I'm really glad to have found this forum. I have so much to process still. So many questions, no good answers. I'm sure my wife isn't having an affair, but she's so fried from working nonstop for 8-9 months now that she's not thinking straight and I've become her whipping boy. Just before Christmas she dropped the separation bomb on me. I was and am still shell shocked but I thought we'd climbed out of it since mid-Jan when she said the fog had lifted, she didn't want to break up and "I don't know who that person was -- I was just going crazy!" From then until this past Sunday (April 1) we'd really reconnected. Tons of sex, lots of date nights, countless "I'm in love with you/were soulmates/etc" and an amazing vacation in Mexico only 10 days ago without kids where it was as if we were on our honeymoon again. Then last week things got really bad at her job and she snapped again saying she needs space and doesn't want to be married. She can't explain it, says nothing is wrong with me, she just wants to be alone. Says she's not ready for divorce but wants to move into our guest room and find a therapist for herself. She doesn't even want to work on our marriage at this point. She told her brother last night that we're likely separating, so it seems we're past the point of no return now. Thanks for listening, I'm a shell of myself, but following the awesome advice of you kind people on here is such a support.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Welcome to the MLC Forum. I am pasting in Cadet's Welcome thread w/lots of homework, so read and ask questions as they come along.
Welcome to the MLC Forum. You will meet people who are at various stages of dealing w/the fallout of their spouses being MIA. I am going to post below, Cadet's Welcome Posting. Please read the links and then come back and ask questions, if you should have any.
Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support)
I have read a good deal of books on the subject and can give you some suggestions when you are ready.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
I will give you a bunch of homework assignments to read.
This POST is under reconstruction and we will be working on this as time goes by, this is the most current version.
Now you have all the tools to read. Let us know how your doing and if you have any questions.
I suggest that you read the entire thread in the resources. You can also pick out some people and read their whole story.
Depression is the key to the whole thing and it is always present!
Believe none of what he/she says and 50% of what he/she does.
I would not ask him/her anything unless you can have no expectations. Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure. You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H/W as controlling or pressure.
Lets not worry about him/her. Lets work on you! Start your homework assignments. Something to DO while you are on moderation. GAL. Eat, sleep, exercise and take a deep breath. In general take care of your self first.
Detach the single most important thing to DO.
Your H/W has given you a gift THE GIFT OF TIME use it wisely
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon _________________________ Me-63, D30,S29
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Welcome Jase and sorry you are here going through this. Read, post and ask questions as there is a wealth of knowledge and experiences here.
Me 49 W46 T25 M22 S22 D18 S13 W had EA Apr-Jul 2016 Dropped Bomb 7/9/16 ILYBINILWYA HER DIVORCE IS FINAL...8/18/17 Dropping the rope to SURVIVE & THRIVE!!!
I’m sorry you are here. I heard so many of the exact same words two years ago so let me say first...this is a marathon.
So let me put this out there. I’m going to say there is a pretty good chance your w is at a minimum very attracted to OM and doesn’t know what to do with those feelings. Maybe it’s crossed into EA maybe it’s crossed into PA. You don’t know.
At a minimum she is confused: let’s separate. Let’s stay together. I love you. I don’t want to be married to you. Let’s have lots of sex. Let’s stop sleeping together.
So don’t say it’s past the point of no return. Take care of yourself. Live one day at a time. Don’t think about the future. You have no idea where this road leads. Give w lots of space. Detach. Do the homework.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
What you described sounds a lot like a phenomenon called Hysterical Bonding. While it may not be related to an affair it is usually related to one. I know you don't believe that and I'm a random guy on the internet who is rather jaded and am making assumptions based on limited information.
Therapy for both of you is probably a good idea at this point. I'm surprised that Christie hasn't been by with the contact info for Michelle's team. A number of people (I wasn't one) have found them helpful. Therapy together might not be productive as each of you have to get your heads straight before you can figure things out as a couple.
I would suggest giving her the space that she's asking for. If she's of a certain age menopause can certainly play havoc with a woman's thinking and emotions. Don't suggest that yourself though - I know from painful personal experience how that turned out But she may want to see her MD to just make sure that everything is balanced.
She sounds very wrapped up in her work which I presume is high stress. Perhaps her therapist (not you!) may have some suggestions on how she can better manage the stress.
Good luck
On BD H52, W50 T27, M26 S21, D23 BD-9-Mar-16 D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18 I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good. But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
Thank you so much everyone! It's spring break here so I was out with the kids all day. I'll post more shortly -- I'm very eager to read up on this stuff later and give more of my story. Still in shock, but hoping for some clarity in the weeks and months to come. Bless you all!
