I want to say that I still have serious reservations about this Gordie but you are living there you know your sitch better than we do. I pray with all my heart that this is not a touch and go on her part. Just be careful my friend and keep your expectations at zero.
M 20+ T25+ S ~15.5 (BD) BD 4/6/15 D 12/23/16
"Someone I loved once gave me A box full of darkness. It took me years to understand, That this too, was a gift." ~ Mary Oliver
It's always up to you Gordie & I wish you luck my friend. The main thing IMHO is those darned expectations. Who knows, your W may truly have had an awakening and this may be the start of genuine rebuilding. However I believe in people's stories and from all that I read here, I suspect you will have more bends to come in the road yet. So expect that and you won't be disappointed.
The thing to remember is this is always a choice for you. You can choose to stay or you can choose to go and you can exercise that choice at any point.
Best of luck with things :-)
T 13 M 7 Me 48 H 46 SS 15 BD 7.14 PA D final 5.16 (H filed)
We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
Peace: I do wonder if what we do makes any difference at all to the outcome of our situations but fall on the side of we can affect it if not control it. No matter what, we can definitely affect the person each of us becomes.
Job: Thank you. I spend less time thinking about her and my situation than I used to by it’s still the #1 thing on my mind most days. You will know when you’ve had enough. My coach said that too!
Butterfly: you know I take your reservations seriously, very seriously. My temptation at this point is to pursue but am consciously not calling or texting or inviting her on dates or wooing her (all things I want to do). Thank you for the reminder this may just be a touch and go. And who knows? Maybe there will be OM3 too... On that, I have already decided. If there is OM3, then I am going to file. And I will not drag my feet.
Sotto: bends in the road? Absolutely. And that I have a choice to stay or go? Remind me of that when I am feeling trapped. I do forget that.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
I told you a long time ago, that you aren't going to able to "love" her back to you...
With that, I mean that you aren't going to still look at her with the same eyes that you see your former wife with.
You aren't going to be able to apply the old rules of the dead marriage, to whatever is to happen in the future.
G: I hear what you are saying and I see now how I failed her: lack of attention, lack of support, lack of passion. I won’t be able to love her the same way I used to—obviously that didn’t work and she has finally spoken up to say she wants something different. Id be a fool to go back to the way things were. I was happy and on autopilot and too blind to see she was unhappy and in crisis. My changes were too little and too late.
Mach:
If you love something set it free.....right ???
G: yes!!!
Mach: You have changed, you have grown, you have evolved as a person, as a friend, as a father, and HOPEFULLY......as a husband.
Thing is, when the MLCer comes through the tunnel, the LBS is leap years ahead of the MLCer in terms of relationship skills...
G: I hear what you are saying but I do think w was always way ahead of me in social skills so I had a lot of catching up to do...while she regressed into selfishness.
Mach: So, with a little luck, you are there...
You are thinking reconciliation, while she is thinking...
Ah, who the h@ll knows what she is thinking...
G: who? I sure don’t. Maybe butterfly with her crystal ball or ownit or ginger...they all seem to know what she is thinking!
Mach: I still stand behind doing what is best for Gordie, and as long as YOU understand what that is, then I back your choice...
However, my gut feeling is that you are doing what is best for everyone around you...
G: you may be right if everyone + kids. If it were just she and I, it would be so much easier to walk away. And I know...don’t use the kids as an excuse...
Mach: So I ask you this....
How is she ever going to miss something that she hasn't "lost" ??
G: you know I hear you. So d b coach and I discussed this very point which was on the pro list for moving out. D b coach did think w almost lost me with the D and separation...and blinked. She decided she didn’t want that.
Thanks Mach for looking out for me and asking the tough questions.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
G: who? I sure don’t. Maybe butterfly with her crystal ball or ownit or ginger...they all seem to know what she is thinking!
Well, while Mach may have many feminine tendencies, we ARE women and of course we know what other women think!
We have no clue what she is thinking. We just know how she has been acting. And we believe, like my good friend, Mach, that perhaps you are doing this for not you.
We all want what's best for you. We are all on team Gordie. But only you know truly what is best for you (even us women don't know, although we like to think so)
I told you a long time ago, that you aren't going to able to "love" her back to you...
With that, I mean that you aren't going to still look at her with the same eyes that you see your former wife with.
You aren't going to be able to apply the old rules of the dead marriage, to whatever is to happen in the future.
I hear what you are saying and I see now how I failed her: lack of attention, lack of support, lack of passion. I won’t be able to love her the same way I used to—obviously that didn’t work and she has finally spoken up to say she wants something different. Id be a fool to go back to the way things were. I was happy and on autopilot and too blind to see she was unhappy and in crisis. My changes were too little and too late.
I'm not talking about how you reflect on your past behavior.
What I am saying is...
You still see her as your wife...today....right now..
And legally ???
Yes, she is your wife...
Emotionally ??
She isn't, and hasn't been for a long time...
However...
You are still reacting to, and on, the emotional connection that USED to be there....
You are still trying to apply the "rules of marriage" in how you interact with her...
Treating her like your "wife" , isn't fair to either of you..
You have to be, everything that DB entails...
You have to "love" her with a new set of eyes..
And I am prolly sukcing at trying to explain it to you..
Originally Posted By: Gordie
Originally Posted By: Mach
So I ask you this....
How is she ever going to miss something that she hasn't "lost" ??
G: you know I hear you. So d b coach and I discussed this very point which was on the pro list for moving out. D b coach did think w almost lost me with the D and separation...and blinked. She decided she didn’t want that.
