Thanks everyone!! Much love :-) Just like old times.
Girls and I held an impromptu "Matt Situation Conference." Oldest daughter was stressing, because he is calling her daily first thing in the morning. He asked her for guidance the relationship he has with youngest. Too heavy, too much, especially right now. He also telling her different stuff. He got high to watch the eclipse.
The girls and I set boundaries and sent in email-everyone contributed:
The girls and I have discussed:
1. No surprise visits. Get a therapist.
2. Callaway needs a week-break from talking to you. When you get a therapist, you can talk about the heavy, adult stuff--like how to approach a relationship with Louisa. Cal is 23, and needs to focus on paying bills, working, decorating her apartment. Get a therapist/professional help.
3. Asheville is a bubble of happy and safe for us, this will NOT be disrupted. I helped you transition to Marblehead, and you assured me OW would not follow. That's not an option for Asheville. I don't trust she won't follow you. Louisa: "Dad can move anywhere in the world, but Asheville." Get a therapist.
4. You must not use us to get better. You must stand on your own two feet like we have. As an adult. Not seeing your children for years is NOT normal. Get a therapist. Get help.
5. You are telling Cal one thing, me another. "Honesty builds relationships, stop being a p@ssy," (per Callaway). "Do some [censored] that will make you like yourself, instead of walking on eggshells trying to please us all."
Louisa: I want a DAD, I don't want emails, texts, or whatever, or gifts. I feel guilty because I know he is hurting. But, I don't want a DAD who is still smoking cigarettes and other stuff. I want a DAD free of the person he lives with. I want a DAD who has gotten help and is trying to honestly figure out why he did the terrible things he did."
Callaway: "I want a DAD, who is honestly looking at himself and what he has done. He needs to admit he can't do this alone."
Callaway: I want him to walk into a therapist's office and say, "I abandoned my family and my pets, and I need help to understand why."
We all love you in our own way. That won't change. But, you are not someone any of us would want to hang out with RIGHT NOW. Enough of the B.S. Get help, or don't. Up to you. You've missed out on years.
He sent a text: Got it. Thanks for the honesty. Hope your mom continues to improve. Take care TTYL smiley face.
Yep. Had a feeling he was using oldest as an emotional support. I was dead on. Her 23-year-old self will tell him it's okay to keep drinking/smoking as long as it's in moderation... exactly what he wants to hear. He was playing us against each other, telling us different versions of the truth. That's B.S.
Texted him before I sent it... You are stressing us out. I can't have that right now. We have created a treaty of boundaries.
Just hard, have this guy we all love... if only... but, I can't get caught up in the fantasy of support and help and all that. He's just too wackadoo.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
I think all three of you have stated your thoughts honestly and to the point. Now, it's time to step back and see if he's going to do the work. I'm proud of all three of you!
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Felt good. I added a sidenote only from me to him: Don't talk to our daughter about your marijuana use. She doesn't need that. She needs to figure things out without your feedback like, "MJ is a gift from God." That's just gross coming from your Dad.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
I read your kids messages and wow. My girls say the same thing. they wont accept anything from my XW. If they cant have what they lost they don't want anything else. No half/part time/friend of a person.. they want a mom.
Your added message is right on. from a parent it is gross. My XW wanted the girls to show her how to twerk. lol. that's just wrong. Also if they wanted pot to get it from her. So she is a pusher now.
You are doing it right. Guiding your kids to a better understanding. Having boundaries and their own boundaries respected. They will grow and be stronger and better adults than most. Hats of to you LoisB.
M51 XW43 (38 at bd) BD1 MAY 30 2015 BD2 JUNE 25 2015 by text moved out Aug 2 2015 left both Daughters 13 and 15 (now 18-20) Her divorce Final July 26 2016 Last time she saw her kids Aug 2 2015
After, my youngest and I worries it was too harsh. So hard when they come out of the cave and show some actual human feelings. Don't want to discourage, don't want to leave us vulnerable to more hurt and insanity. He had alluded to surprising us with a move--sorta his MO since we were teens-he screws up, the. Serenades me outside my window. I just can't have that right now. Oldest felt pretty secure in carving our territory-doesn't seem too worried by it.
