WAS OR WHAT 10

[roist]

Gordie,

Here is my çurrent thinking on appreciation day:

1. My W feels unappreciated. Me showing her appreciation may not change that. That depends on where she is really. Recently I read something to the affect that we shouldn't do the job of our spouces. The context was that often people come up with the predicted response and don't do something based on that. She won't want to so I won't ask, kind of thing. How many of you reading this can relate to that sentiment pre- BD?
did and i tealise now it is s losing concept, one i prefer to gey rid of. I will issue a warning to other lbs reading this that for most lbs in crisis, this is not sonething to focus on yet.
2. I have worked a lot on gratitude and appreciation. I do show appreciation already and my W appears to put some effort into things I thank her most for.
3. Showing appreciation and feeling appreciated are not always linked. There are many factors to that but part of my motivation is also to be more appreciative. That I can achieve.
4. Over the last three years I have read a dozen or so books, I have read tonnes on the internet. I have listened to a few months (accumulated tine) of podcasts and videos. And I have listened to the advice here. This has all served me to a point. I have grown. But there are many things I choose not to do, because it wasn't the right time. I agree with that concept and believe it also served me well. However it is our actions that define our results. I am lucky in that my W is still there (somewhat) so I may as well try.
5. I don't think that this is a huge risk. It is not a declaration of undying love nor pressure to give back anything.
:
I have not decided but am close to doing a small appreciation day.

During our recent holiday I decided that it was time for some me focused actions. Here is a quick update on some I have taken:
# changed facial hair.
# sought out a new activity to do out of the house. Started last night doing guided meditation. This ticks many boxes for me. It us new, with new people. It is an activity that should benefit me. It is something I wouldn't have even considered doing publicly before, but am doing it regardless.II will go at least once a week and commit to daily practice.
# did a multisport raid race with a friend.
# planned to go away for a day to jog in the mountains

For the record I am grateful that my W is there so getting out isradier. I realise that this is possible with alternative guard too but still.

As always any comments, observations, warnings, advice or support are welcome

Best wishes

[Gordie]

R,

I like your comment about not pre emoting spouse's actions are responses to what you want to do. So sounds good that if you want to do the appreciation day, then maybe go ahead and do it. My concern is that if w feels in appreciated it is more about the daily thank you and noticing when the floor is mopped or her hair is re done than about something showier like an appreciation day, but I may be projecting on your situation. You know best.

[roist]

Thanks for your view. I am mindful to express gratitude and appreciation daily. I have done low key version on Thanksgiving during this crisis. I will be careful to not go over the top.

But I can show appreciation even if she doesn't love me. Heck I could even do so if I didn't love her. They are unrelated technically though one could motivate/cause the other.

Thanks for waving the warning flag.

[roist]

For the most part during this crisis my W has focused on looking after her kids. At times it felt like her kids (not ours) though for the most part I can't complain about this aspect of things. One issue I did have however is she tended to group me in with the kids and treat me as one f them. It took a concerted long slow effort but gradually I got that to improve and now she rarely talks to me as she would them. And if she does I let her know to talk to me differently. Furthermore now she almost always says "dad & I" when mentioning something or scolding kids, whereas before it was "I".

I mention this for two reasons. Firstly it shows some progress can be achieved by mindfully enforcing a boundary. Secondly and more relavent to this journaling is that she took on a mother role in our R.ThThis contrasted greatly with other behavior especially earl,y on in this crisis, where I would gave said she was like a teenager.

Friday night she went out with a friend (girl). She asked me at the table with the kids during the evening meal, if she had permission to go out!! I found the wording strange but replied I didn't mind if she went. She stayed out longer than intended. This wasn't an issue for me, but she never texted to let me know, which I didn't like.

I know we are supposed to not mention poor behaviour and emphasize good behaviour, but I still brought it up, by saying I would gave appreciated her letting me know. I said I wasn't her dad so I didn't like having to bring up something about common courtesy. She replied that when they go out they decide as they go along. And asked if we could take it that whenever she is out with this friend that that will be the case. I said I had no problem with that but I didn't see how sending me a text would affect that.

I don't have any fears about my W going out. What got to me was we care still effectively living as a married couple. Am I wrong to continue to have such expectations?

For me and standing up for how I am treated I think I was right to say something. Taking the bait and accepting the father role was probably not the best thing to do. Though at the time I felt like saying if she didn't want to behave as a couple, she can leave anytime. Another thought I came close to expressing was " how old are you?".

This is not a big issue but sparked memories of earlier behavior that hasn't been observed in a long time.

My W doesn't go out very often, just to state.

As mlc behavior goes this is tame. I know things could be a lot worse. But I imagine if things get a little worse I will not want to continue as is. She is free to leave but not to stay any which way.

I reread this thread to remind myself of those small improvements. I am probably just as likely to let W know I have had enough as I am to follow through on appreciation day! TBH neither stresses me. So watch this space to see whst happens. Tune in next time ..... though in reality you may need to check back in a few months before anything happens!!