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Hello again dear friendly people. In laws are staying here so wife's been sleeping in my bed but says she wants to move into guest room when they leave. She's now saying she'd prefer that over the crazy expense of getting a nearby apt. Not sure if that's progress or not. I'm having trouble knowing what specifically I need to do to "detach" and what "boundaries" to set. Last night she came home so defeated by her crazy stressful job and just kept wanting to hug me. At first I didn't want to but then I could tell she really needed it. Then in bed she continued being really touchy but not necessarily in a sexual way. I was so exhausted as I'd barely slept the last two nights so I just went to bed. She said "I love you" a couple times and "I've not given up on us and I don't think I want a divorce," but when I pressed for "what's it mean that you still don't want to be married then?" And she said "I don't know...I'm talking to a therapist at 3pm tomorrow who can hopefully help me." Like I've read several times, I believe none of this and I'll skeptically accept 50% of what she does.. Thank you all again.
ps I guess because I'm new I have to wait a day before my posts show up...kinda frustrating to have any real conversation this way for now. Curious how long this probation period is for.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
All new posters are on moderation for a very short period of time. Please be patient as I'll be putting in the request today. We generally like to see at least 5 or so postings.
If your w wants to move into the guest room, don't argue the point...just let her do it. They need space and time to work through their issues and in her mind, she's going back to being a teenager. Did you read the home work posting that I provided to you? If not, please do so. You will find a lot of info that may help you. There is also a detachment thread that will provide some very easy things to help you figure out how to detach lovingly from your situation.
Keep the focus on you. One of the hardest things is accepting that she's no longer the person you fell in love with as she's going back in time. Also, I found it difficult to be patient, but you are on a journey as well. This is not a sprint...but a marathon and you certainly did not break her, therefore you can't fix her.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Thank you so much, Job. Very helpful words again. Yes I've begun reading all of the links and will have more time to devote to all of it shortly. This is like taking a college class with all of the ensuing homework, but I love it and find it therapeutic to get some answers and clarity even if I don't like what I hear all the time. It's very cathartic to have an outlet here especially with kind, empathetic people.
ps I appreciate you fast tracking my posting abilities
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
When you have some time, visit the other threads and post. The more you interact w/others, the more people will come over to visit your thread.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Sorry, one more thing that touches on a couple replies here addressing the possibility of an affair. I am 99.9% certain there hasn't been a physical affair, but I'm also nearly positive that as her job changed about 6 months ago that she developed a sort of warped fantasy/infatuation with her new boss who lives a few hundred miles away. She has to be in that office near him every other week. He's single, loaded, handsome, charming, etc and she was swooning over him and I think had work crushes on the other supposedly dashing men who work with him for the first couple months. (I've not met any yet, fwiw.) She got crazy obsessed with the gym, dropped a ton of weight (is too skinny now), bought a ton of new, designer clothes in her new size, takes way longer to get dolled up for her trips down there or a couple hours of makeup if they're visiting the office here.
BUT, over the past few weeks she's totally changed her opinion, or so it seems for now. She now can't stand the boss who's beyond cheap and stubborn and working her to the bone just to make his company money. He's no longer charming and sweet and generous as he came across the first few months.
So, I'm guessing there was a 1-sided emotional affair as this guy wants nothing in life but to make money for his company, and I supposed she's realizing that now and is processing those feelings. Any time this has come up over the past couple months she vehemently denies ever cheating in any way...but of course I can't know for sure. Thanks again for listening. Bless you all.
Last edited by job; 04/06/1806:42 AM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Jase, as you said it is all speculation for now, but everyone is simply using their experiences with their MLCer and relaying it to you. In most of the cases here there were affair partners. They were either emotional (EA), or physical (PA). In my case it was EA that I know about and I can tell you it hurt just as much as a physical betrayal.
Originally Posted By: JaseP
She got crazy obsessed with the gym, dropped a ton of weight (is too skinny now), bought a ton of new, designer clothes in her new size, takes way longer to get dolled up for her trips down there or a couple hours of makeup if they're visiting the office here.
What you said here fit my sitch spot on. My MLCer did much of the same thing and when she knew she would be in the same vicinity of the OM would make sure she was as hot as she could. It was obvious later as to what was going on. She has always liked to look nice, but it got weird for sure.
I know everything is still new, but what are you doing to work on yourself for your own sanity?
Keep posting. Keeping learning. Keep growing.
Me 49 W46 T25 M22 S22 D18 S13 W had EA Apr-Jul 2016 Dropped Bomb 7/9/16 ILYBINILWYA HER DIVORCE IS FINAL...8/18/17 Dropping the rope to SURVIVE & THRIVE!!!
