WW in MLC affair and I need advice..

[Natash]

Thank you J9 and Nicole for the postive words.

I come today for some advice. We have a dance recital this weekend. I always take my girls out to eat after the final day of the recital as a way to celebrate their hard work. This year I feel that they are old enough to appreciate some flowers after the first show. The problem I have is my W is in one of the acts this year with D7. I know buying gifts, flowers,etc for brownie points is bad but when I got thinking about it, I could see myself giving the girls flowers and my wife thinking "yep, thats my typical old husband not thinking about everyone. He gives the girls flowers and doesn't even acknowledge my participation let alone all the sacrafice I took over the dance season getting out early from work twice a week to attend the girls practices." If I were to buy her flowers (from the girls and I), I think she might see it as a nice gesture (because I stopped buying her flowers. She told me to save the money or buy something else that lasts, flowers just die and are a waste of money. I never bought little gifts here or there as I never use to go into stores shopping. She did all the shopping and then over the years would say "its the little things. You dont need to spend much on something for a nice little surprise). I guess it would be a 180 for me but I struggle doing a nice gesture for her considering her actions towards myself and my family.

[TBSakaJ9]

I would do it.....and to clarify you are not doing it to score brownie points your doing it because your a man of character and it's the right thing to do. IMO

Just remember to have no expectations.

I went out and bought my W a Christmas present but it was from my girls. She got me nothing but for me it was the right thing to do and I will do it for her birthday as well. When my girls get older and they are able to buy presents for themselves it will be a different story. But now they are innocent and don't really understand everything.

[MRay]

I would like to echo J9's comments. I took my daughter out and let her pick something for W's birthday even though she told me not to get her anything. Why? It was the right thing to do. My daughter got the experience of picking out something that she was excited to give to her mom, and W was happy when I told her D6 picked it out all by herself. I would get your wife a little token gift of some kind and have your daughters give it to her after you give them the flowers.

[sandi2]

Sorry for getting a little behind in your thread. I want to back up to something I think I failed to address previously.

Quote:
I am interested in knowing how you see conflict in the two. What do you see as "tough love" and "letting her go"?

I feel tough love would be to stand up to my wife and be firm with her. Like in the past she could roll her eyes at me over something simple that irritated her. Now I tell her "there is no need to roll your eyes at me, I find it disrespectful". Telling her that I won't share her or a bedroom with her also seems like it would fall into this category. Anytime there was a time she needed to feel the consequences of her decisions would be TL too. I guess I feel if I'm showing her feelings even if it is from tough love that it contradicts the let it go theory. I wouldn't show the little old lady for a roommate tough love. Maybe I'm misunderstanding or missing something?

Tough love is making right decisions based on your integrity, values, standards, belief system, etc........rather than based on emotions. They are not decisions for wrongful means. Tough love is requiring the other person to be responsible for their actions.

Let me address the last part of your statement above regarding the female boarder scenario. If your boarder was being disrespectful to you......yes, you would definitely apply a tough stance. In reality, a boarder would be told to leave, but we won't go there, at the moment. My point is, you are to be respected by all who live under your roof.

Letting her go does not contradict tough love. In time, you'll get it, so don't become discouraged. It might help if you googled it, to see it outside of your MR. I use the term, tough love, mostly with H's who have the NGS.......b/c it seems so foreign to their usual mindset. It is tough for the nice guy to stand up for himself. It's tough for him to show any type of hard line action. At best, his usual way is passive-aggressive behavior........which stinks! I can't say it strong enough......IT STINKS! A wayward W hates passivity and sees it as weakness. "Letting her go" does not mean you let your respect go, too. If she interacts with you, she has to show respect. If she lives under your roof, she has to show respect. She doesn't have to like you, but she has to show you respect.

Letting her go means you stop pursuing her. You don't try to have an affectionate relationship while she is in an affair and/or being disrespectful. You stop trying to control her personal time and activities. It means you stop showing her your emotions and sharing your feelings with her. It means you don't compromise with her wayward behavior. You don't do sappy things to get on her good side. You don't over explain yourself to her. You stop trying to impress her.

I can not stand the constant cellphone use/messaging but haven't thought of a way to discuss it without coming across as controlling

Would it bother you if a boarder was on spending their time on their cell phone, or would you ignore it?

So I am biting my teeth and bearing it knowing I can't control her and she will do disrespectful and hurtful things while wayward.

