I think its good for her to see the possibilities and you creating new life/friends--some female
I don't think many of us have taken that route, and most of us here also lost our spouses every MLCer is a bit different
I don't think any strategy can really bring them through the crises but you are taking care of yourself and seeing possible new directions for yourself-so I will be curious to see the outcome and how she handles it-
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
Its unfortunate but she will need to face those fears that have stunted her spiritual/emotional maturity before she can recognize what she is doing to her future with you. Of course I am speaking from my own MCL experience and maybe others are different. From my experience I still loved my H but it was like I was detached from it, like it was in my hand not my heart. I did notice him and the positive and negative things he did, even if I reacted in a different way at times. I would call my behaviour like acting out/rebellion based on how I felt inside. I was mean to him because inside I knew it was safe to be, that he wouldn't leave me and would forgive me. I think on some level I thought I could do anything and he would forgive me. Is that feeling entitled? That was me. I didn't want to lose him but I also felt really angry with him for holding me back in life, even though it wasn't actually the reality just my reasoning at the time, I was attracted to him at times and then on a flip of a dime I was repulsed by him. Its really internal conflicting. If you can see it from the inside its easier to not be taking it personally. It literally is about them and not you.
To me you sound like you are taking things from an objective level even though it can appear subjective. Its that uncertainty and not knowing when it will finally end that is the hardest for me with my H crisis. (From the other side of the crisis I can say I didn't know myself how long it would take either while in that fog.)
If its any consolation I wasn't really aware of my behaviour and its impact until after the fog lifted. I was pretty confused though at the time I didn't realize it. Even though I acted and said I wanted a divorce, when it came down to it I never really did and wasn't aware completely of the impact of those statements or of the outcome if it were to happen because even though I said it and in a way wanted it so I would feel less pressure from everywhere, on a subconscious level I never believed it was real or could ever be real. If that makes sense.
Going out and taking time for yourself is a good idea. Take care of yourself and try to get that much needed attention on a platonic level so you don't get sucked into temptation when you are now vulnerable. Again just my thoughts.
Watching the sky for the space shuttle return...relief, lights at last BD May/12 (37, H41- D18 D13 S11) July 2012 ILYBNILY reconcile oct/12 no AP 2nd BD Jan/18 start again Original AP
Yea it hurts her to see you getting attention, but no regard for you when the OM is in the picture. That's the fun of MLC... whats good for them is not for us, unless of course they tell us it is and then we still aren't supposed to do it because they are testing us or using it to justify their poor behaviour. Mind games and mind games.
I can just imagine the feeling of every corner there being the nurses, one shot of it would have been a bit funny if it were me to be honest, but every turn in the evening I don't know for you but for me, I would've thought...seriously? Like Im trying to have a good time and keep the peace here....why.
Love the comment " I have friends and don't need to find anyone"
Im thinking it is her low self esteem and guilt beating her down, not you or anything you are doing. If she is bothered by the nurses then maybe she has been afraid of losing you to begin with, like maybe abandonment is a root issue for her. Maybe she knows she messed up and needs time to figure out what direction she wants to go in life in general.
I know for myself I had to accept things in my MLC; once I did the fog lifted fast, I accepted things and then felt it lift, the clarity was surreal. I remember it like this... One day I was a real Bee* to my H. I had this thing I would do where I would throw his blanket on the bedroom floor and say to myself how much I didnt want him to sleep with me and laugh to myself when he would come in and pick it up. Pretty childish tbh. This day he came in and saw it and was annoyed, he said Im starting to think this is on purpose and said he had it with me, and well...he meant it. When he left the room I laughed to myself but I also thought about it. He was genuinely angry and it was at that moment I realized maybe he would leave me. The next day I thought, alot.... I was looking out my bedroom window, sitting with my legs crossed on my bed. I was very obsessed during my crisis with my Papa who had passed when I was 4 years old, I would talk to him and sing to him nearly daily. While I sat there I talked to him, I sang him a song and said goodbye to him and told him how much I loved him and missed him. I thought about my health and accepted that things will be how they will and that I would be ok no matter what because I had a great support system and would always be ok, maybe not rich but always ok. I could feel myself almost as though I was a little girl, for a few minutes I actually felt like I did when I was very young, it was strange and then I felt the love I had for my husband in my hand...I took my hand and put it up to my chest, I literally felt the love fill inside me and I knew I loved him and wanted to be with him. It was very strange and most people would think I was crazy to tell them this. But this is an experience I had in my own MLC.