Hi sbj, thank you kindly for your reply. I'm now focusing on being the best dad I can be to my two little ones, and I'm so happy I've begun taking yoga again. I'm getting more mentally and physically fit as a result.
I'm debating being really sympathetic to her crisis, or just calling her bluff and cutting off all intimate contact and unnecessary questions and comments about her work and mt life.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Any time this has come up over the past couple months she vehemently denies ever cheating in any way...but of course I can't know for sure.
For those who haven't made a study of infidelity like many of us here through trying to untangle what the heck happened, most people have a very specific definition of what constitutes and "affair". Just ask Bill Clinton (sorry if I offended anyone's politics).
Emotional affairs / fantasy affairs can be just as damaging and sometimes more than when people get down and dirty doing the horizontal mambo. More so when both people are heavily invested in it. After all, our marriages weren't just about sex - heck for many of us who were married for a long time sex wasn't even all that frequent.
BUT - she probably doesn't see it as an "affair" and you can feel free to go along with that narrative. It is a huge red flag in your relationship though. I honestly don't know what to advise you as far as dealing with that goes though. I'm certainly not an expert but I hope you have ones available to you.
A few things that I've learned that are important in any marriage is openness, honest communication and recipocity. For a bunch of us here many of our marriages were pretty one-sided where either us as LBS were either carrying much of the load of the marriage or pretty much none of it. Have you given thought to how the dynamic of your own marriage and family falls into that? I'm not saying that you needed to both carry half of each load, that's unreasonable for most families, but do you think that both of you feel that the other is "doing their part"?
Just some things to think about.
On BD H52, W50 T27, M26 S21, D23 BD-9-Mar-16 D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18 I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good. But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
Andrew, I think you're spot on about her not seeing it as an affair or cheating, in fact, most people unfamiliar with the nuances of these issues would likely agree, but I totally see that having emotional feelings heavily stirred up for the first time in decades is WAY more damaging and so much harder to untangle than, say, a drunken kiss from a stranger at a night club.
My concern is that even if she's now shedding those feelings and acting like she wants to stay together (I don't allow myself to believe it though) isn't there a real risk that this could repeat again?
Our house guests have just left and so the guest room is free again. I'm REALLY struggling with forcing her in there or allowing her to stay in our more comfortable bedroom. I need to learn the tools to set strict boundaries, but I'm also worried that even if she misses me it could push her further away, mutual resentment and bitterness would set in again, and we'd be less likely to reconcile.
She keeps hugging me, calling me baby, giving the odd kiss these past two days since her last freakout six days ago. I feel like I need to call her bluff and cut off contact aside from issues relating to the kids.
I sooo appreciate any thoughts and advice. Have a great wknd, everyone!
Last edited by job; 04/07/1804:53 AM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
I would not "force" her to move into the guest bedroom. I would allow her to make that decision herself. You are coming across as an "authority figure, i.e., a dad to her. You don't want her to look at you that way.
The more you attempt to control her or sway her to your thinking, the more she will pull away. I hate to say this because you aren't ready to hear it...but you need to treat her like a roommate. Listen, validate and affirm her thoughts when she talks to you. If she asks for your opinion, then give it...otherwise, sit quietly and the answers will come.
As for the affair, they don't look at affairs the way we do. They look at them as just being friends and f@ck buddies and nothing more. She's a teenager right now and teenagers do not know the meaning of true love and how deep it runs w/people.
I would suggest that you not seek her out for conversations. Treat her like a roommate and go about your business. Discussions about the kids, bills, etc. are okay. Just leave her be...allow her to figure things out and yes, you need to dig really deeper for patience because you are dealing with a teenager who is out there searching for her inner self.
The crisis will not end today, tomorrow or next week and it could take years. While she is on her journey of self discovery, you are on one too and that means focusing on yourself and your kids. Do some of the things that you've put off doing, this is a good opportunity to start doing more w/the kids and no, you don't always have to invite her along. Go out for coffee and you don't have to tell her all of your business as to where you go and what you are doing. Be a bit mysterious. Make her wonder and miss you.
As for the kissing...your w doesn't know what she wants. She's bouncing between two worlds and trying to figure things out. Patience and more patience are need now.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Thank you Job for your wise wise words. She was the one threatening to move out or into the den, so perhaps I was mistaken to call her bluff and tell her I need the boundaries now too. Just this morning she went from being so huggy and needy to then flipping out that the playroom was a mess, screaming and lashing out at me and the kids, refusing to calm down.
I'm just confused as to what exact boundaries I set. I fear her wanting to be affectionate if she sleeps in my bed, and then having another repeat of the threats and abuse. I noticed she had her wedding ring off again and she said "we're not married" so I said "I can't be the chump" and took mine off too. Was this a mistake? Thanks for any advice, you're so kind to help out a newbie like me.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Sorry you are here, but you are surrounded by many wonderful people here.