I have a couple of thoughts about this ^^^^^^^. First, you've never controlled her. I mean, she was cheating on you.....and you M her anyway, so that should have shown you her capabilities. You just want to control her. Second, if you are biting your teeth and bearing it b/c you "can't" control her........then you are giving her too much control over your head space. Don't you think that's a little crazy? Let it go. However, don't accept disrespect directed at you.......from her, or anyone else. Don't mix your thinking and believe that requiring respectful treatment is the same thing as trying to control her. Know what I mean?

Quote:
You think of her and treat her as if she were no more, and no less, than an elderly lady staying there for room/board. If you'll work at having that mindset toward her, I think you'll see a difference in your feelings.....and certainly in actions.

This was very helpful in getting me to focus and relax with our routine interactions and move towards detatching. The struggle comes when my W and I interaction s envolve the girls. Last weekend I told the W I was taking the girls to the Maple Festival. She could join us if she wanted to but if not she could stay home. She joined us and it was a pleasant day. We went out to lunch and the W thanked me twice afterwards (hasn't thanked me for going out to eat in months even before A). I feel these situations allow her to cake eat.

[/quote]

Well, sure it let's her cake eat, but I think there is a bigger problem in what you've just said. You want to control the entire situation, and if's obvious to me....I think it is to her, as well. You don't want to stand up to her, and yet, you don't want her to eat cake..........but you invited her along on for family activity. So what did you expect? She enjoyed it and thanked you. Did that make you feel she just got a serving of cake? Your thinking is your biggest problem at the moment. If she's going to live in the home with you.......she is going to get a certain amount of cake, it's unavoidable to an extent. In this particular instance, you invited her! It's as if you threw her party, but didn't want her to have a good time. So, since she did enjoy it, you start thinking it is cake eating.

Calling her out has worked every time. I don't think she used to it might it might change if she does. Yesterday we were leaving D5 spring concert and she started bit*hing about where I chose to park. She gave me a smartass "yeah, great place to park, we are getting out real quick!", I stearnly and calmly said " I didn't say we'd get out quickly, I said I picked this spot because it would be easier to get the truck out of (a parking lot full of vehicles). "Oh yeah" she said, "it worked great". I looked over and firmly said " are you done?!" She said with a smirk "nope!" But that was it, she dropped the topic.

Look, Natash, that ^^^^^^^ wasn't calling her out. That was you explaining your parking choices. Plus, she ended it on a disrespectful note. I doubt she even suspected that you were trying to refer to her disrespectfulness. When you asked if she was done......it only challenged her.

Just a tip for the future........don't ask her questions when you are addressing her disrespect. You ask her nothing like you did in that instance. Tell her she is being disrespectful. Then, if she continues to speak disrespectfully.....be prepared to carry through with an action. Do you see how she ended it on her terms......and not b/c you were telling her to stop the b'tching?

***************************************************

On a different note, I've been following some other threads and when I read this one (below) I felt like every word you spoke to rminer and his situation is exactly like my situation. I never sit still and am always working on the house or something (until BD). My wife has told me that she feels like she is not appreciated at all, she feels like the family maid, and I thought she hadn't contributed to the success of our family.

My question is, when I read this and feel so much like you are speaking about my situation should I follow the advice you give to someone else in a same situation as myself?

Rminer worked every spare moment after he would leave his job, but he wasn't doing the work his W had left undone......or whatever was considered her work in the house. His W did the usual housework, homeschooled the kids, etc. Unless I have forgotten, he was not working on housework chores.......like cooking, laundry, cleaning, etc. He was working hard to finish building their house. I felt he had become negligent toward the emotional needs of his W. It's easy to do when a man is working himself into an early grave! He can lose sight of the current emotional needs of his family, b/c he's so busy providing the practical needs.

How can your W feel like a maid when her H is doing everything so she doesn't have to lift a finger? I can't remember at the moment if your W is employed. If she is, then help her when the two of you get home, just don't do everything. Going from one extreme to the other is not the answer. If she is not employed, then don't leave your job and go home to do hers. Unless she has physical problems or some "real" excuse......a woman will not respect or appreciate a H who does everything just so she can sit around and do nothing.......or b/c she complains and doesn't enjoy doing it herself. If that is the case, then she is either lazy or has a sense of entitlement......or both.

