ago she said all she wanted was me. Now she's decided that she wasted her 20s being bored with our life and, at 32 with a toddler, is going to do all the single 20-something things she missed out on. Of course she wasn't bored at the time and we've done a lot of great things together. I just find the idea that she can only go have fun if I'm not included, ever, extreme. She has acknowledged as much.

It's amazing how they project onto us about us being selfish. But they can't see their own actions. Just tired of it, tired of the blame shifting tired of the resentments especially the parental ones. My wife's latest pathetic excuses that she couldn't do the bariatric surgery to lose weight after she flip-flopped on it four times because she couldn't trust me for a month to take care of S1. So I'm to blame for everything that's wrong in her life. Her latest Facebook post really crack me up but I'm not going to respond to any of it for her text messages unless it's an emergency.

My D2 is a lousy sleeper. For a long time, if anyone else tried to put her to bed, she'd scream for Mommy. My W felt like she could never go out in the evening, with or without me. Last summer she'd meet friends but be home by 8 for bedtime. And she really resented it. Her friends were late 20s, no kids. Last fall, ironically right around the time she started stonewalling me and wanting out, I took over bedtime duties. Now she can go out without that worry and she sure has been taking advantage of it. I had to insist on a schedule where I get my days too. Sad to me that D2 now has only one of us home in the evenings most days, but I didn't create this situation, I don't want it, and I need to get out of the house for my own sake.

I was probably not the best partner or dad my D2's first 2 years. I tried but I could have done much more. These days I think I'm much better and W, who was a great mom, is dropping the ball big time. But in her narrative she's still Supermom and I'm useless.

Either way it makes me sad and I need to get over it. I'll schedule and sometime on my weekend to take him out to a place myself.

Time to detach some more and do me.

Yep. That's the way. Easier said than done, at least for me. Good luck!

[IHCLACS]

Me too Naill11 2009 to last fall. You have to constantly keep reminding yourself that this isn't the same person from last fall. They have all this pent-up resentments, blame shifting, and projection, as if we are sure fire cause why they are unhappy. They're gravitating like you said towards their own independence and saying the hell with the LBS. People here have said it time and time again and it's exactly what are WAS doing, focusing on themselves. We need to focus on ourselves and the time we spend with our children. Maybe im right, maybe im wrong for thinking this way, but the more we involve ourselves independently away from them and the more we involve ourselves with our children maybe they'll wake up and realize what they're missing instead of us?

[sandi2]

How she came to see me as both a resented parental figure and a second child, etc.

How did you see it?

W is on vacation this week and originally had all sorts of plans to do things with our D2. I was not included in any of these plans, which still stings a bit. Last year we all took a short trip as a family over the April break. To my chagrin but not my surprise, D2 now has been dropped from a number of W's plans, although W did spend a lot of time with D2 over the weekend and brought her to a BBQ yesterday morning that she originally didn't plan to bring her to.

Niall, your W is shutting you out of her life. This is just the beginning.

I was supposed to go to a playoff hockey game but my ticket fell through, so I went out with a friend in the evening.

Great!

W dropped D2 off with me and went off to see a movie with yet another friend. She mentioned something about trivia night tonight but I reminded her that we made a schedule and Tuesday is my night and I have plans with a friend.

Did she follow the schedule, or did she ignore it and go be with her friend?

As much activity your W does, I'm wondering who does the work around the house. Who actually takes care D2? Frankly, I am suspicious of all these times she's suppose to be out with D2. To me, it sounds as if she could be using this as her cover for being with other women. That's just my 2 cents based on the wayward W behavior. I mean, she may have the child with her, IDK, but I think she's blowing smoke up your a$$ for the most part.

She has found a new playground with women who want to participate. I don't know what you think is going to happen. Do you think this will just wear off and she'll stop her pursuit with same sex partners?

Do you have a plan of action?

[Niall11]

Me too Naill11 2009 to last fall. You have to constantly keep reminding yourself that this isn't the same person from last fall. They have all this pent-up resentments, blame shifting, and projection, as if we are sure fire cause why they are unhappy. They're gravitating like you said towards their own independence and saying the hell with the LBS. People here have said it time and time again and it's exactly what are WAS doing, focusing on themselves. We need to focus on ourselves and the time we spend with our children. Maybe im right, maybe im wrong for thinking this way, but the more we involve ourselves independently away from them and the more we involve ourselves with our children maybe they'll wake up and realize what they're missing instead of us?

Yeah, there were signs. She said a few times over the past couple years (really, since having our D2) that she didn't know who she was anymore. She decided that she had spent all her time worrying about everyone else (D2, her parents, sister, students, friends, me, since revised to be just me) and it was time to worry about herself. Figure out what made her happy and do it, whether I liked it or not. Especially if I didn't like it. She freely admits that she's become (her words) selfish, cold, hard. She's proud of it, like that equates to strength.