Like Job said, let her make the decision to move to the other room or not. If you force it, that will be used to justify her behavior and feelings. It's difficult to sit back and be patient, but trust me, I learned a lot of things the hard way by reacting on anger and emotion instead of letting things play out.
It can be a long and difficult road. Right now do your best to focus on your kids and yourself. You will need to be the stable rock for them.
M
Me 48 H 46 S 11 M 2004 BD 8/13 H moved out 2/15 -live in the present, enjoy the beauty around and within you, explore your new future-
Thank you so much, Mleigh...it's just so hard. I had no idea. I'm trying my hardest to focus on my kids and not the looming fallout.
I'm so dreading the talk with my parents who are devout christians and will be utterly devastated. They adore her and our kids of course...I worry most that my dad who's 72 might have a breakdown of sorts.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
It's incredibly hard. Possibly the hardest thing you will go through. Your W sounds very confused, back and forth, so all the more to not play much into what she says.
I know it's WAY easier said then done, but just try to give her her space right now. I am not sure how to handle the on and off affection, my H went totally cold, but maybe someone here can give you advice on that.
Hang in there. You will need to dig as deep as possible for patience.
M
Me 48 H 46 S 11 M 2004 BD 8/13 H moved out 2/15 -live in the present, enjoy the beauty around and within you, explore your new future-
Thank you M, I hope you're right that it's true confusion and not solely pitying me. But I fear the worst. I can't make any sense of it, feeling totally numb and broken, I know I need to stay busy and happy for my kids, but right now I just want to curl up and die. No appetite, sleep deprived etc...
On a slightly positive note she's finally reached out and supposedly scheduled a therapy session with a woman who she said understood her situation very well when they talked on the phone. I know this is a marathon but I'm praying she gets her head straight sooner than later. I'm not the type to wait forever. My sister was just visiting and reminded me of how crazy work obsessed my wife has been all 20+ years we've known her...
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
If you feel suicidal, talk to a suicide help line. Seriously. I’ve been there. The pain can be so intense you feel you just want it to stop. It’s hard to see it now, but the intensity of what you are feeling now will not last.
A word of caution about talking to your family members for support. They will take your side. They see you in pain and want you to not be in pain too and as quickly as possible. Sometimes this takes the form of bad mouthing the spouse and supporting divorce as a way to stop the pain, which may be contrary to your own feelings, goals and desires.
Same word of caution on counselors. Some can be terrific. Others just want to see the pain stop and encourage divorce.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
JaseP, what you’re going through is very difficult and painful. What you are feeling is perfectly normal.
Being sleep deprived, depressed, having no appetite, etc... are all normal responses. Hang in there JaseP you will get through this.
Please listen to Gordie’s advice, I would tell you the same thing he did. I have been right at the edge ... it is a very dark place. The pain will subside, I promise you.
Heed the caution of listening to family, friends, therapists, etc... You should definitely reach out to people who love and support you. However, these same people do not want to see you suffer and will offer advice to “help” you get better as quick as possible. They mean well but may not align with your own feelings and desires. Advice is just that - advice. You make the decision, that goes for here and IRL.
My first and only IC, after telling her what happened at BD, told me to dump W and get a divorce. That was 10 minutes into the session. I was not going to do that. We didn’t see eye to eye on too many issues, always the quick fix. Anyhow, she fired me, asked me not to come back, after session four. I stayed true to who I am and how I feel - best decision I made.
In my experience almost everyone IRL will not understand what you are going through. How could they, until this happened to me I couldn’t imagine what I have gone through and what has happened. Here, people understand. I found it so helpful, I think you will too.
This is going to take some time. Know it will get better, YOU will get better. Remember that.
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Hi dnj! Thank you so much for the good advice. Last night was great as I finally unburdened myself to my oldest/best friend who's one of the only guys I know who could be any kind of good listener and offer up sound advice. It's been so freaking awful bottling up all of this angst since December with zero support. I came home around midnight and she was in our bed even though I thought we agreed she'd sleep elsewhere as I need the good mattress since I have lower back issues...plus, this isn't my decision, why should I have to leave my own bed? Anyway, she was contrite and apologetic for her earlier outbursts, going on again about how stressed she is from work and how it can't go on like this and how she knows she has to change.