In the meantime I may have found a second activity to do in a group. Roist is getting out there doing stuff and meeting new people. Yes.

[Coly23]

Hi roist, just dropping by for a visit and to thank you for your advice and support on my thread.

I hope one day your W can see what she has in you as her H. You are a very kind and thoughtful man and you deserve to have a great marriage! (((Roist)))

[bttrfly]

Hi Roist.
I will not characterize that as the father role. First off - it is common courtesy to let those you live with know if you will be gone longer than expected. Simple.

I'm glad you're add more GAL activities. I'm happy you can see the improvements. This takes so much time, doesn't it?

{{{{{Roist}}}}} xoxoxoxo hang in there, you're doing better than you think!

[roist]

Hi. coly. Thanks for your lovely message. It is good to have someone compliment my husband capacity I am sure one day I will have that special R I want (and yes deserve).

Early on I broke my incapacity to communicate well and discuss stuff with W. Since I have gotten used to poor communications and now that I have refocused on it I realise I am struggling to chat easily with her. I acknowledge that my shutting this side of things probably helped me cope, but I have some work to do to get back to where I want to be. In my defense I am not the only not starting conversations! II will work on my side and we'll see if that helps. I am not going to pressure myself though.

Bttrfly. Of course you are right, but if you had observed the conversation she was like a scolded teenager hence I must have been the father figure. Job says we should ignore such stuff if not important. For me it was a principle so I spoke up and hence she got the disapproving father treatment her mlc brain feared. I am not stressing about this but if anyone wants to comment on handling it different if it occurs again, that could be helpful.


Not much else to report except another observation. My W when she does something above normal chores she ensures I know how long she spent doing it. Typically I would notice something was done and thank her or other form of appreciation to which the response is often about how much time or effort she spent. I validate. It feels like she is seeking approval/acknowledgement. Whether this is sought to appease a need she has, or it is an effort to gain my approval appreciation idk. Until now I was sure that it was about her. Bit maybe a part is for me, to give me something to make up for what we don't have. This is speculation and not something I dwell on but I find it curious. Firstly because I think her LL is acts of service. But on another level, my 10 year old son would sometimes" spring clean" his room or do something else shortly after being scolded for bad behaviour,he does something extra "good" to make up for the bad behaviour and hence re establish the peace and how things were.

[job]

One of the hardest things that many have to endure is the MLCer living at home and in your face every day. They act out, i.e., like a teenager, in an adult body, and do not want to accept responsibility for their actions.

Your w's comment about asking for permission to go out sounds just like a teenager addressing their authority figure, i.e., parent. She sees you as a "father figure", someone she feels the need to be accountable too and frankly, she resents it. She wants to be able to come and go whenever she wants and leave you to take care of the family, etc. Your expectations of her being mindful and courteous about such things needs to be lowered. Teenagers don't always think about informing the parent just how long they are going to be out. They think it's okay to stay out beyond curfew, i.e., just as long as they don't get caught.

In a normal situation, people are generally more courteous and will state when they think that they will be home or will call/text if they are going to be later than what was discussed. You, unfortunately, like many others posting here, do not have a "normal" relationship at the moment w/an adult. I'm not making excuses for her behavior and you most certainly had every right to ask when she would be home.

Mlcers want validation and approval for things that they have accomplished. It doesn't matter if it is something small or large...they want to be recognized for their efforts. Yes, there are times when they do something wrong and there are two ways that they may deal w/that wrongful act: 1. sweep it under the rug and act as if nothing transpired earlier; or 2. Bend over backwards and do something nice for you. Of course, they also may go out of their way to be nice and do something that you will approve of...because they've done something that you will find out about later and they may feel guilty about not telling you about it.

Bottom line, you aren't dealing w/an adult. However, just as you would a child and/or teenager, you can point out their behavior if it impacts how things are being handled in the same household...just remember...it's how you address the subject w/them.

It's a one step forward, two step back process. If something works, continue on w/that...if something isn't working, then try something else.

[roist]

Thanks job. I appreciate your insight and the guidance you offer us all here.

I was really close to asking her what age she was. Would such a question cause some inner thought?

I am relatively lucky that my teenage W behaves pretty well most of the time. My issues appear minor compared to others. Maybe she has realised over the last three years that I have lines she should not cross and won't really test them unless sure she wants out. I am mindful to enforce boundaries whilst avoiding controlling her.

With the exception of Zephyr I don't remember another couple here that continued to live as a couple throughout. Most live-in situations involve in house separation. This non-separation adds an extra layer of complications and issues that aren't present in many of the other threads. Whereas I won't judge which type of situation is preferable I would say I find it easier to know how to act in other people's situations.

Thanks again Job

[job]

HaWho's h lives in the dorm room at their house. Check out her threads.

Asking her what age she is will not cause some inner thought. She may think you are making fun of her. It's best to just leave your midlife teen to herself.