I don't think that is it at all...
Scared ?
Yea, possibly...
Nobody except her, knows the reason, so to guess is a waste of time...
I dunno Gordie....
For me, I would have to have the talk with her...
I'm not sure what happened the other day, however...
It isn't normal.
We are either working to be closer, or we are working to be further apart.
I feel that we should either arrange for counseling, or we arrange to proceed with the divorce...
I am not prepared to live my life on both sides of this fence, nor will I allow myself to live with the constant threat of getting divorced.
I am prepared to spend my life with you, if you choose so, however I am also prepared to let you go if you need that...
You are still looking at your wife as the wife you knew before the bomb drop. Yes, the physical body is your wife's, but she's mentally not your wife completely. You have to find a way to look at her and the relationship as all being brand new. Neither of you are the same people you were before. You both have wounds and those wounds have to heal. She's still got a lot of work to do and you have to keep your expectations at zero. If you don't, you are going to be disappointed, frustrated and eventually will have resentment and anger build up.
Trying to reconcile w/someone in crisis is very difficult and it requires a lot, and I do mean a lot, of patience. Things can't go back to the way they were w/a simple okay. It took years for her to get where she's at right now and it's going to take a long time to recover from this crisis. So, get your duct tape out, boxing gloves and the STFU smoothies and the shovel for digging for more patience because you are going to need all of those items to get through the next few months.
Try to remember, she's not the person you once knew...she's now a friend/roommate for a while and this is a brand new relationship that both of you are exploring.
You are still reacting to, and on, the emotional connection that USED to be there....
You are still trying to apply the "rules of marriage" in how you interact with her...
Treating her like your "wife" , isn't fair to either of you..
G: why do you think that? That I am treating her like my wife? We don’t spend much time together. We don’t talk much. We don’t sleep together. We barely touch each other.
Mach1:
You have to be, everything that DB entails...
You have to "love" her with a new set of eyes..
And I am prolly sukcing at trying to explain it to you..
G: ummm...you lost me.
Mach1:
I don't think that is it at all...
Scared ?
Yea, possibly...
Nobody except her, knows the reason, so to guess is a waste of time...
G: she said she push pause on the D but that wasn’t possible. The only thing she could do was drop or sign.
Mach1:
I dunno Gordie....
For me, I would have to have the talk with her...
I'm not sure what happened the other day, however...
It isn't normal.
We are either working to be closer, or we are working to be further apart.
I feel that we should either arrange for counseling, or we arrange to proceed with the divorce...
I am not prepared to live my life on both sides of this fence, nor will I allow myself to live with the constant threat of getting divorced.
I am prepared to spend my life with you, if you choose so, however I am also prepared to let you go if you need that...
But that's just me...
?????
G: I’ve been thinking of having some sort of talk but...I think she has already told me she is more interested in focusing on her right now...not me/us. And I do think R talks right now are pressure.
***
Another thought: right now I am only legally M as you say. There is no emotional or physical connection. Obviously, that is not what I want in a R. But I can do this today. Could I live in a loveless, sexless M for an extended period of time? I don’t know but I don’t have to answer that question today either. I am choosing to focus on me and the kids today. I do not know what will happen tomorrow. My emotional dial has been on red hot for a while. I need a break to regroup. Take the pressure off...me.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
You are still looking at your wife as the wife you knew before the bomb drop. Yes, the physical body is your wife's, but she's mentally not your wife completely. You have to find a way to look at her and the relationship as all being brand new. Neither of you are the same people you were before.
G: yes, I need to find that way but I am ******* lost!!!
Job: You both have wounds and those wounds have to heal. She's still got a lot of work to do and you have to keep your expectations at zero. If you don't, you are going to be disappointed, frustrated and eventually will have resentment and anger build up.
G: agree, wise words
Job: Trying to reconcile w/someone in crisis is very difficult and it requires a lot, and I do mean a lot, of patience. Things can't go back to the way they were w/a simple okay. It took years for her to get where she's at right now and it's going to take a long time to recover from this crisis. So, get your duct tape out, boxing gloves and the STFU smoothies and the shovel for digging for more patience because you are going to need all of those items to get through the next few months.
G: I agree and I take to heart cali’s words that it probably can’t be done. Either she can focus on self or me/us and she is clearly focused on the former at present. That’s okay with me and probably better from what y’all are telling me.
Job: Try to remember, she's not the person you once knew...she's now a friend/roommate for a while and this is a brand new relationship that both of you are exploring.
G: and right now, I am just trying to give her space...lots of space. I’m working on a non R not a new R at present. Maybe one day we’ll be able to work on a new R.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
You are still looking at your wife as the wife you knew before the bomb drop. Yes, the physical body is your wife's, but she's mentally not your wife completely. You have to find a way to look at her and the relationship as all being brand new. Neither of you are the same people you were before. You both have wounds and those wounds have to heal. She's still got a lot of work to do and you have to keep your expectations at zero. If you don't, you are going to be disappointed, frustrated and eventually will have resentment and anger build up.
Trying to reconcile w/someone in crisis is very difficult and it requires a lot, and I do mean a lot, of patience. Things can't go back to the way they were w/a simple okay. It took years for her to get where she's at right now and it's going to take a long time to recover from this crisis. So, get your duct tape out, boxing gloves and the STFU smoothies and the shovel for digging for more patience because you are going to need all of those items to get through the next few months.
Try to remember, she's not the person you once knew...she's now a friend/roommate for a while and this is a brand new relationship that both of you are exploring.