I finally confronted her about my suspicions of her 1-way emotional affair with her boss and while she vehemently denied anything sexual whatsoever she's now claiming that he crossed boundaries pursuing a "close friendship" with her and she was willing to engage this for a couple months as he's the new owner of her company she needs him to be on her side as he's notoriously cheap with resources to anyone he's not close to. Whatever, it's pretty messed up all around. The guy loves to create drama and has no life or family outside of work and his coworkers who are all men, except for her. I'm glad she finally admitted to this inappropriate relationship that now she claims she wants to only be business/professional. It's clear to me this weirdness in her work life created this mess of feelings she's trying to untangle.
She took a shower this morning and called me over to the bathroom while naked and made sexy eyes and said "hey, I want to feel normal again" and I stupidly caved and we had sex for the first time in over a week. Sure it felt good, but I don't trust her at all regardless of her again saying "I love you, we're soulmates." She's been making more of an effort today to actually spend time with me and the kids and suggesting we do family stuff the rest of the day...
Stay tuned for the next episode of the JaseP soap opera! Haha... sorry I have to keep it a little light sometimes or I'd really go crazy.
ps yesterday when I was lower than low and said "curl up and die" I meant just feeling beyond awful. I'd NEVER kill myself, but I can see how that could come across that way. I've got too much to live for, namely my kids! Bless you all.
Last edited by job; 04/09/1808:31 AM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
You can detach and take care of you and the kids while she figures it out- Detaching has to do with letting go-accepting where she is- where you are- where the M is focusing on your happiness and how to get there and trusting somehow it will be ok No matter what she does
There are a lot of good men here to learn from You can stand for your M. and at the same time work on you- Change those aspects of yourself that do not work for you or the M.. Listen to her, Validate her and let go
as you can see she can be close one day..and far away the next so find hobbies, time with friends, support groups, church, gym ect and make your life work for you-
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
So I'm cautiously optimistic that my wife is serious about getting help and fixing the situation. She came clean about her big crush on her new boss that turned into a 1-way emotional affair. I can't fathom how something so supposedly one-sided could lead someone to threaten blowing up our family, so perhaps there's more to it, but I think I believe her that this never was physical and that he never crossed a line.
Still, they have to see each other and work together every other week or so still. She says she'll eventually quit, but as the betrayed one, isn't it reasonable she quit sooner than later?
For a few days now she's been quite remorseful, answering my questions, even suggesting a group therapy telephone thing about recovering from infidelity with Esther Perel.
I'm still numb and confused and feeling unproductive at work as I'm so distracted by all of this...
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
I got bombed Sep, 2014, my husband try to act 'normal' for months, we stayed at our apartment, during that time, he said he is sorry in one minute, next minute, he would say he hates me, I'm the one who ruined his life... he cried a lot and he ignored me. I was forced to walked on the eggshell and May 2015, he moved out of our apartment.
It was so difficult at the first year after bomb dropped, had no idea of how to set the boundary, I don't know how to respond to his request - he needs divorce.
Fortunately, I found this forum and the information of midlife crisis and am grateful for the help I have from so many great posts here !!
Keep faith and focus on yourself, get a life like she is not coming back (at least few years) love her from distance, pray for her.
me 44 husband 43 no kids married 12 years got bombed Sep. 2014 h moved out May 2015
Great advice, Babe, thank you for that. I've now signed up for kite surfing lessons and my kids and I have been enjoying church every Sunday again. I don't reach out or seem needy to her, in fact, earlier she asked if I thought about her during the day since I've stopped contacting her much.
One day at a time....i hope you've found peace since your split. Best wishes to you.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Jase, Our situations are pretty similar. I feel for you...man this is tough.
My W had an EA with a coworker. It was slightly physical, but no sex (couple make out sessions). I know this from snooping early on, I wouldn’t have believed no sex if she had just told me that. It ended and he is now married, but they still work together. It was about a year ago that it ended. I think the willingness to throw away the family for something shallow like that has to do with where their head is at, not as much about the validity of the relationship with OP. They want what they want and feel they deserve it. If they are giving so much mind space to someone else (regardless of if reciprocated or acted on), they leave no mind space for us. Hard to work on “us” if daydreaming about someone else (real or imagined).
I also have trouble with boundaries. I have been with her for 20 years and have trusted her unconditionally. We’ve never had the need for boundaries because neither of us have crossed each other like this before. I don’t recognize what boundaries need to be set until she crosses one. I imagine that is a common theme.
Just keep working on you and the kids. Vent to us and ask questions all you need and we’ll be here for you as much as possible. Just try not to initiate R talks. That has been my biggest fail. I’m a talker and a fixer. I have never liked to let issues sit. It is important though. For now, you guys are roommates. Pack your relationship in to a box and put it on the top shelf for later. It will be there if you need it, but for now it shouldn’t be your focus.
Sorry you are here, but you are among friends who truly understand what you are going through.
