Separated - Patience & DB or Divorce?

[Did]

I am going to talk to my WAW tomorrow or soon. We have been separated for a year. I agreed to get her a rental and pay her $1000 / mo for 3 months as she gets back to work she was a stay at home mom and quit her job 2 years ago to raise our D3.

I have been getting some good advice on here but I have a bad case of Mr Nice Guy Syndrome. I admit it Im working on it. I have this urge to fix the problems. Shes not my responsibility to fix since were separate. I need to do what feels right to me. And it feels wrong to support and enable her with no divorce filed. No separation agreement etc.

I want to get the respect back this is a high priority for me. I am going to tell her that her cell phone isnt my responsibility and neither is D3 bed outside of my home. This is all on her if she wants to be separate. But- I work a lot until mid July so she cant really work with D3 in her care. If D3 was in daycare itd be more $ than she will likely earn. So realistically it is partially my responsibility??

I am going to push splitting finances but I also want to be fair. Part of me feels like if we were dating and piecing our relationship together it would be different. I dont want to control her, I want to avoid R talk. I want to do whats right for me. But understand she cant work until I can have D3 consistently mid July on.

Currently I am just giving space and we barely talk about anything besides D3 since starting DB. A month or two ago we were spending more time together and getting along. I was just being nice and cheery not focusing on W but on D. She made comments about wanting to hug more etc. DB has not shown any results and Im unsure what to do... very torn about this. I am impatient.

Part of me wants to just pay for the needed expenses like a Uhaul, mattress, cell phone repair etc until our house sells June 28. At that time we split profits and she will have money. Until then every $ she has is ours shared.

Let me add that she is frugal. She is trying to sell old furniture and shopping at discount stores etc. She is not trying to spend money whatsoever. But I feel like Im completely enabling her. Today is her birthday she spend $120 to fix her phone. New ones are a lot more expensive. We live in a 450k house she acts like I should be responsible for her whole life. I feel like everything is just going to blow up and the D is at the end of the tunnel either way. Id give a lot to R and after reading DR the end of it is about these love stories where people make up. Feels like a dream to good to be true.

W has anxiety about talking around D3. D3 is most important thing to her. I have made a lot of 180s and working hard on myself. Thanks all for the advice and support!

[Did]

Should of done this long ago like right when she left a year ago. That ship has sailed I gave $1325 non refundable security deposit. I agreed to get her a place. These may have been mistakes but I am not going to be a punk and bail on the mother of my child and the woman I married.

I just dropped off D3. I may be ready to throw in the towel. Said happy birthday made eye contact. No response she does not care about me in that way anymore. I wish there was more I could do but I am probably going to split funds do 3 month separation agreement. If nothing changes file. Really tired of sadness when I see her. I am going to take the power of the relationship back one way or the other.

[sandi2]

I think I should be cool calm steady reliable during this process. In the past I would lose my cool at times in difficult situations. She used to say I would crumble. So be strong and 180. Or I am just making everything easy for her and it is ok not to be nice to her in these situations. I know she likes me best when I m calm cool and strong. Should I be a jerk and say no move your own stuff since she left me?

Will you listen to yourself? Why do you think DBing is acting like a jerk? You are suppose to be the logical spouse, so use your head and be reasonable.

I realize you are going through the worst experience of your life. You keep saying that since you've stopped hanging out at her parents and pulling back that things don't seem to be working. Well, correct me if I am wrong, but you've been physically separated for a year, and you were looking for a place for her to rent when you joined the board........right? So tell me why you think things were better before I told you to stop hanging out at her parents' home, and start detaching? Was it just b/c you got a hug sometimes?

Just to clarify, nobody told you to be cold, mean, argumentative, or any of those things. You have not been on the board for quite a month, yet, and you are saying this isn't working and you are thinking of trying something else. But you knew this move was coming! How did you think you'd feel? I'm just saying that your emotions are normal. This is worse than a death. You can't expect to feel happy over it. If talking to a coach will give you encouragement, then go for it.

Some areas have divorce care groups. Some churches have support groups for those going through divorce. Check around.

I'm sorry if you didn't get the comfort you wanted to feel from the board. I'm not sure what you expected, but like I said, all of this was already in motion when you joined. We were basically trying to help you prepare for what was ahead. I suspect you misunderstand how to detach DB style, which seems to be common problem.