Listen to the things she refers to , like work and stuff like that. There may be some meaning behind it, a fear or issue. People say don't do that because it will make you crazy but if your situation is like ours its a bit different than a spouse who is still in heavy replay with crazy in their eyes. If she is like I was she will realize things and remember her love for you once her acceptance comes. She is very lucky to have you being patient and understanding. If she doesn't realize it now, sooner or later she will. Hopefully for her and the future of your family she realizes your value and clears her mind before you give up and cave to attention from other women. Its very lonely being a LBS, being rejected, walking on egg shells and knowing you are wasting away while they brood or "run". Its exhausting really and we need attention and affection too. But, for me I don't want attention from others at the expense of my marriage if it can be repaired.
You are strong and patient. Just try to keep focused, it isnt an easy task. If you want your marriage intact once her Crisis is over try not to fall for temptation it will just make it harder to repair things after, its enough with their damage. My opinion anyway.
I noticed some of these behaviors early on. I took a nurse friend out shopping (for me). I changed my wardrobe style a bit because I had only my "dad clothes" like baggy jeans and old shorts. I came downstairs one day and she noticed how thin I was and how neat I looked. She immediately started crying for about 30 minutes. Once after a talk with my attorney she was frightened I would take the kids and she had an emotional breakdown and stood behind my car so I couldn't leave the house. She also told me a number of times how her biggest fear was that I would give up on her. She initially refused IC but on her own accord accepted she needs it and continues to go (consistently for 2 months now). She was never a heavy smoker but did daily for the past few months. She quit last week and no longer wants to. She barely drinks wine now, which was a daily thing for 3 years (and heavy for the past 3 months). I keep thinking she'll ask me to leave the bedroom but refills my soap dispenser and puts new toothpaste in my drawer, and does my laundry. In September she said it wasn't entirely my fault and she played a big role in it. The EA is over and there is no communication. She knows she's depressed and asked me for help.
These are some of the little bits that give me hope she is crawling out of it.
The harsh daily daggers have stopped but I continue to deflect and give empathetic statements when applicable. I no longer say ILY but there are so many times I want to.
I noticed some of these behaviors early on. I took a nurse friend out shopping (for me). I changed my wardrobe style a bit because I had only my "dad clothes" like baggy jeans and old shorts. I came downstairs one day and she noticed how thin I was and how neat I looked. She immediately started crying for about 30 minutes. Once after a talk with my attorney she was frightened I would take the kids and she had an emotional breakdown and stood behind my car so I couldn't leave the house. She also told me a number of times how her biggest fear was that I would give up on her. She initially refused IC but on her own accord accepted she needs it and continues to go (consistently for 2 months now). She was never a heavy smoker but did daily for the past few months. She quit last week and no longer wants to. She barely drinks wine now, which was a daily thing for 3 years (and heavy for the past 3 months). I keep thinking she'll ask me to leave the bedroom but refills my soap dispenser and puts new toothpaste in my drawer, and does my laundry. In September she said it wasn't entirely my fault and she played a big role in it. The EA is over and there is no communication. She knows she's depressed and asked me for help.
These are some of the little bits that give me hope she is crawling out of it.
The harsh daily daggers have stopped but I continue to deflect and give empathetic statements when applicable. I no longer say ILY but there are so many times I want to. [/quote]
Watching the sky for the space shuttle return...relief, lights at last BD May/12 (37, H41- D18 D13 S11) July 2012 ILYBNILY reconcile oct/12 no AP 2nd BD Jan/18 start again Original AP
[/quote]I noticed some of these behaviors early on. I took a nurse friend out shopping (for me). I changed my wardrobe style a bit because I had only my "dad clothes" like baggy jeans and old shorts. I came downstairs one day and she noticed how thin I was and how neat I looked. She immediately started crying for about 30 minutes. Once after a talk with my attorney she was frightened I would take the kids and she had an emotional breakdown and stood behind my car so I couldn't leave the house. She also told me a number of times how her biggest fear was that I would give up on her. She initially refused IC but on her own accord accepted she needs it and continues to go (consistently for 2 months now). She was never a heavy smoker but did daily for the past few months. She quit last week and no longer wants to. She barely drinks wine now, which was a daily thing for 3 years (and heavy for the past 3 months). I keep thinking she'll ask me to leave the bedroom but refills my soap dispenser and puts new toothpaste in my drawer, and does my laundry. In September she said it wasn't entirely my fault and she played a big role in it. The EA is over and there is no communication. She knows she's depressed and asked me for help.