Rminer's W was texting OM, but she wasn't staying out all night (unless I have forgotten, or getting sitches confused). At first, I didn't catch how he had tuned her out whenever she tried to connect with him. He wasn't listening unless it was regarding important practical matters. He saw small talk as her babbling about some nonsense. He developed such a bad habit of not listening, that now he struggles to really listen to her. So, if you are guilty of the same thing......start listening from your heart.

I don't feel impressed to give you the exact advice I gave Rminer. Maybe b/c I see you being too much of a "pleaser", and you wanting to pursue her. Your W is staying out all night without her H's knowledge, and while she has small children at home. However, if you think I'm wrong, we can talk more about it.

If you plan to continue with the mental attitude of interacting with your WW as if she was a boarder in your home.........you will have to be careful the way you word compliments and how you direct the praises. I would suggest you start very, very small and rather general or impersonal. In other words, you could compliment her on cooking a good meal. You would do that for a boarder (if she cooked something), right? You can show appreciation without going overboard, can't you? If not......then it is likely to have a reverse effect with a WW.

For example, you told how she responded when you gave her a big complement about her stunning looks. Now I ask you.......why on earth would any female react to receiving that kind of complement? A WW hearing it from her H can react just exactly how you described. When her heart is that closed off and cold to her H.......she won't appreciate his complements, like a normal W. She sees him as kissing up. And if that's the case with your W, it's best to just leave it alone for now.

I think a father giving his daughters flowers is very special. But you know, they'll still expect dinner, too.........right?

It gets complicated when you mix in the WW, trying to decide what to do about her. Did you say she is dancing in the recital, also? If it were me, I'd just wait about starting a new tradition at this particular time. My question to you is.......why flowers now? You said you thought the girls were old enough to appreciate flowers, but seriously......isn't this more about your need to show your W something (either positive or negative)? Coming up with this idea, leads me to highly suspect you have ulterior motives. I just don't think you can do it without expectations.

[Natash]

Sandi you bring happiness to my night. It is refreshing hearing from you the way it is and what I am doing or not doing correctly.

Letting her go means you stop pursuing her. You don't try to have an affectionate relationship while she is in an affair and/or being disrespectful. You stop trying to control her personal time and activities. It means you stop showing her your emotions and sharing your feelings with her. It means you don't compromise with her wayward behavior. You don't do sappy things to get on her good side. You don't over explain yourself to her. You stop trying to impress her.

I am consistently following all of these "rules". I no longer share my thoughts or feelings, no small talk, I don't ask her plans or when shell be back. I can't remember when the last time I touched her was. I traditionally over explain at times but that has stopped. My dialog to her is short and to the point. I am seeing things about my w that I don't like and in the past excepted as w being w. It makes it easier to see her move along the journey she must take.

Would it bother you if a boarder was on spending their time on their cell phone, or would you ignore it?

So there is two answers to this question. It would not bother me from a boarder and I've accepted that my wife has spent and will continue to spend a lot of time (in comparison to the time in the evening that family is available) on the cell. The problem I had was it was at the diner table and I am trying to raise my girls to have respect for rules and be polite. Cellphone use does not belong at the family dinner table (it is not polite) or setting good example.

So I am biting my teeth and bearing it knowing I can't control her and she will do disrespectful and hurtful things while wayward.

I have a couple of thoughts about this ^^^^^^^. First, you've never controlled her. I mean, she was cheating on you.....and you M her anyway, so that should have shown you her capabilities. You just want to control her. Second, if you are biting your teeth and bearing it b/c you "can't" control her........then you are giving her too much control over your head space. Don't you think that's a little crazy? Let it go.

As far as I know, the first time she cheated was after the wedding but I get your point. I have at times let her get into my head too often. I do understand you about any show of disrespect is not acceptable.

Quote:
You think of her and treat her as if she were no more, and no less, than an elderly lady staying there for room/board. If you'll work at having that mindset toward her, I think you'll see a difference in your feelings.....and certainly in actions.

This was very helpful in getting me to focus and relax with our routine interactions and move towards detatching. The struggle comes when my W and I interaction s envolve the girls. Last weekend I told the W I was taking the girls to the Maple Festival. She could join us if she wanted to but if not she could stay home. She joined us and it was a pleasant day. We went out to lunch and the W thanked me twice afterwards (hasn't thanked me for going out to eat in months even before A). I feel these situations allow her to cake eat.