FWIW, I have seen many couples IRL reconcile after they have lived apart. Sometimes going separate ways, giving space and time, has a way of working for them. He finds the man he was meant to be, and she may go through an affair for a time......and usually she has to experience some tough licks from reality to find herself again, and slowly, she realizes she wants him back. That may take two or three years......maybe longer. Will you still want her after that time? Who knows. People change.

[Did]

Thanks Sandi nice to hear from you. I am being reasonable for the most part I havent separated our finances yet. I guess we have to wait until the L meeting and house sells. Interested to hear your take on this Sandi? It becomes a fight and she loses her cool while I remain calm if I talk to her about this stuff. I dont say much because I dont have all the answers. She has not pushed for D at all. But if I pull the support I feel like she would.

Things dont seem to be working because we have no dialogue we have no positive interactions. Which we were having before. Sandi- 2-3 years geez... patience... I want to have more kids. I want my family back. I want my daughter in my house every day. Maybe thats why it felt better being together and having those positive interactions. Now there is none of that. Maybe the distance is a good thing I just cant see it. She is so stressed with the move we cant have much of anything positive now unless I focus on D3. So I guess that is what works. Stop focusing on W.

I cant cut her off as guys are suggesting. Im trying to not be mr nice guy. But I still want to be kind and build trust and friendship hoping it leads to more during a difficult time. Detach lovingly is very hard for me. Im giving her money and its enabling her to start her own life separate from me. Many men here say stop enabling her, cut her off. If I bring this up with her she says you cant stop me and its a fight. Legally she could take half the money in our checking account a therapist told her to do that 6-8 months ago and to get her own place. Everything is in both our names except cars and a rental property. She waited until I agreed to support her getting her own place... living at her parents in a bedroom for a year when shes used to a 4000sq ft house... spending almost no money. She is NOT spending a lot or doing anything malicious. She is packing almost the whole house since Im working and shes not.

Honestly shes a good woman, even though her emotions are all messed up. Otherwise I wouldnt still be here. Im trying to be the lighthouse. I have gotten a lot of support here but there is so much information much of it conflicting.

I want to do what works Im just struggling to figure out what does actually work.

[SteveLW]

"I want to do what works Im just struggling to figure out what does actually work."

So question. Has what you've been doing up to now been working?

[Did]

No it hasnt been working. A few weeks ago she mentioned us dating again in the future. I dont think Ive been strict enough and strong enough. I have stopped pursuing and texting a lot but thats about it.

W is here with D I Was working in my office. Then helped pack some. Emotionally heavy. Yes I knew move was coming. But its such a heavy sad feeling separating everything. Dressers clothes etc. Lot of memories. Cant help but feel like its over she has to strongly dislike or hate me to want this. To separate everything lose everything we have.

D3 just yells mom are you every going to have another baby... as shes looking at her old baby stuff. Says well I want one and dad wants one.

W shows no emotion. Just anxiety, stress, anger. She says were moving in two weeks I cant think about anything so stressed about move. I dont think she really knows what stress is I run a program of 700 athletes and have hundreds of parent emails coming in the last two weeks. I have a property management business with 20 some properties. There are more stressful jobs than mine for sure. Stress is part of life.
Stress comes in waves.

Gotta detach. Gotta dance in the rain not wait for the storm to pass. Deep breaths... thanks all

[SteveLW]

"No it hasnt been working."

When it isn't working, change it. However, I will caution you. If you are out GAL, instituting 180s (changing behaviors that didn't work in your MR), detaching, and being as awesome as you can be, you need to be patient before saying "it isn't working".

Every sitch is different. So there isn't one size fits all for these things, but you should always be detaching, GAL, 180ing and being as awesome as you can be.

[sandi2]

You have explained the financial situation several times. In fact, I think you had already given your word that you would pay her rent, before you ever started posting on the board. So, you have backed yourself into that corner and the only smart thing to do is talk to your lawyer (privately).