These are some of the little bits that give me hope she is crawling out of it.
The harsh daily daggers have stopped but I continue to deflect and give empathetic statements when applicable. I no longer say ILY but there are so many times I want to.[quote]
* Sorry Im technology challenged*
Not sure what others would say but seems like maybe she is coming out of the replay stuff by dropping the smoking/alcohol stuff which was out of character prior to the crisis. Just be prepared in case some of it surfaces again. I know a lot of the advice is to not say you love them and to go against your natural feelings. For myself, I have a hard time not being genuine. If I want to say ILY and it is because I really want to, not for a reaction or anything like that, then to me...say it if it is true in your heart. Saying it for it to be reciprocated, out of habit, to manipulate or to test is not a reason to say it and I would suggest pulling back when the urge is there. But if you are having a moment and really connecting and you can feel the naturalness and you aren't saying it all the time personally I would from time to time. They do need to hear it some times because the truth is during the crisis they don't feel loved and don't love themselves. Sometimes saying it can trigger a "but I don't love you" response in them but once they have pulled themselves out of the crazy replay stuff an ILY once in a while I think is a good thing. But that's my opinion. Others may feel different.
Do you think she will ask you to leave because you are scared she will or because you aren't sure where you stand?
She is probably really thinking a lot right now and wavering on what her future will be. She just needs time to think, to reflect and to sort that stuff out. Hang in there. In the end it will be what it will, but it sounds to me like there is genuine love between you both. Repairing if you reconcile completely takes time and those triggers will reappear but if forgiveness and understanding are there you have a fighting chance.
It is still a long haul even after the replay ends and taking a look at your future without them is another process we go through as LBS. No matter what you will be ok. My prayers are for you both to have that okay future -together.
Watching the sky for the space shuttle return...relief, lights at last BD May/12 (37, H41- D18 D13 S11) July 2012 ILYBNILY reconcile oct/12 no AP 2nd BD Jan/18 start again Original AP
I personally think depression and withdrawal are coinciding. As for our love....we have always had a special bond and even during the worst times of our fighting/divorcing I could tell she still loved me. She refused to look into my eyes and when she would, she would cry. She cried about imagining me moving on and that nobody will understand her efforts to support me through school and residency. She told me a few weeks ago the old ILYBINILWY. But then a day later said she is keeping certain things from me in order to not get my Hope's up. I eventually extracted them: 1. she thinks marriage is best/right thing to do for our family 2. She loves me.
I was admittedly caught snooping which led to secrecy. But now she leaves her phone, tablet, laptop out in the open (I'm not looking) which symbolizes trust or perhaps just testing me.
As for the bedroom. It is more of a curiosity to me why someone who is so confused would want a spouse sleeping next to them. I just don't understand it. To be Frank, there is no intimacy right now. She used to ask for space but would not define it. She has not mentioned that word in a couple of months now.
As for the future. She is looking for employment and hasn't worked outside the home in 8 years. A week ago she said she wanted to struggle because that build character. Now she realizes jobs are hard to come by but cannot possibly work for $15 per hour because it can't support her lifestyle. She has applies for maybe 12 jobs in 3 weeks and continues to shop, get nails/hair done, workout etc....and job search seems secondary to everything else.
You are her security, her safety net, the one she can rely on. In MLC there are a few different approaches Midlifers can take. Some abandon completely like my sister did, some come and go checking in every week or month like my Dad, and then there are the ones who keep closer contact like my H and your W. They all have confusion and on some level escape the relationship either physically, emotionally or both. She says she doesn't want you...but....I would bet way down deep inside you are still there in her heart and she doesn't really want you gone, maybe for a minute and then thinks about it and no. That's why she wants to sleep with you still, she is confused, she blames you and loves you at the same time. And the fear is always strongest for a while.