If she is truly looking at herself, and choosing to work on the M getting help and letting EA affair go-If she can do this-
she may not be in true MLC, maybe just bored and enjoyed the attention or the fantasy
If a person is in MLC, they become totally different beings they have a blank stare, not rational spend a lot, drugs , drinking, staying out late or not coming home- dressing younger, buys new toys like cars, motorcycles, tattoos, they become less responsible in all ways and terrible parents- You will know more later
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
Peace, I agree with what you said about those in MLC doing extremes, but I have also seen it in extremes the other way. Extreme fitness, weight loss, dressing more revealing, acting much younger, and has gone from a semi-decent homemaker to an OCD housekeeper. Also cutting themselves off from certain friends and family that disagree with their current decisions and lifestyle. These are to add just a few.
Me 49 W46 T25 M22 S22 D18 S13 W had EA Apr-Jul 2016 Dropped Bomb 7/9/16 ILYBINILWYA HER DIVORCE IS FINAL...8/18/17 Dropping the rope to SURVIVE & THRIVE!!!
Thank you all for the replies, you're all very sharp and insightful. It's so appreciated.
I'm not sure if she's in full-blown MLC or not, but I'm also not trying to be naive. She definitely became gym obsessed and bought all new fancy clothes in her new skinny size. She's done this before too though as her weight has fluctuated over the years. She also acts more "single" on social media. She posted something ridiculous a couple weeks ago after we had been on what i thought was a great date night. We'd been to a fancy restaurant and then to a friend's nightclub for a hip hop show. We had a great time with friends. She then came home that night and posted some silly hotel lobby photo and captioned it "got the blues (cry emoji) so what's a girl to do? Put on a slinky red dress and go dancing!" Nothing about me or our date, and we were never even dancing, by the way...she sees this as silly and inconsequential, but there have been other instances of her vaguely posting things suggesting she (we) have personal problems. Isn't this stuff inappropriate to share with her several thousand followers??
Anyway, since she came clean about her "fantasy/escape" life and her crush/obsession with her new boss she's really behaving differently and I'm reluctantly believing she's sincere and that this is all for the better. But what if I'm setting myself up for a big fall? Tonight I'm going to suggest she takes a polygraph soon. Maybe give her one last chance to tell me all so I can know exactly what I'm forgiving and we can then attempt to rebuild.
She swears up and down absolutely nothing physical happened, but how can I be sure? The trust is all broken now. I saw on her phone that OM rarely texted her back and that there were very few phone calls over the weeks. I also know that when they were working together lots of other people were around them. She also was usually good about face timing me and the kids each night where I could see she was at her hotel getting ready for bed.
It's a fact that she's in a high-powered, insanely stresssful position at work and that this "crush" of hers is even more busy, running several companies, surrounded by people too. I'm not saying the opportunity didn't ever present itself for them to be physical, and I know that she at least had the willingness too, but I also know this guy is insanely private and paranoid about anything even remotely scandalous happening within his businesses. She claims what stirred up so much emotion is that he was so blown away by her work contributions, constantly praising her, not to mention she said she knew he was attracted to her too as she caught him checking her out a few times. Sickening stuff to be sure...
Ugh, this is so hard...thanks for listening.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
I know how you feel Jase. My W had her EA with a coworker and it is hard for me to accept that it wasn't physical, although I have no reasoning or proof that it was more. For me I think that reading these boards about what other MLCers do has made me less naïve but maybe a little more paranoid. Like, if everyone has a PA and lies about it, and all her other behavior is straight out of the MLC playbook, then why wouldn't she do it and then lie. I feel like that feeling is justified, but maybe not always warranted.
The social media thing is weird. My W makes no mention of me on social media and posts stuff of her and the kids. Even with events I was at...or maybe I took the picture. It bothered me enough to pretty much stop using social media to keep my sanity. I finally stopped caring about that and just look at it as one more sign that she is still deep in it, despite the conversations we have about working things out. I suggest trying not to put too much stock in it. Its par for the course in MLC land.
Rebuilding trust is a hard thing. In my opinion, I don't know if I would push for a polygraph. Others may disagree, but I know my W would not respond well to that. If she says she didn't and you don't have any evidence to the contrary, you might try to accept that as truth for now. Just my 2 cents.
I agree...this is hard. The hardest thing I've ever endured. We're here for you...vent all you need.
I don’t get the social media broadcasts with insinuations, but it’s like mind reading—don’t do it, as you may have no idea what she really mean or intended. Like SJohn6, w frequently posts pics of her and sometimes the kids that I take but never us. Her relationship status on FB is blank. It’s a symptom of the problem, but not the cause, so if you can ignore it do so for your own sanity. And my w also had a one way EA with a colleague that did not become physical (feelings were unrequited) as far as I know, so it is possible.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Gordon! Thank you for checking in, buddy. I'm up and down, but more hopeful than not lately. Wife has tried to make amends with the extended family, promising she'll do whatever she can to earn back my trust and love.
