Re: Advice on My Scenario Pt. 14 - Phoenix Rising

[OrangeK]

Wow, Nutcracker, if you had posted this in your own thread, I missed it. This sounds like a completely different story. Not that it would have changed anything, but I wished you would have (early on) made this list of issues with your W in your thread. It just gives us a much clearer view of the situation.

Sorry for the hijack, Orange. This is an example of why I often ask newcomers to give us more information.

Totally Ok with the Hijack, going back to his Thread to discuss now.
Check the list i made, and Sandi, i know we talked about not talking down about her, take that list from a non-bias standpoint. I was not trying to be insulting to WW at all, just stating the facts as i experienced them.

[OrangeK]

I want to start by saying I agree with Steve. You are handling what we are saying, listening to use it to help you. I think you are ready for some of the questions I am going to ask to help you look inward.
Lets do this, and i will be honest about myself, and WW. OM will not be a factor in this post as you asked.


You say she dangled sex like a carrot to get you to do things like watch S3 for an hour or to make a meal.

Did she feel she needed to do this? - No, i enjoy cooking, and was always asking about what else could be done around the house. She only ever cooked and cleaned during her "Mask On" phases, Once she checked out she did none of these things. The best example i can recall of the "Carrot on a stick" maneuver was towards the end of last summer, things had been bad between us all year, we were at the beach with S3, i commented she looked amazing in her bathing suit, she then said she wanted to lay in the sun and be left alone and asked me to take S3 away from her so she could relax, said "ill make it worth it for you later, ill keep the bikini on for you"
As i walked away with S3, excited i might actually get attention from my wife, i glance back to see her on her phone.


Did she try first by asking you to help with the meals? She never had to, I was always good about splitting house work and parenting duties.

Did she kindly say "I really need some me time, I want to get get my nails done, could you take S3 for an hour?" - No, she never communicated any type of unhappiness, she just began showing it. She took time to do what she wanted to do, and didnt ask permission to do it.

ANd if she did ask nicely, was she met with criticism? Judgement? Did she feel invalidated for needing and asking for these things? So then she felt like she had to take out her arsenal, like sex?
Again, I dont belive so. I always encouraged she spend time with or friends, or take care of what she wanted to do. I said that she spent so much time working or parenting she deserved it. She did some yoga classes and came home glowing, i told her she looked and sounded amazing and i looked forward to her doing more as she had finally found an activity she liked to get out and do.

I am not saying you did these things, I am honestly asking. Is there anything somewhat honest about what I am saying?
I know it probably sounds like i am trying to be like "No Ginger, i was alwyas the perfect little husband i did nothing wrong!!"
But i have been totally honest about all you have asked.


The times I have known women to do this, is when they try asking and directly communicating and they get shot down. I did it. (although I didn't use sex). Anything I asked I was made to feel like I was being unreasonable or shouldn't feel or need what I did. I was made to feel like an inadequate needy person. So I became awfully passive aggressive. I didn't know what else to do. It wasn't the solution, but I was at a loss.


Sometimes it is good to look to ourselves to see why our partners may have been doing what they are doing. It doesn't make it right..... I wasn't right to act the way I did.

Just like the communication. Lead by example. Words are cheap. If you stop being passive aggressive and bitter, perhaps she will be too.


I will say when I felt judged by my ex (which was pretty much all the time) that when I turned on my passive aggressiveness.

Happy father's day, byt the way.


Ill end by giving some insigt in to what she did bring up as issues from my half of the R, but NONE of these things ever came up until after BD and Affair Exposure. there are lots of them that are from before that time but she never brought anything up, even when i asked. Again, she is super non confrontational, and passive aggressive. It suits her projected image of the "Injured Princess"

Here is a list of things WW said i did that caused her to fall out of love with me, mind you this all only was brought up to me in the last 6 months of our marriage, or after we separated due to Affair. I will try to put them in chronological order of when they happened, not when they were brought up to me

1.) I "half assed" her birthday (xmas eve) after she did a really nice one for me our first year together. I got her nice things she liked, but i didnt wrap the gifts, there was no showmanship about it.