I don't know if she'll wake up and see me in a better light. But we have to develop independence to be ready for either a healthier MR or the very real possibility of divorce. Regardless of outcome it's what we have to do.

[Niall11]

Sandi, thanks for checking in. Up higher in the thread were responses to some questions you asked me a week or two back. Answers to these questions are here.

How she came to see me as both a resented parental figure and a second child, etc.

How did you see it?

Complicated. When we got together I was 33, she was 22. English not her first language. She was in a new city, knew nobody except me and her uncle (who's my old friend). I'd lived there for 15 years. Economy was awful in 2009 and she couldn't find work. I had a very high-paying job at the time. She came to live in my place and had no role in the finances at all for years, I paid for everything. Now things are different.

Where we live now I'd also lived before (grew up near here) and knew my way around. She was always getting lost. I fell into the pattern of helping her edit her grad school papers, etc. So I did a lot of taking care of her and, although I admired her abilities and accomplishments, I probably still felt like I needed to do certain things for her. I still handle the bills, etc.

I came to learn that she resented this, saw things I considered helpful as controlling. Like I thought she couldn't handle things herself. The past couple years I've been worried about money a lot, especially since having a child. I was pretty depressed and distracted. Didn't do enough around the house. She deeply resented that, in her mind, I was thinking of her as a dumb child while she saw herself as having come into her own and me as stagnating. I don't think it's totally accurate but that doesn't matter...

W is on vacation this week and originally had all sorts of plans to do things with our D2. I was not included in any of these plans, which still stings a bit. Last year we all took a short trip as a family over the April break. To my chagrin but not my surprise, D2 now has been dropped from a number of W's plans, although W did spend a lot of time with D2 over the weekend and brought her to a BBQ yesterday morning that she originally didn't plan to bring her to.

Niall, your W is shutting you out of her life. This is just the beginning.

Yes, I see that. I had hoped she needed to establish SOME independence from me but she seems determined to have total independence.

I was supposed to go to a playoff hockey game but my ticket fell through, so I went out with a friend in the evening.

Great!

Yeah, there was no way I was staying home that night. I needed to get out in the world.

W dropped D2 off with me and went off to see a movie with yet another friend. She mentioned something about trivia night tonight but I reminded her that we made a schedule and Tuesday is my night and I have plans with a friend.

Did she follow the schedule, or did she ignore it and go be with her friend?

Normally she's at work until 4 or 5 and the schedule is for the evenings. This week she's off from work and is doing things during the daytime. She casually mentioned this trivia thing after her afternoon movie, which would have gone against the schedule and I said I already have plans and Tuesday is my night.

As much activity your W does, I'm wondering who does the work around the house. Who actually takes care D2? Frankly, I am suspicious of all these times she's suppose to be out with D2. To me, it sounds as if she could be using this as her cover for being with other women. That's just my 2 cents based on the wayward W behavior. I mean, she may have the child with her, IDK, but I think she's blowing smoke up your a$$ for the most part.

She has found a new playground with women who want to participate. I don't know what you think is going to happen. Do you think this will just wear off and she'll stop her pursuit with same sex partners?

Do you have a plan of action?

We both do a fair amount around the house. I do it more regularly in short bursts, she tends to spend like 6 hours straight on a Saturday cleaning up and doing laundry. I do feel like these days, when she's home, she's on the phone and not as engaged with D2 as she used to be. I try to pick up the slack and be a great dad.

Of all the things I think she's guilty of, trying to have affairs with D2 around is not really among them. She hasn't been out with D2 all that much lately and I know where they've been. Over the weekend she was with her parents, who adore D2. Supermarket, garden store, Target, oil change, helping her sister move out.

Yesterday she took D2 to a BBQ hosted by her female friend's parents. This friend is married happily to a man and I know them. In years past I've gone to this event. She didn't want me there this time. Today she met a coworker, also a woman married to a man, and her D3 at the museum. I dropped them off and picked them up, they posted photos. This girl will be in D2's class in the fall.

This is what I know at this moment: She has four new friends from her new job that she sees socially. Three are heterosexual and married, the one from this morning has the kid my kid's age. The fourth is a gay woman and they go to these dance parties. I suspected the affair was there but, based on drips and drabs of info, it may not be an affair.

There is no doubt that she WANTS to start some sort of relationship with a woman right now, but no real evidence that she's found any willing participant. There's also no doubt that, at the moment, she doesn't want a sexual relationship or to do much of anything at all with me.

I don't know what I think. She obviously got to a point of deep anger about me and the MR, and this is where she's at right now. I never would have thought her capable of it before, and I don't know if it's always going to be like this or if, at some point, she'll realize that being a divorced mom trying to act like a teenager is not going to be all that.

Plan of action? Trying to improve my income to be better positioned to live around here separate from her if (when) it comes to that. In the meantime genuinely trying to 180 (going pretty well), GAL (going not as well but getting better), and detach (I'm having a very hard time with it).