Haven't heard much from him-to be expected. Sad because I know how fragile he is... but bittersweet-I know he will abide by the terms. And prob won't get help.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Just want to say you ladies amaze me! Good on you for teaching your girls how to set boundaries.
Thought of you recently as Ashville came up at my work. Checked out the pictures as several people have told me it's heaven. Sure seems so!
Savor the life you have so carefully crafted.
Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13 BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room" 8/15: H back to MBR 10/15: H back in dorm room 1/18: H files, now divorced
Hey Heather! It is your Birthday? If yes, then happy Birthday! I've reading all your updated, but just don't have much time and energy to post recently. I'm so happy to hear that you are doing great! And that your girls are settled down. Well... until their Dad decided to come back to their lives, LOL... or not LOL... it actually not that funny after all. At least you have some remorse from him... I'm still waiting for that from my H... yes, I think I really do need to hear that... but... not holding my breath... and life goes on.
I will try to come back and write more. I think you are doing a great job taking care of yourself and your girls!
M:50 H:52 S28 (my S from previous marriage) M:17 + 3 BD: 06/12 S: 06/12 - H works in another state
Happy Birthday! I hope you've got something extra special planned today.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Thanks!! We have a party planned for Saturday, cake ordered, and this morning woke to decorations hung by youngest D. Coffee was made and I had really good pastries. Great beginning to 49! Happy Birthday to ME!
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Enjoy your day! Sounds like it started off with beautiful surprises from your daughter.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
I'm not surprised by his gestures. He is trying to get back into your good graces and hopes that this is a first step. He doesn't recognize that the hard work of getting clean, cleaning up his act and proving himself trustworthy to you for more than a week or so is the way to go.
Any way, I do hope you enjoyed the flowers and the card...but stay strong and do not waiver on what you've told him.
A hot soccer player! Sounds like just what you deserve for your birthday (unless, of course, he's one of those that have lowered their IQ by heading the ball too much - let's hope not!)
M51 XW43 (38 at bd) BD1 MAY 30 2015 BD2 JUNE 25 2015 by text moved out Aug 2 2015 left both Daughters 13 and 15 (now 18-20) Her divorce Final July 26 2016 Last time she saw her kids Aug 2 2015
We have two birthdays in one week, so it's always a birthday week vs. a one-day event-plus, youngest daughter got her dog on her birthday 8 years ago-so we celebrate the dog's birthday. This year was pretty epic. May have been my best birthday ever.
Have a date with a really handsome guy, an old fling popped up and invited me for a weekend... a hike in the mountains, ate downtown at two awesome restaurants... JUST SO MUCH FUN.
The marathon used to end with exH's bday the first week in Sept. This year, though, was the first year I didn't miss having the marathon of birthdays. Didn't even think much about his--and when I did-there weren't those pangs of sadness.
Felt some sadness after the attention from him, but more because of the reality of how down the sinkhole he is... and, the reality that he's so far out of it... it would take years to catch up. I think part of what makes him coming to appealing is the idea of having help with the girls and life... but, the reality is... even clean, he couldn't be any help for a long time. That's just sad.
Finishing things today with a party with neighbors. Picked up the cake and it's beautiful. I'm going to try to get some work in today, because this week was so distracting.
Haven't heard anything from him in a day or so.
Have a date tomorrow.
Mom is slowly coming to, and I filled her in on all the gossip she missed-she loves gossip--when I told her about Matt--she said:
Mom: "How is he?" Me: "Really Sad." Mom: "Aw. That's too bad... Oh well-f--- him. He's an a-hole. He got in his own way."
Even with a traumatic brain injury, Mom was super clear about Matt!
Hope everyone has a GREAT Labor DAY!!!