[/quote]

Well, sure it let's her cake eat, but I think there is a bigger problem in what you've just said. You want to control the entire situation, and if's obvious to me....I think it is to her, as well. You don't want to stand up to her, and yet, you don't want her to eat cake..........but you invited her along on for family activity. So what did you expect? She enjoyed it and thanked you. Did that make you feel she just got a serving of cake? Your thinking is your biggest problem at the moment. If she's going to live in the home with you.......she is going to get a certain amount of cake, it's unavoidable to an extent. In this particular instance, you invited her! It's as if you threw her party, but didn't want her to have a good time. So, since she did enjoy it, you start thinking it is cake eating.

Thank you for clarifying. I invited her and had no expectations. Enjoying and saying thank you was not seen at that moment as having cake but later on when I was thinking back I was frustrated that she gets the best of both worlds. Hearing you say living together there will be some cake eating and no way around it makes it easier to accept.

Calling her out has worked every time. I don't think she used to it might it might change if she does. Yesterday we were leaving D5 spring concert and she started bit*hing about where I chose to park. She gave me a smartass "yeah, great place to park, we are getting out real quick!", I stearnly and calmly said " I didn't say we'd get out quickly, I said I picked this spot because it would be easier to get the truck out of (a parking lot full of vehicles). "Oh yeah" she said, "it worked great". I looked over and firmly said " are you done?!" She said with a smirk "nope!" But that was it, she dropped the topic.

Look, Natash, that ^^^^^^^ wasn't calling her out. That was you explaining your parking choices. Plus, she ended it on a disrespectful note. I doubt she even suspected that you were trying to refer to her disrespectfulness. When you asked if she was done......it only challenged her.

Just a tip for the future........don't ask her questions when you are addressing her disrespect. You ask her nothing like you did in that instance. Tell her she is being disrespectful. Then, if she continues to speak disrespectfully.....be prepared to carry through with an action. Do you see how she ended it on her terms......and not b/c you were telling her to stop the b'tching?

I love the tip, don't give her a chance to keep it going. I'll tell her she is being disrespectful period. If it continues she can walk home.

***************************************************

On a different note, I've been following some other threads and when I read this one (below) I felt like every word you spoke to rminer and his situation is exactly like my situation. I never sit still and am always working on the house or something (until BD). My wife has told me that she feels like she is not appreciated at all, she feels like the family maid, and I thought she hadn't contributed to the success of our family.

My question is, when I read this and feel so much like you are speaking about my situation should I follow the advice you give to someone else in a same situation as myself?

Rminer worked every spare moment after he would leave his job, but he wasn't doing the work his W had left undone......or whatever was considered her work in the house. His W did the usual housework, homeschooled the kids, etc. Unless I have forgotten, he was not working on housework chores.......like cooking, laundry, cleaning, etc. He was working hard to finish building their house. I felt he had become negligent toward the emotional needs of his W. It's easy to do when a man is working himself into an early grave! He can lose sight of the current emotional needs of his family, b/c he's so busy providing the practical needs.

How can your W feel like a maid when her H is doing everything so she doesn't have to lift a finger? I can't remember at the moment if your W is employed. If she is, then help her when the two of you get home, just don't do everything. Going from one extreme to the other is not the answer. If she is not employed, then don't leave your job and go home to do hers. Unless she has physical problems or some "real" excuse......a woman will not respect or appreciate a H who does everything just so she can sit around and do nothing.......or b/c she complains and doesn't enjoy doing it herself. If that is the case, then she is either lazy or has a sense of entitlement......or both.

Rminer's W was texting OM, but she wasn't staying out all night (unless I have forgotten, or getting sitches confused). At first, I didn't catch how he had tuned her out whenever she tried to connect with him. He wasn't listening unless it was regarding important practical matters. He saw small talk as her babbling about some nonsense. He developed such a bad habit of not listening, that now he struggles to really listen to her. So, if you are guilty of the same thing......start listening from your heart.

I don't feel impressed to give you the exact advice I gave Rminer. Maybe b/c I see you being too much of a "pleaser", and you wanting to pursue her. Your W is staying out all night without her H's knowledge, and while she has small children at home. However, if you think I'm wrong, we can talk more about it.

If you plan to continue with the mental attitude of interacting with your WW as if she was a boarder in your home.........you will have to be careful the way you word compliments and how you direct the praises. I would suggest you start very, very small and rather general or impersonal. In other words, you could compliment her on cooking a good meal. You would do that for a boarder (if she cooked something), right? You can show appreciation without going overboard, can't you? If not......then it is likely to have a reverse effect with a WW.