Yes, you are supporting her while she goes off to have a life apart from you. I think whenever a WW leaves her H to have a life separate from the one he provided, she should not expect to continue drawing benefits from that M. She should get a job and support her own lifestyle. Now that is JMHO about waywards. You have said repeatedly what a great mother she is and how you are getting out cheaper paying her the money not to work, rather than paying for day care. You've also stated she could legally go after half of everything you have. I plead with you to speak privately with your lawyer, and not discuss this in the presence of your WW.

Here's the thing, nothing is going to stay the same with her, once she has moved into her own place. Even if you give her half of everything, who's to say she will sit home with the child all the time? You can't control what she does, even if you are supporting her. However, knowing you are financially supporting, makes it stick in your craw when she's not doing what you think she should. She's going to find something to do and leave the child (at least part of the time), and she will want everything (and maybe more) that she feels is rightfully hers. So again, this is a decision you and your lawyer need to make. I don't think you can make it based on whether or not she may come back some day. Just like you can't put hope in her statement about maybe dating sometime. That's just too big of a risk.

I see the bind you are in currently. I see your reasoning, and I can respect you for sticking to your word. I also see what others are saying. The way I personally look at separation or divorce is to always have legal counsel when it comes to finances, property, and child custody. The person you knew as your W, can change on a dime and take advantage of you every way possible. You just never know. So, protect yourself (and your child) as much as possible. That needs to be in place before you worry about anything else. Protect, protect, and protect.

[Did]

We had some very positive interactions today a lot of talk about trusting each other being all we have. She said something like you need 4 hugs a day for some type of positive feelings and she was hugging me. I said only hug me if you want to. Dont do it for me. I stopped working, looked her in the eye we moved some things packed up the house. She is really good at compartmentalizing her emotions she does all this work and shows nothing. But then when we talk she says its really draining for her and I can see the emotion and hard decisions there.

Talked about accepting past mistakes and leaving them there. I dont think she is dating she is adamant about it and trying to show me her phone which I didnt look at. This came up when I talked about L advice, L told me I could include in the separation agreement (since I will have to be on the lease).
That no OM be there at all or no OM be there with D3. I told her if Im on the lease I get a key. She seemed surprised at that... fantasy land. I dont want to control her but if Im paying and on a lease the place is legally mine too.

She said if she were dating shed be projecting, and look how hard it is for me Ive been so messed up this last year. Im finally feeling stronger thank you for helping me etc. Focused on getting a safe space out of her toxic living situation, healing, working on herself and starting working.

I mentioned the finances and rental / lease me being giving / enabling. She said its not enabling if Im not doing anything. I believe she is truly trying to get to be her best self.

She said all this... but can I believe anything she says. I dont know. I feel like this board makes me feel like I cant believe her. And I honestly do. But does she have feelings for OM she may very well.

She said it feels like she has no power since she has no money no job etc. I said something about our powers combined / our lives were set up to work together we both have our sterngths... and that the destiny of our family is in her control. Im trying to give her space and time but understand how hard it is now that Im also paying thousands of dollars for separate lives. She said she is going to be working and be making money by the spring if not sooner. Hard to just trust that.

I think how I handle this time is key! I have to be mentally strong. Tough but supportive, a friend but attractive, detached but consistent and loving. Sounds like a tall task but I will do my best. I work so much until mid July its hard to do much GAL except working out, reading, meditating, posting, being calm, cool, confident consistent (180's - used to be very up and down). I am up and down on here but more consistent on life.

We are meeting with a L the 26th and will come up with some type of separation agreement then. I will be adamant about protecting myself.

Thanks for being there.

[SteveLW]

"he said all this... but can I believe anything she says. I dont know. I feel like this board makes me feel like I cant believe her. And I honestly do. But does she have feelings for OM she may very well."

Hmmm, lets see. You tell her that you feel like giving her $2000+/month is enabling her, and she says I am not doing anything. LOL OF course she would say that. This is why you can't believe what she says. She is going to say what she has to in order to get what she wants.

They will tell you what you want to hear when it benefits them, and what you don't want to hear when that benefits them. WWs are all about themselves. Selfish to the max.

Keep working on you. Almost every lawyer I looked up online after our last exchange said you shouldn't give your WAS any money unless court ordered to do so. But again, it is up to you.

If you want her to be attracted do you she has to respect you. In order to respect you she has to see you standing up for yourself.