Brave Little Gerda Trods On -- My Faith Journey

[job]

Gerda,

Here's what I would do if I were in your situation, but you can do what you feel is right for you. Whatever you give him, document the date, time and amount and from which account the funds were taken from. When I had to dole out funds to my xh, I had a receipt typed up with the info and had him sign that he had received "X" amount of dollars or such and such date. It leaves a nice paper trail and he can't say that he didn't receive the funds from you. I did this right after he went nuts, moved out and filed. It was a lot of work, but at the end of the day, it was the proof I needed to bring to court.

I would set up a spreadsheet for your use in doling out funds to him. I don't think I would provide his lawyer with a copy of this or a copy of the spreadsheet that you set up for your husband to review concerning the expenses, etc, until you absolutely have to. Document, document and document some more. The more you have as evidence, the better your case will be down the road. I know that this isn't what you want to do, but you have to do it to save yourself, your children and your assets, etc.

His lawyer is only hearing one side of the story and right now, he's believing his client and who knows what the man is telling him.

[Gerda]

Job,this is really really helpful. I really like this idea actually.

I think I do have a trail of sorts already because of the e-mails he sends and then I always give him a check from my account.

But my only question is -- is there any use in his lawyer seeing what he is actually doing and what I am actually doing? I would love it if his lawyer would let him understand much sooner that the court is not going to do what he wants just because he is p!ssed.

[Gerda]

Job, I just want to thank you again for helping me. It really is interesting how different the MLC survivor esponse to divorce is from those of friends I have who went through divorces and not from MLC. Or rather, they didn't know about MLC. Who knows if it was actually MLC driving their divorces too!

[job]

Gerda,

The lawyer is working for and is being paid by your h. Whether the lawyer actually believes everything your h is telling him or not, the lawyer is thinking of billable hours on this deal. They see this kind of stuff all of the time and know that MLCers tend to rack up billable hours because they are so off the wall. As for sharing stuff with his lawyer, I wouldn't unless the lawyer contacts you. If you had legal representation, then I would suggest you share the info w/the person representing you.

I can't emphasize enough about documenting and being consistent in doing this. I know it takes a lot of time, but at the end of the day, it will be well worth it. Be sure to make copies of any and all messages, checks, etc. It's important to keep this data safe and out of his reach and prying eyes.

Trust me, his lawyer is only going to be looking out for his client's best interests and they will certainly not be your best interests.

[Gerda]

Yesterday I had a meeting with a lawyer just to get an understanding of the process and advice on what to do.

He said my case for full custody was very good and I should refuse to back down on that.

He gave me various other advice, and all of it was a lot more on the offensive than I want to be. I wanted to just respond whenever possible, not to initiate anything. This lawyer was not someone who would understand MLC nor of course someone of faith. If I alluded to the fact that my H was doing this to relieve a pain that won't be relieved by this, or that I thought he could one day come out of the insanity, he just told me to accept that this is happening and fight for what is mine.

I thought that I should be as slow as possible, and just let all the craziness go on on the the other side of the mountain. Fight for my kids when pushed but not go on the attack.

So I am not sure what to do as far as how I go into this.

I don't want to participate in this at all of course. But it also seems like if you do anything to get anything, you have to get so ugly and say and do things you would never normally say and do. I would have to say all the things he has done and talk about his drinking and so many things. I would have to try to get full custody on first conference and this would also imply that I am kicking him out of house.

It is so strange how this whole situation forces you to take actions you would never ever talk and which you find morally reprehensible.

[job]

Gerda,

I am glad you had a meeting w/a lawyer to get a better understanding of the process and on the custody issue. Like here, you take what you can use from that meeting and leave the rest on the table for now.

You can be as slow as you want, but it may ramp him up in demanding and being a pain even more so to live with...but you will be prepared for that. If you are going to represent yourself, then slow it is....and he can push and demand all he wants because he will be the one racking up the billable hours.

Do document...this is important. You do not necessarily have to get ugly in all of this...but he will. It's unfortunate that we have to stand our ground as much as possible because they tend to destroy everything in their path and in their own way, they want us to hate them as much as they hate themselves.

Dig deeper for patience, document everything, and continue to lean on your faith.

[DnJ]

Hello Gerda

I have been checking on your thread, and praying for you. Just been a little too busy with work lately, I am pretty sure you know what that’s like.