2.) I didnt trust her to not show me her BC pills after the first pregnancy we had, she didnt like that i wanted validation she was taking them. (we know why now...)

3.)She told me she was really upset i didnt go with her to the termination appointment, although i recall asking her if she wanted me there or wanted privacy and i believe her response was "Ill go alone, ill call you if i need you"

4.) I wasnt supportive during activies i motivated with "Common, you can do this, push a little harder!" instead of something like "Great Job, you are doing so well! Keep it up im so proud of you!" during a hike.

5.) The way i reacted (shock and disbelief) to seeing her bump when she was pregnant the 2nd time, with S3. (Bear in mind she didnt tell me she was pregnant, i saw walked in on her changing) and being shocked when she told me how far along she was and explained why she had been hiding it for "the last few weeks". (she knew the whole time)

6.) The fact that when we went to the hospital for S3 to be born, that the nurses gave her meds and told me "She will sleep for a few hours, go home and get some food and rest, we will call you in a few hours" that i left to get food and rest, and 2 days after S3 was born that I left the hospital for 3 hours to go to my brothers house to get out of the hospital for a short time. When she brought this up after BD she said "well it must have been nice, its not like i could have left to go relax for 3 hours".
We were there for 4 days, she got made at me for being absent a total of 5 hours. Am i wrong in thinking this over-reaction??
She hates being alone, at all, in any way, this is why she was SO mad about this. Also, my brother had died 9 days prior, so i was a bit emotionally maxed out in both directions.

7.) Claims of me not "recprocating the effort she put into the relationship" like that she was better at birthdays or Christmas than me, but i did other stuff. Surprise coffees at work, Special Dinners homemade, tons of verbal love, affection and support.

8.) SHe was mad when i said "you took the first job you were offered" when we had difficulty and disagreements with her schedule when she started at the salon in Jan of 2017. She said this was me "not supporting her career choice" she had never expressed interest in working at a salon EVER before she was hired here. Applied on a whim for an entry level position.

9.) said "you complain everyday about doing something for 2 hours each day that ive been doing for 24 hours a day for the last 2 years" when i had difficulty with S3 alone, after pickups from school right when he started. I was just venting TO her about my frustrations with his behavior. She took it as me complaining about having to parent. I tried to clarify this and she never believed me. She was my rock and my teammate, i thought thats how it worked...

10.) My temper, As before stated, i was a wall punching - door slamming type. But i had put that behind me for the most part. That side of me didnt come out until she was deliberately pushing my buttons to make it happen.
I can only think of 2 occasions it occurred before BD, and neither were directed at her. One was my brother, and the other was because of our neighbor. She just saw that i could get to that point, and took note for future use i guess.

Thank you for the fathers day wishes by the way.

[OrangeK]

Update of events.

Had a good weekend up at my parents with S3, My brother and SIL.

WW had to come to my house to pickup S3 today, She asked "are you just going to stay inside and send him out, or do you want me to come to the door? how are we doing this"

She still doesnt seem to understand what "must remain 300ft away at all times" means.

I left my house and had my grandfather come hang out with S3 until she got here to get him.

During the weekend WW texted me twice to ask for items that shew wanted from my parents house, a grill her mom gave us, and a baby hiking carrier that S3 doesnt fit into anymore. I imagine she is re-gifting or selling that.

When she had picked him up she complained that i hadnt informed her S3 was in a pull up and not a regular diaper.

The list of things she expects me to keep her posted on, through a restraining order, is becoming a bit long for my liking.


Lastly, I did have several waves of "the twisty stomach" this weekend. This is now establishing a pattern, any weekend in the last month+ SHE has NOT had S3, i get this anxious stomach sensation. Last weekend she had S3 and it didnt bother me at all. She has S3 now, not bothering me at all. I swear there is some odd emotional connection or something, i feel crazy saying that but it honestly feels true.........Bizzaro.

Overall, a good weekend. Progress was made.

Happy fathers day to all the LBH's out there. You rock.

[TBSakaJ9]

Ok...early on I got knots in my stomach when I had my girls because I knew if they were with me she had the freedom to date and be with om. That might be what you are experiencing.

