. It's a move in getting closer. Just be Fonzie cool and don't act like, "Yippe, oh boy"!!
Don't make any references to her sleeping in the bed or ask her if she's going to again.
Might not hurt to review short information on google about how to be the dominant male in the MR. Just to stay sharp and not fall into old comfortable habits of submission and passivity.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Well, she's back to not sleeping in the bed. Two nights in, two nights out.
Today was not a great day. We had a lunch reservation with three of our friends and we met them in the early afternoon. We ended up walking around and having a few drinks and were with them for 8 hours. It was a long day, and I was to the point where I was feeling a lot of negative things and wishing for alone time...and my W felt the exact same thing. This awkward tension began to build in the last few hours while we were out and she would ask what was my problem, while I could tell she had a problem, and so on. This is where I really need detachment because I cannot let her emotions affect mine and further feed her moods. I can see myself doing it and it definitely does not help.
She is so filled resentment and contempt and it is days like these where it shows. These are the times she refers to when she says her treatment of me is horrible. She becomes extremely irritable and takes it all out on me. It's in subtle ways, but she knows how to make me feel like trash. I don't know why she has the irritable moods in the first place. I know people have moods, but I can honestly say I have never had the feelings she has that come on seemingly unprompted. It isn't even always toward me, she has it with her friends. Sometimes the way she talks about being irritated/disgusted by someone is so excessive to me. With me, it's not like we have a fight and then she's mad at me. Sometimes there are small triggers, and like I mentioned I know I feed it sometimes, but it seems like she just gets spontaneously flooded with resentment. Then she is short with me, ignores me, just overall disrespect. Once my mom was there for an episode of this and she told me, "you have a LOT of patience." (My mom doesn't say negative things, but that is her version of saying my W treats me like crap).
Tonight when we got home she immediately said she felt suffocated by everyone and was going to bed and needed alone time. Fine, I think all of us were feeling that way by the end of the day. But then she stomps around, purposely ignoring me, and for the second night in a row walks out of the room to go to hers without a word or glance. But she always has some reason to come back out or say something to the dogs. I probably shouldn't have done this, but I told her I thought it was rude to not acknowledge me or simply say goodnight. Of course she had some snarky response about not needing to let me know.
Anyway, in this case I think this was all triggered by me going to my workout class last night. She has been competing with my GAL for time. It's like there is this subconscious pull for her to not want me to go do GAL stuff. So, last night I declined her invitation/request to go get dinner because I had to go to the class (which she knew) and I think she was none too pleased (too bad). But when I got back she was colder and descending into the resentment flood. I think somehow some of her resentment toward me is for "abandonment", for lack of a better word.
During the "mini-BD" that happened last year, she had an outburst of emotion/tears that only lasted for a second before she stifled them, but she asked if I had any idea how it made her feel sitting alone at home every night, especially while I was out with friends/coworkers (this was referring to before we moved and I worked full time with a very long commute). I commuted 1.5 hours each way through bad traffic because it was cheaper and easier for us/her to live closer to base. I got home 2-3 hours later than her most nights because 1. She often got off early at 3-4pm 2. Her commute was way shorter and 3. If I left at the "normal" 5pm, my commute would have been 2-2.5 hours home. My job was very flexible with hours and it made much more sense for me to work 10-6 for traffic reasons. So she got home around 4 while I got home around 7:30. And she waited around and began her TV addiction. This is the beginning of her losing her identity and all motivation to do things as she did before.
Probably less than once a month, maybe once in two months TOPS, my coworkers and I would go to happy hour. I would usually stay until about 9 (although I can remember at least once it was as late as 11), but my W would start calling as early as 7. Other people had wives/husbands, but mine was the one harassing me about when I was coming home. I will also note I invited her to come every time but the drive made that sort of difficult and she always declined. Anyway, all of this stuff became a huge emotional wound for her. Even though I don't really know that I did anything wrong. My commute sucked but it was unavoidable. And surely I should be able go to happy hour once every couple months and stay longer than 2 hours. Once a week, no. But this was not a common thing. Now, I feel I am reopening these wounds with my GAL. Perhaps it is necessary in order to kill the codependency. But it brings out such a huge part of her resentment, which is the number one enemy right now.
Also, she was texting a bit today and I don't know who. I know her ex has texted her in the past few days about promotions (this is one of the only times they talk). I also know that as long as she has this much resentment and rebellion aka waywardness, it's only a matter of time before she finds someone else to talk to or contacts OM. Maybe it's time to go back to tougher love.