For example, you told how she responded when you gave her a big complement about her stunning looks. Now I ask you.......why on earth would any female react to receiving that kind of complement? A WW hearing it from her H can react just exactly how you described. When her heart is that closed off and cold to her H.......she won't appreciate his complements, like a normal W. She sees him as kissing up. And if that's the case with your W, it's best to just leave it alone for now.

After your input and two others, I won't be complimenting the w on anything but cooking or other kind gestures but nothing based on her looks. The W works full time and had never been lazy but there are times lately she has become lazy. The maid comment was from post BD when I did the dishes,trash, bottles and cleaning of the home but nothing else inside for daily chores (but was always busy working on the home or the yard)

I think a father giving his daughters flowers is very special. But you know, they'll still expect dinner, too.........right?

It gets complicated when you mix in the WW, trying to decide what to do about her. Did you say she is dancing in the recital, also? If it were me, I'd just wait about starting a new tradition at this particular time. My question to you is.......why flowers now? You said you thought the girls were old enough to appreciate flowers, but seriously......isn't this more about your need to show your W something (either positive or negative)? Coming up with this idea, leads me to highly suspect you have ulterior motives. I just don't think you can do it without expectations.

I had a conversation with a friend last year about how it was nice seeing I started a tradition by taking the girls out after recital weekend each year. She said she still remembers how nice it was to get flowers and go out to eat each year when she danced as a girl. I bought flowers for the girls for the first time on Valentine's day and they loved them. I know at the recital they will be seeing other dancers get flowers so considering those two things I was going to add that (along with dinner out) this year. Something special from dad. The W is dancing in one act this year with d7. I do not have ulterior motives and am glad I've come here for advice on this now. I want to make sure I'm not sending the wrong message or taking a step in the wrong direction. ATM I am thinking I will have the girls pick something out or get a gift card to a store the w likes to shop at and have the girls give it to the w when we get home as a thank you.

[sandi2]

I am consistently following all of these "rules". I no longer share my thoughts or feelings, no small talk, I don't ask her plans or when shell be back. I can't remember when the last time I touched her was. I traditionally over explain at times but that has stopped. My dialog to her is short and to the point. I am seeing things about my w that I don't like and in the past excepted as w being w. It makes it easier to see her move along the journey she must take.

Just a couple of words of caution about going too silent. The children need to see their parents interact, especially at the dinner table. You should not go overboard and not say anything to your W. Many H's have problems balancing talking too much or not talking at all. The rule was designed for those men who want to talk, talk, talk, and talk more. They want to talk b/c they feel it draws the WW/MR closer.....but it doesn't. You can save small talk for the dinner table, or talk with the girls about their activities, but don't go cold silent to your W. It would make you look as if you were mad.....or just being a jerk. See what I mean? You have to stay balanced with this stuff.

[Natash]

I am consistently following all of these "rules". I no longer share my thoughts or feelings, no small talk, I don't ask her plans or when shell be back. I can't remember when the last time I touched her was. I traditionally over explain at times but that has stopped. My dialog to her is short and to the point. I am seeing things about my w that I don't like and in the past excepted as w being w. It makes it easier to see her move along the journey she must take.

Just a couple of words of caution about going too silent. The children need to see their parents interact, especially at the dinner table. You should not go overboard and not say anything to your W. Many H's have problems balancing talking too much or not talking at all. The rule was designed for those men who want to talk, talk, talk, and talk more. They want to talk b/c they feel it draws the WW/MR closer.....but it doesn't. You can save small talk for the dinner table, or talk with the girls about their activities, but don't go cold silent to your W. It would make you look as if you were mad.....or just being a jerk. See what I mean? You have to stay balanced with this stuff.

I guess I didn't explain that well enough. The W and I do interact and talk about the kids and their activities or our activities together, especially at the dinner table. I look forward to each night asking them about their day. The few times I have been upset and stone silent the W picked up on it and said "what did I do wrong for you to be jerk" or "what's with the attitude" so after those I realized I need to do a better job at fake being happy.