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Asked if he could call me yesterday, his birthday. Had a flashback to when I was 12, and I was gesturing to my dad--"Don't tell him I'm home." My dad, of course, ignored me.
He opened the conversation by saying, "Hi Mrs. XXXXX."
Then, went on and on about some incredibly boring work stuff. Sounded really nervous. Says he is working on himself, and going to A.A. Has a plan to move into his own apartment in OHIO and come visit us in December. This is all HIM, mind you. Insists it's over with OW and she is psycho and he wasn't dumped.
I was honest that I felt strange talking to him--when he asked why, and said, "It's just me." I replied, "Well, it's like being mauled by a Grizzly Bear, and the Grizz asking a few years later, 'Hey? Can I call you sometime?"
I was clear that the jury was still out. We need to see action, not just hear it--seems like he is actually focused on action--feels different. Sounds like the guy I used to know. And, I don't feel as much nervous energy, like I have to watch him like a hawk. Hasn't talked to him toxic mother since May.
However, I told him, even if we agree to a visit in December, that doesn't mean a shotgun won't be locked and loaded in case the Grizz comes out to play.
Taking this a day-at-a-time. More like an hour-atta-time.
In other news: My insane MIL just showed at the hospital to talk to my mom. Just showed up. Crazy B-t--. Hasn't acknowledged our children in YEARS. Shows up for my mother. Drama queen--would hate to miss any soap opera.
Another day watching the circus from eight hours away.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
P.S. Haven't asked about OW. He is offering. Newbies, take note, you get to a place where they are just some ho that happened to be in the right place at the right time--nothing more than something to do and distract. She is of no importance. Almost feel sad for her. Almost.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
I need a meeting. I work a fairly rigorous D.A. program, but could stand to at least phone into an Alanon meeting right now. When he's not in my face, it's so much easier to just work on me. Have been listening to my Audible Codependency book... Melody's latest.
It's funny a much-loved neighbor is from our local Alanon mtg. God's way of reminding me... wink, wink, nudge, nudge...
While I am working to focus on myself and my mom, business, kids, life, etc... It hasn't escaped me that I always suspected this MLC had something to do with my former MIL. Almost as if ol' what's his name needed to push the limits to the very edge, to see if our love was conditional like his mothers. Interesting to me that he cuts her from his life, and slowly moves in our direction. Plus, I also know OW has many similar qualities to his mom... unstable, angry, extremely controlling, needy, depressed...
Anyway... just got me thinking. Back to my own life now.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Be careful - it's not unusual for the WAS to turn up like a bad penny when things are going badly with their relationship with the OP; then deny they meant or said any of it when the OP reels them back in.
I hope, for the girls' sake, that he's truly done with OW and gets sober. But I wouldn't put any of your own GAL and dating on hold.
I'm already bracing myself and the girls. ZERO EXPECTATIONS. Oldest is currently taking a break from him. She was the only one he was talking to for the past 1+ years.
He is still not invited here. Taking this at a snail's pace. I'm still on my dating app, still talking to other guys. Have an evening planned with some girlfriends on Weds. evening at the champagne bookstore. Youngest and I are going on a historical tour tomorrow.
Plus, I have a business that's growing and needs my attention. God is protecting us by keeping him far away. If he gets it together, great... if not, already have my life on a charted course without him. It's always sad though.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Has declared he wants to reunite. Made a terrible mistake, got himself into a mess--"I don't know what I was thinking, or how I got here. I lost my family. I see now that it doesn't matter where I am, or who I'm with, I have to make things right with me."
He has revealed some details of his relationship with OW---not pretty. We are essentially talking about a predator woman, who was/is looking for someone to take care of her. Sounds freakishly like my former MIL. Just taking notes, not over-analyzing this... but, find it really interesting, he went for someone so controlling, somewhat mean and an over-the-top narcis. My instincts into who she is--I was dead on.