I want to believe it all, but my guard is definitely up. I'm continuing to focus on myself and kids. Getting fit, exercising more, fixing up the house, etc. Started individual counseling last week. It feels great to have someone in my corner who I can vent to and seek guidance from. The therapist is also a marriage counselor and wants to bring in my wife after a few more sessions. We'll see how that goes!
Wife too began therapy last week and found it very valuable. I'm cautiously optimistic that we can turn this around eventually.
She now believes her boss is a psychopath. She's learned more about him from other coworkers recently and it's pretty concerning. She's trying hard to get a new job or to get laid off where she'd get a nice severance package. That's what I'm hoping for so she can actually have a real break and be more of a mom again finally.
Thanks again for checking in, I truly appreciate it!
Jase
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Sounds like she was intoxicated by his attention and praise
Good she is trying to make amends
Good you are both going to counseling
Why the dramatic change in such a short time
What do you want
What are you doing
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
I'm definitely watching her actions more lately, even though it's hard not to get too hopeful when she spews out all the right things. But her actions are still largely self-serving, especially when it comes to being a workaholic and not giving me or the kids much time despite saying this'll change soon. She's lettting her ego get in the way of her better judgment. She could quite easily negotiate being laid off and get a year's severance and finally get a break but she says instead of asking "those a-holes" for any favors she'd rather get a big "f you" job to show her boss (former crush/EA) she doesn't need them and to minimize any chance of her being cast as weak or not being able to hack it. To me that'd just be going from frying pan to fire...
I hope her therapist gets through to her because she doesn't listen to me.
In the last month or two she's realized her boss (the new owner) was only telling her all she wanted to hear, kissing her butt, praising her nonstop the first couple months when she fell for it. Now she's saying she thinks he's a psychopath/pathological and has a habit of doing this with others. No wonder his previous companies have been run into the ground. I've still never met him...
I want her to be 100% honest about everything. I think she's getting there, but of course my guard is still way up. I'm trying hard to be patient with her, but after 8-9 months of shouldering so much of the workload at home and with the kids I'm at the end of my rope.
Now it's not even so much about her emotional affair, it's about the disparity between what she says she wants (i.e. work/family/life balance, regain my love and trust, better mom and wife, etc) and what she's still doing which is burning the candle at both ends with her job and refusing to turn it off once she's home. Crying all the time about her job and the mess she's in. She knows she's completely consumed by her career and that it's killing her and us yet in my opinion she's not moving fast enough to extricate herself from the situation. I don't say this to her, at least not like this, because she's still so quick to anger due to her stress and anxiety...and I'm sick of the friction and wary of her flipping out and threatening to walk again.
It's tough! Thanks for listening, buddy. I always appreciate your feedback. Hope you're having a good weekend.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
She's definitely gotten much worse this past year. Not only with the job obsession but her anti-mom/wife attitude. She's finally now claiming she wants a real balance and to have her wknds be for the family, but I know it'll take at least another couple months or more before she's got a new job.
She was saying more often in the thick of her MLC-ish fog that "I've been a mom long enough giving my body and life to these kids, it's time to put me first." But even though she's now saying that we should come first her actions are entirely self-serving.
How much time do I give her to show me and prove she really wants this?
As far as me? I'm just trying to be a good dad. I need her to quit so I can work more again. I'm down to two days a week as I bear the burden of everything else, and even though I make more than enough to support myself and over half the expenses she holds it over me that she's the breadwinner. I've never asked her for money (we have our own accounts), but she flips out if I ever second guess her purchases, which are frequent and frivolous. She's always been a little wasteful but now it's gotten crazy. I don't even say anything about all the clothes she orders online, but frequently boxes from Amazon arrive with a case of something we have a ton of already... I mostly hate being on eggshells around someone with such a hot temper. I hope she's honest with her therapist about this so she can work on it.
Thanks again for listening.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
But then you get frustrated and exhausted when she acts that way
Stop that and accept that
If you want to save your M you are going to have to be patient
But you do not have to put your life on hold
That was my mistake
How much time do you spend each day doing things for w
Do you do things for her even when she does not ask
And when you do she does not say thank you
Stop doing those things
You want to work more
But you are waiting on w to change her job
Why can you not just do what you want to do
Get after care or a sitter for the after school hours
Warning that your w may rebel against your independence
She may spew all sorts of crazy
But do not back down
Stick up for yourself
And what you want
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Thanks again, buddy. Been reading more on your story and I do see some parallels. My heart goes out to you...I don't know if I could do this for 2.5+ years.