This weekend started out tough for me but I don't feel like getting into that right now. However, my girls had their recital and did amazing jobs. D5 in K has moved up and danced with 2nd graders this year. D7 in 2nd grade moved up and danced with 3rd graders. I was looking forward to see how they did and was proud to see both of them leading their groups. I saw no mistakes in the 7 acts they did, it was great. I gave them each a dozen roses and the W got them stuffed animals. I let them pick a restaurant to go to tonight where they both held hands and presented Mom with a gift card to TJMaxx as a thank you for all of her help with dance this year. The W was glad and said "thank you, that wad nice" and that is where the good vibes end.

At one point tonight while eating, the W told me that my MIL was thinking about going out to eat with us but said she'd take the girls out next weekend when she "said something about having them for the weekend". Like clock work, every other weekend the W will make plans. Last weekend the girls were upset and nervous so if Grammy has a sleepover the w wouldnt have to face that guilt. I have plans for all day Saturday and maybe Saturday night to be hanging out with a buddy and going to look at buying a new motorcycle. Also, I realized the W moved out her sleeping bags, hiking boots back packs and snow shoes. I could see her wanting gear to do a hike his summer but snowshoes aren't needed for almost another year. This tells me she's not planning to stay at mom and dads when they are at camp and then come back. It looks like she's moving out her belongings that aren't used often. I know I'm analyzing but so want to say something to her. I also saw a college online course BA program outline on the night stand and Im struggling with that. She could borrow $50k and the L said I'd be on the hook for half the cost. It's so tempting to bring the moved items, college paper and I'm not staying in an open marriage/she has done nothing to work on the MR up in a conversation. Each day that passes is closer to the day she moves out but I'm feeling more and more used and abused and I respect myself more than that. I am more valuable and deserve better. I want to be with someone that wants me. I can file and secure my financial status but garauntee any chance at recon reduced to almost nothing. What if4 months out my W realizes what she has done and wants to fix things? I need to do what's right for myself and my two daughters. I love my wife but question is doing DB worth it if this is truly who she is/what she is capable of? I have lost almost all respect for her. I know bringing anything up would lead to a conversation about the R so I haven't done that but just felt like running my thoughts by others tonight.

On a good note, I got invited tonight by a buddy I rarely get to see to join him on a once in a lifetime 6 day canoe trip next Month right around my birthday and I think I'm going to join him. I wish I had more than two weeks vacation because I'm also planning to go to Yellowstone this summer to visit another buddy who has been there for 18 years wondering when I'm going to come visit! Couple that with our pool, camping trips, and a few day trips I'm planning with my girls, I will be having fun this summer,!

[LH19]

Each day that passes is closer to the day she moves out but I'm feeling more and more used and abused and I respect myself more than that. I am more valuable and deserve better. I want to be with someone that wants me. I can file and secure my financial status but garauntee any chance at recon reduced to almost nothing.

Your W asking you what she did wrong, why are you acting like a jerk is fuching hilarious to me. That's how wacked out they are right now.

You are more valuable and do deserve better! Protect yourself financially, if that means filing for D then file for D. The biggest misconception on this board is that if you stand up for yourself and demand respect and file for D that eliminates any chance of recon. I argue to the contrary. Most of these sitches have to go through D before there is a chance at recon. The funny thing is you will have moved on by then.

Stay strong my friend!

[sandi2]

Hey Natash, how has your week gone? Any plans for the weekend?

[Natash]

Thanks for checking in Sandi. It has gone smooth other than D5 getting the Noro Virus, 10 of 13 kids in her class got it the same day as well as 12 of 14 in another Kindergarten class!. Of course the W came to me in a panic to help clean up the vomit. I've always done that task whenever one of us is sick but the whole time I'm cleaning I was thinking oh how the W will love this when she's on her own. She had been friendly a handful of times, temp checking I think. Last night the girls and I wanted to go for a walk around our new neighborhood now that it is getting a little warmer out and light later on. The W joined us. I haven't heard her made up story of what she's doing this weekend yet but tomorrow I am going to help a buddy work on his home in the morning. In the afternoon I'm going with a buddy out of state to buy my birthday present to myself...a new motorcycle. The W doesn't know but I figured it would be best to keep it a secret until she moves out. I have to do it this weekend because it is a holdover and the savings are to good to pass up. Some might think it is a bad idea but I've always loved riding, especially dual sport bikes. Ive had two street bikes since I've been with my w but decided to sell the last one when D5 was born...no way to take two kids to daycare. I owned it so sold it and put the money into a CD. After BD, I read to take up an old hobby. So I decided it was a good time to get back on two wheels. I rode with a buddy last year, it was the first time on a bike in five years