[OrangeK]

Ok...early on I got knots in my stomach when I had my girls because I knew if they were with me she had the freedom to date and be with om. That might be what you are experiencing.

I had considered that, but that doesnt ever seem to be where my train of thought is when it happens, and i know that she is off with OM anytime she isnt at work, so that may be it, but if it is its subconscious.
At this point i could honestly really stop calling him OM. He is her primary now. Furthermore i will refer to him as her boyfriend, she is no longer my wife, and they are together, not her and I.

[NicoleR]

OrangeK, I'm sorry I haven't been able to comment on your thread lately but I hope you're doing as well as possible and making it through each day. I share many of the same thoughts and feelings as you do about my own situation. It's great though that you're spending quality time with your son and putting care into each communication you have with your WW to ensure you're saying the right thing.

[OrangeK]

OrangeK, I share many of the same thoughts and feelings as you do about my own situation.

Like what Nicole? any insight i can offer, i shall.

It's great though that you're spending quality time with your son and putting care into each communication you have with your WW to ensure you're saying the right thing.

Im just so done fighting, or disagreeing. I just want us both to move on and be parents. Hatred is such a burden. i dont want to carry that weight ever again. It hurts my soul.
I pity her at this point. I want her to get help, but not at the expense of my own health and sanity.

[OrangeK]

ME: What days would you like S3 to go to my parents house on Week of July 4th when he doesnt have school. He will have a great week, he loves his friend next door!

WW: He always has a great time up there. Im at work, can we talk dates later?

ME: Sure. No problem.

WW: My mom will have him tonight if youd like to talk with him at all, hope he had a good Fathers Day with you.

ME: Apologies i thought you had Mondays off now. Have a good shift.

ME: Id prefer to talk to him at bedtime, but ill talk to your mom later. Thanks.

WW: Wwe hired a new girl, but she has to train some more before i move into my new position and schedule.

ME: I had a great fathers day with our son. Thanks. Ttyl.

WW:Well i wont get home till about 8:30 and thats basically bed time.

ME:Ok ill talk to your mom about it later, thanks again.

WW: Yep.
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I am considering sending

"what would you sugjest you and I could do to make this co-parenting situation less stressful and more amicable, i am over it emotionally and want things to just run smoothly and be easy for both of us. I am tired of feeling like enemies."

I have a feeling you all will tell me not to send that, so i havent typed it out yet.

[Maika]

Yup. your instincts are right. don't send that message.

Instead, what are specific things you'd like to do to destress coparenting? Communication? schedule? discipline? etc etc. you get my drift.

What's not running smooth for you. Identify that first and then you can strategize how to discuss it with her.

[OrangeK]

Instead, what are specific things you'd like to do to destress coparenting? Communication? schedule? discipline? etc etc. you get my drift.

What's not running smooth for you. Identify that first and then you can strategize how to discuss it with her.

Well, firstly there is just all of the unresolved tension. Other than Text co-parenting, the last time we spoke was a huge fight, "I want a divorce" the creration of the TRO. A mess.

I would like us to stop treating each-other with cold silent contempt.

I would like her to stop knit picking anything she can about S3.
She complains if he has bug bites, Or dirty clothes. Hes 3.....
I feel like i cant let him have fun when ehs with me

I dont want my heart-rate to spike when she text me.

I dont want to have to plan around thinking she may be trying to trap me with violating the TRO.

Communication is key, that is poor right now. Half of everything still goes through MIL.

Schedule - i trust she is doing ok with bedtime, etc.

Discipline - This is a toughie. I want to bring this up, but i anticipate her disagreeing with me on this. We disagreed on this when we were together. She is a pushover, lets him do what she wants.

Its really hard to co parent with someone who acts like she hates me, and i didn't do anything to earn that hate. It is just the fury of her wayward mind. She has turned me into the mirror for her negative emotions that come from within. Or so it seems to me. She is a projector the max. I feel like the more guilty and shamed she feels from what she did, the worse she will treat me. Until OM becomes a boring thing for her anyway. I may get a reprieve in her scorn then, who knows.