Moving On To The Bright Side Part 7

[DonH]

Joseph, I think you are losing or have lost your way with all of this OLD stuff. Just what is your goal anymore? You seem to be so overthinking everything. All of these "rules" all of this stuff about not texting a second time, etc. what's up with all of this? Are you even being yourself with these women? Take the woman that texted you back after a month. When I first read about you not texting her a second time I thought, how much you want to bet both are waiting for the other - and sure as heck, that's what happened. She's thinking, what is up with this dude and you are thinking the same about her. Why? why these games? Now I'd not text a bunch of times. Most people say no more than three. I sometimes only did or do two. But people forget. We are not the only person or thing going on in their life. I have totally lost or forgotten texts. Hell it happened today - not with a woman just in general. There is nothing wrong with showing a little bit of interest. You have to put yourself out there at least a little bit. You seem to be looking for red flags at every turn. That mindset is good and needed but not so soon and not with EVERYTHING someone does. You have to give a little bit of leeway and then watch for patterns. If she fails to return texts on a regular basis that's a big deal - but one single time?

Dating in general is a numbers game. You've got to meet a lot of women to find one worth dating for awhile. You are casting so many off before you even get started. Like if she waited 2 minutes too long to respond, you cut her off - I'm being sarcastic of course but you get my point.

I think you are now seeing what others and myself have said about OLD. I fear it's changing you, like it has so many others and you are losing who you are. Are they seeing the real Joseph? Is the real Joseph someone who casts someone off due to a single missed text? If so, who wants to sign up for that? I'm not saying you need to be some nice guy beta male that begs a woman for a date. What I'm saying is be the real you - be someone a real quality woman would want to date.

[Dawn70]

Girls keep their stable on the app, then if they are lucky the pass onto actually getting her phone number and the direct texting begins. Then depending on how the date goes or how needy the guy is they fall off or she dumps them and then just replaces him with someone from the "stable".

It is truly a work of art .

J9, I find your posts fascinating because I learn a TON about myself and what I do and do not want. I'm literally laughing out loud at girls keeping their stable. Seriously? Apparently I'm a total loser because I was lucky if I could get ONE GUY to talk to me, much less a stable of them. And 9 times out of 10, the one guy who WOULD talk to me was either a complete loser (no job, lived with family, not divorced, or 45+ and never been married, which does not make one a loser in and of itself, but it certainly does raise some red flags) or he was just interested in sex (again, not necessarily anything wrong with that, if you find a willing participant, but I did not go OLD to "hook up"). Several have said on here you have to kiss a lot of frogs and I found my share of frogs. Fortunately for Sparky, he made it past frog-dom, but I just don't know that I agree with that being the reality of how OLD works. Hell, maybe it does, though...what do I know? I'm not a man. And, apparently not a very good game player so OLD didn't really do it for me. Too few men who were their real selves.

I do wish you all the luck in the world though and truly hope you find what you are looking for. Oh and so sorry about your dog. That made me tear up. I feel bad for you and your family. Pets are part of our families and it is tough to lose them for sure.

[TBSakaJ9]

Well I got yelled at last night over text, accused of “fishing” which I guess means searching for the best deal????? I have heard of the term but I didn’t think that applied to the person if they were not the one to initiate contact. Smh. I guess she didn’t like me not blowing up her phone, telling her to get back with me when she figured out her schedule, and me telling her I wasn’t available this weekend. Well she saved me $50 or so and I kind of had a bad feeling about her anyway so it just reaffirmed the notion of trusting your gut. Man what a psycho.

[focus22]

Some of the woman have it down to an exact science. The blonde that I will meet up with next week is still active on the app, building her "stable" so it makes me wonder how many guys have her cell phone number and she is actively interacting with not on the app. It doesn't bother me since I understand the game now but it has been really eye opening.

Girls keep their stable on the app, then if they are lucky the pass onto actually getting her phone number and the direct texting begins. Then depending on how the date goes or how needy the guy is they fall off or she dumps them and then just replaces him with someone from the "stable".

It is truly a work of art .

Joseph, when I was OLD over the course of a year, I was messaging a few (and literally a few) chaps on the app I was using. They were just a few because the majority of messages I got were way too full on, as in obviously looking for hook ups or really aggressive, and a few gave me the weird vibes straight off. There were a few who I exchanged 'normal' messages with.

Then there were literally just a few I got to the stage of Whatsapping. Again, it was just chit chat mainly. But I got into some more personal conversations with a couple, life stuff, life situations etc. I met some of those. And I knew straight off if there was any chemistry or not. Did I kiss any of those? One or two I think. One was a mistake and I knew it even before I kissed him, one there was some chemistry with.

There was a little chemistry with a couple of the others I met over the course of that year, and I maybe only met them once or twice. And that was because they just weren't a good enough fit for me in some other way, like I could tell straight off that they were too immature for me in some way, or had too much of an ego thing going on and was just looking for some action, or one I knew without him even saying anything that he had just split up from his wife and was trying to think of himself as interested in other women again (he was a nice guy and we had a good laugh together, literally laughing like drains the whole time we were talking, but he had along road ahead of him emotionally).