I've got full time work lined up for the summer but it's out of town so it's going to take some juggling of the kids, but we'll make it work.
Once home in September I'm hoping she's either left her job or started something much more manageable so I can get back to working full time again too. My reluctance in seeking more work these past few months is that I fear the friction and resentment that'd ensue if I was working crazy hours and still doing all the childcare on weekends. She refuses to help much and instead buries herself in work or escapes to pamper herself or "clear her head" by working out. I do use a sitter on the nights when I work midweek but I'm saving wknds for the family...6&7yo, as you well know, is a cute but crazy age and I feel like I've only got 5 or so more years before they're off doing their own thing.
She says she wants to be more present for the family, but her job now prevents that.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Anyway, I don't do too much for her anymore. If she knows I'm shopping she asks me to buy her some food, so I'll do that. I used to chauffeur around to her job in the morning, but I've stopped that. I leave the laundry in the dryer for her to fold as that was her only real chore before I started doing everything, so she's doing that again finally. And not complaining about it too, which is nice. She used to make excuses for having no time for anything but serving herself.
You're right that I still do get frustrated when she shows me she's almost entirely self absorbed. It's hard not to, but I'm trying. I rarely show it, but man, I'm frequently rolling my eyes at some of the crap she comes up with.
I feel like things are slowly getting better. The other day she had a total meltdown about some work stuff and was screaming at me about it...the kids walked in and I had to reassure them that mommy was only angry about her work not at me. But then I felt like this shouldn't be happening in the first place, so I barked back at one point "it seems like you'd be much happier on your own" and she said "no, maybe you're trying to goad me into saying I want a D, but I'm committed to this marriage and I love you."
That was a nice surprise, but I've still got my guard way way up. Thanks for chatting.
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
But sounds like you put your life and work second to your w
Is that true
Is that your marital agreement
Is that ok with you
Now is the time to figure out what you want and how to get it
I totally get wanting to avoid the conflict of you working more
And the friction it will cause with her
And the difficulty of child care
But I do not think conflict avoidance is helping you
You have to think that divorce is a real possibility
And if so it is really important you establish the work and child care division of responsibilities now
For me it meant stepping up my child care
For you it may mean giving more to her
I do not know
But just guessing from what you have written
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Now I see it as true that I have put my life/work second to hers, but before all of this I would've said I supported her work ambitions and put the family first. I agree that now that good intention has been warped and has only encouraged her workaholic tendencies. We never had some arrangement that this was to be the case, in fact, I made it abundantly clear last Sept that I knew she was in for a rough next few months and as such I agreed to take on the lions share of child/house duties, but that was to end by January or so. Things changed, of course, and now it's May and I know it'll be a rough next few weeks, but I can't wait to start my temp gig out of town where I'll have time to myself to be a great worker in a special place, reigniting my passion for my profession. Once back home in late August we'll need to reassess where we're at...
Had a good therapy session yesterday and the topic of my immigrant father in law losing his job when W was only 8yo or so has had a big affect on her behavior. To this day he's never found steady work since, instead depending on his wife to hustle low paying jobs for the past 35 years. Now they're old and have little savings and as they gave so much to send their kids to good schools she has a lot of guilt over this. He was a professor and well paid, and is now just a broken delusional dreamer chasing get-rich-quick schemes that of course never pan out. It's a shame, but I can see how this deeply affects my wife even if on a subconscious level.
She had a few good emails and meetings the past couple days with potential employers, so im praying something works out that makes her happy and allows for some life balance for the family.
Thanks again for the solid feedback, as always...
Me: 43 She: 43 Married 14 Together 20 D7 S6 Separation bomb Dec 2017 Reconciled 3 weeks later Jan 2018 Second separation bomb April 2018
Jase, if you are leaning on church, some aspects of your stand can be much clearer -- make sure to visit the rejoice ministry site. you can get a daily e-mail from them to keep you going, and you can sign up for the weekly men's devotional that will be more specific to your situation. They have lots of things you can listen to when you are doing the dishes and fighting the urge to crawl into a hole. I would never have made it through (well, not through, I am still deep in this tunnel o' fun) MLC without Rejoice.
My suggestion is also not to set up what you think you can and can't do -- e.g, you suggested you aren't the type to wait too long. You don't know what type you are yet in this. I never thought I would be the type to wait either, but I let this experience (and learning to trust God, mainly) change me into someone much better than I was before. It was only possible through this impossible wait.
I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living. Wait for the Lord with courage. Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
But she may want to see her MD to just make sure that everything is balanced.