He said my case for full custody was very good and I should refuse to back down on that.

...he just told me to accept that this is happening and fight for what is mine.

Those are two good pieces of advice.

Anything you do will have little to no affect on your H’s MLC, he has to go through whatever issues he has.

I understand you do not want to do this, I did not want to either. I still can picture signing W and my separation agreement, making it legal and binding.

Let me offer a viewpoint, maybe it will help. Your H is the one who is pushing this, and I get that you do not want things to get ugly. Ugly, like beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If pressed you will just tell the truth, the facts of what has happened. You are just responding truthfully. From my eye, that is not ugly, that is right.

Ensure you are working towards stuff that really matters to you, like custody. Do not become embroiled in petty agruements. You can stand tall and proud protecting you and your kids. Keep standing in the light.

You are a smart women Gerda, I know you got this. Just letting you know I am thinking about you.

[Gerda]

DnJ, thank you so much. I have read your posts to me post-BD4 many times over. I was especially moved by the fact that you have sought answers from God; this is something I didn't really know you did. But it makes sense, considering the way you live your life with so much goodness and truth and beauty.

I very much want to only speak the truth when pressed. What is bothering me is that it seems like I have to push the whole thing before pressed. It seems like I have to go on the offensive and take the lead.

And what does it mean to protect my kids? Is that only about custody? And am I positive that the best thing for them is my sole custody? I feel like it is but how do I know that this will plant some seed of confusion about me keeping them from him, even if I say he can visit everyday. Does protecting them mean fighting to keep this house, which seems to be my H's entire obsession now, to access the equity in it and to end my "control" of him in my refusal to sell it? And keep in mind that if he were my old H and we were making a plan together to start a new life somewhere, even if I didn't really want to, I would submit him to sell it. But doing that now when he has cycled in and out of wanting to sell it to run away with OW and then wanting to sell it because he doesn't want to work and has no plan of where we would live or what we would live on, scenarios that weren't even clear about if we would be going somewhere else together or separately, that is why I have felt that I was doing more to stand for the marriage if I was the "faithful and prudent" servant who held on to it.

It is a lot of equity, far too much for me to buy him out unless once we added in all the debts we share (which are massive) and then maybe took out child support til the kids are 18, maybe then the amount would be low enough that I could do something crazy to figure out a way. I am in this strange situation of having a house worth a lot more than we owe on it, but having so little income (plus the siphon of MLC) that I can't afford to get the kids to the dentist. If we have to sell it, we will have to leave where we live and lose at least half a million dollars to capital gains tax, but I will only be able to afford maybe a 2-bedroom where we live, and there will be a monthly maintenance in any building around here that is as much as monthly rent where many of you live Right now we live in a pretty big apartment for free, as the rentals in the apartments below ours cover our huge mortgage.

We have no retirement savings and clearly I will not be getting alimony. This house is our retirement and a way to live for free until then. It is our home that I and the kids love. But the lawyer told me that a judge will be annoyed with my clinging to it and will order us to sell it if we go to trial.

And then in order to try to hold on to it, I would have to do a lot of arguing, a lot of back and forth and a lot of mud slinging about all that he has done in life and with money in the past five years. I will be alone in the court having to do that all on my own.

I am jumping ahead but this is what is making me crazy, my mind going over and over all the things I will have to do in the months to come, and what I will say and when I have to say it.

[Gerda]

Job, are you saying you think I should avoid ramping him up or just continue what I think I am doing, slow and steady and focusing on response and not taking the lead in anything?

You keep saying to lean on my faith; my faith is very radical and at times I am not sure how far I am supposed to go with submitting to whatever happens and trusting God. I know my H can't take everything, I have reviewed how the law works. But he could take a lot if I don't fight.

What do you think I should document besides money? The L said i don't need to do things like photograph wine bottles but that in the discovery period, I can review the records on his cards and see alcohol purchases probably. But that's part of the awfulness. I imagine reviewing his card history and seeing all sorts of horrors that I have purposefully avoided seeing all this time.

[Gordie]

Gerda

W expected me to submit and give her everything

I am not sure what to tell you

Because what I did may not be possible for you

I hired a very good lawyer

I told him my objectives for custody and money

I was willing to be very generous financially

But I was not willing to give up on custody

I let him do most of the work

And yes at times it got ugly

Because I would not give up on what was most important to me

She eventually agreed to my terms