M: 26 W: 26 M: 1.5 T: 3 No kids BD: 31 March 2018
W's affair began: 23 March 2018 Affair confirmed: 18 April 2018 Confrontation/claims she ended A: 14 May 2018 Ended in-house separation: July 2018
She slept in the bed again last night, but announced it was only because she was "afraid she might die from the paint fumes" in hers (I think they are doing work next door).
tell her enough with the comments... you're not ready to be with her anyway... she can always sleep on the couch if she is so unsure of you...
She talks about wanting to feel like she can breathe and be apart, but how it can't happen when we live together because both our feelings get hurt. If I do things on my own, she feels abandoned. If she does her own things, she feels guilty. I feel like she has so many "wrong" ideas...and then I remember how she always felt I think she's wrong.
so what... if she is wrong, she is wrong... tell her there is no reason for either of you to feel guilty whenever you do separate activities... you're cool with it... and she should be cool with your doing your own stuff too...
don't let her treat you badly... when she does, tell her no--it's not okay... she can be in a bad mood, anxious, whatever... but she is not to take it out on you... you are not to tiptoe around her... you are not to walk on eggshells... i was away last week, so i missed a lot in your situation... i also think i became frustrated with your situation... i felt like you were giving her too much credit where none was deserved... i do not trust WW... i don't trust their words, their tears, their fears... and i was feeling like you were putting too much hope in her return... i need to spend time catching up on your situation...
At this time, giving her space and taking space for yourself is critical. Don't fall back into sticking like glue to each other. That's too much right now.
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She is so filled resentment and contempt and it is days like these where it shows. These are the times she refers to when she says her treatment of me is horrible. She becomes extremely irritable and takes it all out on me. It's in subtle ways, but she knows how to make me feel like trash.
Look 44, these are tests. Yes, she resents you to the hilt, so are you just going to put up with it? Have you not listen to a word I've previously said? You need to stand up to her and tell her to cut the cr@p, or take a hike. Why are you doing this again?
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I probably shouldn't have done this, but I told her I thought it was rude to not acknowledge me or simply say goodnight. Of course she had some snarky response about not needing to let me know.
Sounds just like a nice guy, telling her you thought it was rude for her not to acknowledge you. Yeah, she had a snarky remark, b/c your pitiful remark turned her off.
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Anyway, in this case I think this was all triggered by me going to my workout class last night. She has been competing with my GAL for time. It's like there is this subconscious pull for her to not want me to go do GAL stuff. So, last night I declined her invitation/request to go get dinner because I had to go to the class (which she knew) and I think she was none too pleased (too bad). But when I got back she was colder and descending into the resentment flood. I think somehow some of her resentment toward me is for "abandonment", for lack of a better word.
Oh for crying out loud! Stop analyzing and making excuses for her. She is punishing you, plain and simple. Are you acting like a punished little boy?
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Also, she was texting a bit today and I don't know who. I know her ex has texted her in the past few days about promotions (this is one of the only times they talk). I also know that as long as she has this much resentment and rebellion aka waywardness, it's only a matter of time before she finds someone else to talk to or contacts OM. Maybe it's time to go back to tougher love.
So, basically, she returned home and returned to her same old behaviors.....and you've done what?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Do some of the points mentioned above like standing up to yor wife and gelling her to cut the crap and setting LBS boundaries when she keeps going back and forth emotionally apply to WAW also?
M(35) F(35) T(6) M(6) BD 10/25/2017 S 3/12/2018 LRT 4/3 D Served 4/30 D Signed (Me) 5/1 D filed with Court 5/21 D Final 7/6 Moving on with life and doing lot of GAL since 7/6 :-)
Artista, your advice is really helpful and I love when you give input. You are right I gave her far too much credit.
Sandi, I want to ask you about the pitiful remark you touched on in your last post. I get very frustrated with myself because I don't know why it is so hard for me to identify things like that before they come out of my mouth. I know I have had NGS for a very long time and I can't instantly fix it, but the hardest part is when I don't even see it and have to wait for the 2x4 from you guys here. So, using that instance as an example, how can I better address when my W decides she can ignore me? Or should that just be something I let go? I don't want to tolerate the disrespect, but I understand calling her out or just saying she is being rude isn't "enforceable" and just makes me look weak.