What did I learn in all of this? When I started OLD, I was very much in the mindset I had in my early-mid 20s: that if you agreed to meet someone for a date it was a serious thing. There was no internet then, and the way you met people was through friends or where you worked/studied. So you knew them (at least a little) before anything happened. A date was a Friday or Saturday night thing, just the two of you, and you were kind of exclusive if you got to that point.

Now what seems to go on is you agree to 'go out' on 'a date' with someone you meet online, but you don't really know them at all. So it's more along the lines of a chat for an hour or so and cup of coffee. It's not 'a date' as I would have considered it before. And it's certainly not exclusive (not until you know each other at least a little and decide to have the 'exclusive or not' chat together).

Addressing the red flag thing. Yes, there were some messages I got that were full on red flags straight off (aggressive, overly sexual, disrespectful). Then there were some guys I was chatting on the app with and when I said I couldn't message/chat with them any more (because I'd met the man I'm with now), they became red flags in a big way. They were very clingy and needy, or very, very aggressive, like they owned me in some way. That gave me the major creeps.

I think only one chap thanked me for chatting with him, said he'd enjoyed out chats and wished me all the best. But I'd had that impression about him all along, from the very first chat we'd had. And in fact, I'd been due to meet him a couple of weeks after. It's just that I hadn't wanted to go any more because I'd met someone I was really interested in. Then I have to say I also had respect for the guy who had just split up from his wife and was just starting to date again, because he was just absolutely himself.

When I ask the wonderful man I'm with what he'd been looking for in OLD, he said 'someone genuine' who 'wasn't just interested in me for a free lunch'. So there you go, that's how it looks from the other side as well, pretty much the same as it looks from this side.

So I guess the lesson is to be yourself, don't play games (you know you're doing that, you know someone else is doing that, someone else knows you're doing that...we can all see through that sort of behaviour), and take each person as they are, don't project your own issues onto them (I think we all have/had had issues with trust at some point, having been on the receiving end of an A/multiple As), and let time show you who they are and what they're about.

I don't know how it goes as far as hook ups are concerned. Maybe it's a different scenario.

[TBSakaJ9]

Thanks Focus......when I started OLD I was pretty naïve and took everyone at face value thinking everyone must be looking for a relationship. Then as time wore on I realized that was not the case...some just want someone to talk to and have no intentions of meeting, some just want to hook up, others just want to casually date, etc. Getting past that helped me realize not to take it too seriously in the beginning and you just have to figure out what they person is looking for. Then you have to deal with the whole over pursuing, being needy, etc. labels that we face and trying to balance when to meet, how quickly, when to ask, etc. If you chat too long you run out of things to say and the conversations becomes boring but you have to chat some to at least build a rapport so both people feel comfortable. So while it might not be a game their are definitely strategies to employ based on each person.

I try to stay true to who I am which is why it hasn't worked out for me so far but obviously it wasn't supposed to since I have not met the right person. The very first girl I went out with she could tell I was brand new at OLD as you said I am sure it was 100% obvious to her. I had a couple that I was not attracted to upon meeting and I knew it was not going to go any further than the first date. I have had a couple of ladies flake on me during our conversation so maybe I came on too strong, said something that didn't vibe with her or she got interested in someone else. I had kitchen girl that just wanted a weekend fling but I didn't recognize it at the time and thought she wanted something more and another who I think just wanted to chat because she never agreed to the date and time I had set for us.

I guess the point is that I have probably interacted with 20 or more woman, went on dates with about 1/2 of them and while I don't think I am playing games I do believe their is a strategy to be used depending on what the girl is looking for. For example, the blonde that I am going to see this weekend. We talk about once a week and she never initiates conversation but when we chat she is very interactive and from what I can tell seems be excited to meet. So either she is purposely holding herself back from initiating conversation with me because she read it in some book that the man should do all the pursuing or she is casually dating and doesn't wants to keep her options open.

The girl that went off on me this past Friday telling me I was fishing (I didn't know a person could fish when they did not initiate contact) I think she wanted something more, might have been insecure, and couldn't handle me not giving her my undivided attention and I guess didn't like me telling her to figure out her schedule and let me know. Maybe she wanted something more and didn't like my approach to her.

When I am on a date or texting I believe I authentically act like who I am however I do think when you are initially attracting, setting dates, texting response times etc. I do think there is a little gamesmanship involved since in the beginning that is your first form of communication.

[Ginger1]

J- I think you need a break of OLD. I can't begin to tell you how many breaks I have had to take. I needed that period of time where I knew it was my choice to not have any guys in my life and just not think about it.

I believe since the D, this has been my biggest dating year, and mostly OLD. I have learned a lot. I don't know where it's going with me and M, although I think it's a good place. But man, the crap I went through to find him.