Anyway, after the last phone call, and several outreach calls--I asked for a 72-hour break from him. Clarified, again, there is no remote possibility of a reunion if A. He doesn't have at least 3 months sobriety with support B. Isn't in therapy C. Hasn't ended things for good with OW and she is GONE. Until then, it's status quo, I continue to date, live my life, focus on my business, etc...
Had a GREAT evening out with girlfriends last night at the champagne/used bookstore.
He is considering taking a job about 15 minutes from where he is now, still in OHIO. The job would mean less responsibility, more money and better benefits for therapy. I did add my two cents that I thought his having time to focus on himself with less responsibility sounds like a good idea---but, not my circus, or my call.
Just trying to give some insight into 5.5 years into this journey.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Why am I not surprised that he's wanting to reunite? His relationship with Twinkle Tw@t (TT) has gone south and now he wants back into your lives because he sees that all three of you are doing well and are very happy.
He would need to be sober and in therapy for at least a year before I would even consider "dating" him. Keep in mind...it's a brand new relationship and you are very wise not to allow him back until the hard/necessary work is done. He needs to prove to you that he is trustworthy and is willing to stay sober and not have any contact w/ the "TT".
He also needs to learn what boundaries are and heed them when you tell him to back off, etc.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
I figured I'd give him an achievable goal to start, but didn't say we'd be dating once he has 3 months. Three months lines up with his proposed Christmas visit--I'd be okay with a visit, IF he is clean for three months with therapy and no TT. No guarantees on anything. Way too soon for any of that. For now, taking in the nice things he says, but have another date next week.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
You are right not to change your life just in case. I hope you dating doesn't complicate things for you. You are at this long enough to know your own mind and what is best.
You seem to have your head in a good place and are objective and reasonable with your requests and expectations. The ball is in his court.
Best wishes
R 25 years M 14 years S11 & S13 Working on it alone since Oct 2014 M in trouble a lot earlier (~2 years) Feb 2016. 1st R chat in a yr. Next R chat Aug'17 Still together
I went home again to help with my Mom. Ended up getting power-of-attorney over her medical, and making my brother POA for her financial. It's been very stressful, and disruptive to my life.
Matt has been in daily contact. I saw him twice when I went up North. I'm not sure it was the best decision, but I was feeling really tired and overwhelmed and the attention was nice. He was supportive in his own way... which is still out-there, but more like the guy I used to know. He saw Louisa after he hadn't seen her in four years.
He brought pizza, and ate four pieces. That's the ol' Matt. He applied for the county job, still in Ohio, but with better benefits and drug testing. Appears to be clean.
I'm still not sure what I think? I'm not wavering on my terms. I want him to have some serious sobriety and therapy, before heading in our direction. However, I do feel somewhat confident this isn't a touch-n-go.
Interesting Observations:
1. He completely lost track of time. In Ohio, our daughter reached out to her old best friend. Old bff is now 16, and has her license. When the girls made plans, Matt asked, "Who is driving?" We had to reiterate about three times that this girl is NOW 16, not 9. He even asked if she was still attending the elementary school she attended when he left. Um, no, she is at a vocat. school. Weird.
2. Really working on stuff around his mom. And, angry. The anger comes out in some weird ways... some racist comments, some weird comments about being angry with Social Media??? Anyway, I told him he needed to work through the anger with a professional, or we didn't have a chance. He's not angry with us, directs it toward to politics and such... but, I'm sure it would head in our direction if we were together. He agrees, which is nice to hear. Still, Tooo sooooooooon. BABY, BABY STEPS.
3. He REMEMBERS EVERYTHING I said to him over the past five years. Like he recorded every conversation. He will bring something up I said from like three years ago--and he isn't angry or anything--more like he is using everything I said as a guide back to us. Like, if I do this, like Heather said, I will find my way home.
4. Acts way older than he is. He is 51. He said he has a hard time driving at night. Really? At 51? It's like he thinks he is 80. I mentioned the drum circle in Asheville, and he said he couldn't do loud music anymore. Wha??? He was a Metallica freak. Just strange.