Emotionally, my detachment is getting better. I definitely had a setback with the whole confrontation and her coming home situation. Sort of felt like I took my eyes off the road. But I'm back on track. Now I am just readjusting to having to navigate all the daily interaction. We spent a lot of time together over the holiday weekend; I did a few GAL things on my own but there were also a lot of events happening with mutual friends.
I also struggle with things that aren't out of the house. For instance, since most of my friends are far away, I like to hop on and play online games with them. But I have some weird guilt about playing video games when my W is around. I've never been a big gamer or anything, but I would go months without playing at all since getting married. Now, I don't think I should feel bad at all if it's something I want to do in my down time, but I worry about it feeding my W's thoughts that I am not productive/responsible.
Her entitlement is still through the roof, but I have been standing up to her and she is catching on. If she asks me for something and I give her the look, she might say "nevermind, it's okay" or she will try to add "please". I guess it's a start that she is acknowledging the dynamic, but when is she going to stop asking in the first place? I think she still fully subscribes to the idea that she can ask/expect all kinds of things from me because she works (yes, I have told her I am not an employee just because she brings home the paycheck).
M: 26 W: 26 M: 1.5 T: 3 No kids BD: 31 March 2018
W's affair began: 23 March 2018 Affair confirmed: 18 April 2018 Confrontation/claims she ended A: 14 May 2018 Ended in-house separation: July 2018
I'm sorry if I let my frustration hurt your feelings. That was not my intent, and I am not being helpful if I hurt you. This is the remark I referred to as pitiful. Quote: "I told her I thought it was rude to not acknowledge me or simply say goodnight.". This was your W's way of showing you a little more disrespect and getting her control in the relationship. Perhaps you thought you were calling her out on rude behavior, but by your description, it just sounded kind of weak and petty. However, I wasn't there to see it or hear your tone of voice.
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Emotionally, my detachment is getting better. I definitely had a setback with the whole confrontation and her coming home situation. Sort of felt like I took my eyes off the road. But I'm back on track. Now I am just readjusting to having to navigate all the daily interaction. We spent a lot of time together over the holiday weekend; I did a few GAL things on my own but there were also a lot of events happening with mutual friends.
I am relieved to hear it.
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I also struggle with things that aren't out of the house. For instance, since most of my friends are far away, I like to hop on and play online games with them. But I have some weird guilt about playing video games when my W is around. I've never been a big gamer or anything, but I would go months without playing at all since getting married. Now, I don't think I should feel bad at all if it's something I want to do in my down time, but I worry about it feeding my W's thoughts that I am not productive/responsible.
Well, she has been obvious about how she views you doing anything that doesn't revolve around her. She wants you to accommodate your activities according to what she wants. Honestly, I think she intends for you to feel guilty when you aren't being productive or attending to her. You are entitled to do things you enjoy.
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Her entitlement is still through the roof, but I have been standing up to her and she is catching on. If she asks me for something and I give her the look, she might say "nevermind, it's okay" or she will try to add "please". I guess it's a start that she is acknowledging the dynamic, but when is she going to stop asking in the first place? I think she still fully subscribes to the idea that she can ask/expect all kinds of things from me because she works (yes, I have told her I am not an employee just because she brings home the paycheck).
You know how you said it will take time on your NGS? Same thing applies to her sense of entitlement. This has been the dynamic in the relationship, and she will continue to test you until you get enough of it. I think you are way too nice about it. Just giving her the look is not enough if you're going ahead and getting whatever she wants. Even if she adds a "please" on it, I think the only way to really break her from trying to "use" you to wait on her is to get rather short and have a "fed up" attitude about it. Not very nice, you say? Exactly my point! When a woman has stomped on a man with NGS for a long time, he often has to act not-so-nice before she treats him better. If you don't believe me, ask another WW.
There will be times you will get tired and just want to go back to how things have been in the past. It will never get better, if you give in to that old dynamic. She is trying hard to get to that level of control again.
So far, she has not shown remorse or humility since returning home. She is going to test what you said to her that day she came home, to see if you really stick to it. I think she will push the boundaries as much as she can and get by with it. So, don't expect to see any quick changes in how she interacts with you. You will have to hold her feet to the fire until she makes a change. It may feel as though it's been a long time, but it has been very short. It didn't have to be this way, but she was too stubborn and selfish to be willing to submit and behave like a loving, respectful W.
((hugs))
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
. It's a move in getting closer. Just be Fonzie cool and don't act like, "Yippe, oh boy"!!
Yeah, she had a snarky remark, b/c your pitiful remark turned her off.