It sounds like she is going through different things in her mind, different scenarios. She says one minute she wanted to struggle to build character and then the next couldn't work for $15/hr because she is accustom to her lifestyle. In my opinion she is trying to figure things out about what she would do if she no longer had you in her life, on all levels. And this does correlate with the issue of abandonment. Not having her accustom way of life is a smoke screen for her fear of not having you in general. I don't believe she only sees you as an ATM. She is struggling inside and flipping things around, ideas around until she accepts one that eases her fear, so she can face it head on with a safety net in her mind whether conscious of it or not.
Listen to what she says and watch her actions; they do give you some insight if you read past the crazy/chaos. There is a grain of truth in things she says and does, you just can not take any of it personally.
What does employment mean to her? Does it fill a void, define her identity, give her purpose, indicate status, indicate worthiness, what does it trigger inside her. I wonder if she sees your success as a doctor and sees that as "who" you are, and then looks at herself and thinks....who am I? Maybe not realizing that employment is not your identity; it is superficial to define others by their employment and status rather than by who they are as a personality/character good and bad. She may be trying to accept this and embrace that her value as a person is not defined by income. Some women struggle with "losing" those years of staying home to raise a family. But it is not a loss at all it is actually a blessing but many women struggle with this concept and transition.
Maybe she actually thinks very highly of you, despite her poor behaviour and wonders how she could possibly hang onto you if she is in her own mind not worthy. Its just a thought, I may be wrong.
Watching the sky for the space shuttle return...relief, lights at last BD May/12 (37, H41- D18 D13 S11) July 2012 ILYBNILY reconcile oct/12 no AP 2nd BD Jan/18 start again Original AP
Sorry if I have high jacked you today. Prayers of hope sent for you both~ Take Care
Watching the sky for the space shuttle return...relief, lights at last BD May/12 (37, H41- D18 D13 S11) July 2012 ILYBNILY reconcile oct/12 no AP 2nd BD Jan/18 start again Original AP
Well... she has said before there is no way I could love her and she doesn't deserve me. She has also stated it would be hard to not be the drs wife.
As for a job. She has always held prestigious jobs and community titles. She lost her identity through becoming a mother and feels employment would give her a chance to contribute financially. A month ago she wanted to go to school and I promised to support her in every way. She was excited about finally pursuing her dream career but now that has taken a back seat to employment, in case she needs to support herself.
Last week she said she can see how important it is for me to unwind with the kids every day after work. She knows it would be devastating to break up a family. She has stated several times how she doesnt want to follow in her mothers footsteps. Which is strange to me that someone who has had so much resentment for her mom, knows the pain of broken family would follow in those footsteps. She always thought she was better than the cycle and could beat it.
[/quote]As for a job. She has always held prestigious jobs and community titles. She lost her identity through becoming a mother and feels employment would give her a chance to contribute financially. A month ago she wanted to go to school and I promised to support her in every way. She was excited about finally pursuing her dream career but now that has taken a back seat to employment, in case she needs to support herself.[quote]
The dream career may have taken a back seat to employment but, she may also be rethinking that dream career now that the commitment to pursue is there. Making decisions and commitments while in MLC is difficult because the brain is all over the place. She may also have some changes in her desire for that dream career now that time has passed. When did she chose this career?
She knows on some level that a divorce is not inevitable, so she knows she may not have to support herself entirely if you stay together. She could even be afraid of the leap into the dream in case it isn't all she actually thought it would be. Her fear of failure could be stunting her movement towards the schooling, she has been dealing with her appearance with nails/hair/shopping etc and the job search took a back seat to this. Is the shopping and salon a normal behaviour pre crisis?
So her dream career has taken a back seat to employment which has now taken a back seat to shopping/hair/nails etc. So she is stalling. Im hearing all these things are being processed; she is contemplating decisions on her work, her home, her family and on you. She will likely flop all over the place for a while as it goes undetected under the surface. I would just acknowledge her options when she presents them and support her choice at the time; eventually one of these things will dictate what she will chose with the others. And once she makes concrete positive choices and they come into fruition from her hand then her confidence should increase as should progress. Takes time...argh eh.
Watching the sky for the space shuttle return...relief, lights at last BD May/12 (37, H41- D18 D13 S11) July 2012 ILYBNILY reconcile oct/12 no AP 2nd BD Jan/18 start again Original AP