Just when you think you have seen it all/heard it all with online dating, something else comes your way. Taking a break is good sometimes, where you just delete all the apps and go about your life.

[TBSakaJ9]

Funny you should say that G but I was starting to feel the same way. Reaching out to people and going through the same introductory exchanging of information has become boring, mundane and a little stale. I just hid my profile and will see how it plays out with blondie and go from there.

[focus22]

I do believe their is a strategy to be used depending on what the girl is looking for. For example, the blonde that I am going to see this weekend. We talk about once a week and she never initiates conversation but when we chat she is very interactive and from what I can tell seems be excited to meet. So either she is purposely holding herself back from initiating conversation with me because she read it in some book that the man should do all the pursuing or she is casually dating and doesn't wants to keep her options open.

OK, so here we are, at the very sharp end of it all. You've spent a bit of time and energy trying to work out where someone else is coming from and their motivations for it, and you're not really any further forwards with any of it. You don't know where they're coming from and you have no idea as to their motivations.

Does any of that time and energy you've spent thinking about it all make any sort of a difference to where you are with it all now? Can it help you predict what's going to happen in the future?

No. It is what it is, and it is what it is in this precise moment in time.

You could actually have spent that time and energy on yourself, doing something positive and constructive for yourself, instead of spending that time and energy speculating on a stranger.

The girl that went off on me this past Friday telling me I was fishing (I didn't know a person could fish when they did not initiate contact) I think she wanted something more, might have been insecure, and couldn't handle me not giving her my undivided attention and I guess didn't like me telling her to figure out her schedule and let me know. Maybe she wanted something more and didn't like my approach to her.

Who knows. Does any of your speculating make any difference to where you are now, in this precise moment in time? No.

And does it make any iota of a difference to the outcome if you hit the nail on the head and get the right answer here or not? The situation is still the situation.

When I am on a date or texting I believe I authentically act like who I am however I do think when you are initially attracting, setting dates, texting response times etc. I do think there is a little gamesmanship involved since in the beginning that is your first form of communication.

Does it actually matter in the end? If you meet someone, hit it off, have the chemistry, want to see where it goes, begin to like them as a person and have feelings for them for who they are, then great - if that's what you're both looking for.

If you meet someone, hit it off, have the chemistry, want to see where it goes, and they turn out to be a player, well, they've shown themselves to be who they are and what they're about. Which is a good thing. You just need to give them the time for them to be who they are. People always show themselves to be who they are. You can't change that by speculating, projecting, being empathetic towards a situation you think they may or may not be in, or have been at some point.

Do you see what I mean? I've been super guilty of being an over thinker and over analyser in the past. I'm one of those people that needs to make sure I can see the big picture, from as many different viewpoints as possible. And those different viewpoints need to be fair and true for all the people involved. I'm really, really good at it.

Does it actually make a difference to my situation? Talking with regards to my XH here. I spent a lot of time and energy trying to work out what was going on after he left (October 2015), trying to be empathetic to whatever it was that he was going through in the 6 years leading up to it. Did he actually tell me any of it? No. Has it actually made any sort of a difference to where I am now (D)? No.

Looking back, all those hours I spent turning things over in my mind, reading, researching, speculating, all that huge amount of energy I expended...I could have used that on myself. A big part of me thinks 'what a huge waste of time and energy that all was'.

I tried really hard to stop myself doing any of that when I started OLD. And have gotten a bit better at it. OLD was good for me in that sense, as it made me understand that I had to stand right back from it all and let people be who they were going to be. Once I understood that and got a bit of a handle on it all, I was really surprised at how quickly I got what people were about. And it stopped me getting suckered into their rubbish (games/manipulation) whenever there was that sort of vibe going about.

The best gift you can give yourself? All that time and energy you're spending thinking and analysing. Use that to make yourself a better person - the person that you want to be.

Sure, you'l meet some nice people on the way, and you'll meet some absolute humdingers, and some OK people, and maybe someone who is very special too. Much better to have invested all of that time and energy in yourself, so that if/when you meet someone extra special you are a much better version of yourself than you were previously, and you have less personal rubbish you're dragging behind you than before.

[TBSakaJ9]

Thanks F and I agree.......I have found myself caring less and less about the interactions. When I was at the gym this morning I was listening to a podcast and realized that I started to get off course with the things that had been focused on, none of which was OLD. My diet was suffering, I have been drinking too much, have not been as involved coaching my oldest daughter's soccer team, etc. So I think it's a good time to stop and just re-calibrate.

[focus22]

Yup, sounds like a good plan.

Something that's taken me a good long while to learn, but simply doing the practicalities involved in life can be really good for you, for me anyway. It takes up my time, which means it stops me from thinking about stuff and going down that track.

I don't drink much at all, but if I drink more than one, I notice a big difference to my mental health the next day. I feel down, drained, and negative. I'm happy to have the occasional one when I'm out (which isn't much), or with a special dinner now.

it's hard work staying focussed on yourself and your life, especially if someone else has been the focus. I have to constantly work on it.