Overall, I'm in a firm Maybe region. I'm not saying No to a future, I'm definitely not saying Yes. I'm not sure we are well-matched anymore. He acts so old, and can be really closed minded. I'm more of a free-spirit now. And, I don't like the idea of waiting around for someone to "change."
At the same time, it's been really nice to have validation that I wasn't crazy through all of this. Just about every instinct and gut feeling I had was dead on. The OW is exactly how I imagined her, just like his mom... He spent five years in an absolute fog. It's also been nice to hear some really nice things, and reconnect with the person I remember.
It's like he is around 85 percent more comfortable in his skin, a bit more okay with the world, REALLY accepting of his drug problem, and about 25 percent is still Wackadoo. He is obviously still cooking.
He told me his plan. He hopes to hear about this job in the next few weeks. He wants to move away from OW. They aren't a couple any longer. He has saved money for a new apartment. He would move to another town. He wants to continue to work on himself, get a therapist, stay clean, stay connected to us, and take this slow.
As for me, I have had a few moments of, "Shid, what if he disappears again?" Sorta panicky feeling... but, it passes, and strangely, he seems to sense it and reassure me some.
Still focused on my life. Still 8 hours away from him. Can't lie, though, it's been a nice distraction while dealing with my Mom.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
1. Threw himself into work. Sounds like an incredibly lonely life. Just work. That's his life. It was work and drugs. Now, it's just work, and, maybe? A.A. However, he has done a really good job with his position, and he is really proud of that. Giving lots of affirmations around this... something his parents always shamed him about... not finishing college, not being an atty, etc... However, I did confide that I had some resentment that he had the luxury of just focusing on his job, while I'm focused on the girls and the rest of it... I wasn't a b----, but expressed some resentment, and said we can work on that down the road, if we move forward.
2. Full of gratitude for how I've raised the girls. Giving me TONS of Gratitude for being the stable one, being there for the kids, and raising two really cool kids. Seems to really appreciate me right now as a mom. Seeing my value as a good mom, that's been awesome--regardless of what happens--I'm so grateful to hear that from him.
3. Have had a few honest moments with our youngest, where we were able to bring up some of the really hard times, and he took ownership, in front of our daughter, of his insanity... and how it impacted our lives.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
AND! Finally acknowledged Youngest D's Aspergers. Embraced it. That's HUGE.
Thinking of asking him for some extra money this month to help offset the costs of these weeks I've missed at work because of my mom. A friend suggested it may be a way of seeing if he truly willing to help. IDK.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Wow, Heather! So many things at once! First, I’m so sorry about your mother. It is never easy when it is time to make the decisions you have to make. It is great that you have your brother to support you in this, so you are not alone.
I’ve been reading your updates about Matt… Thank you for sharing. After your first update about him trying to maintain a constant contact with you and your Ds, I was a bit skeptical… Honestly, I’m still a bit nervous about reading your updates… I want this new development to stick so badly… I’m absolutely ecstatic to read about how he acknowledged you as a great mother for your girls and is grateful for it! I’m thrilled to read that he also acknowledged your D’s Aspergers. This is HUGE!
Heather, you’ve come a long way… I absolutely admire your strength and your determination to make a better life for you and your Ds. You’ve made it!!! You are a true success story! You are AMAZING!
Thanks for sharing your story! It is always fascinating to me to read how MLCer finally comes to a realization of the things he/she lost. It is very interesting that he remembers everything you said. I thought they normally don’t remember things like that. I completely agree with you, that you need to see a solid evidence of the changes in him before you can even consider any kind of R (besides when it comes to his R with his Ds, of course, and still.. he has to prove he is clean…)
I’m also exited for our D’s, and especially the younger one. It is great that she got to hear some of his remorse in regards to the damage he caused. My hope is that he will continue in this direction and will repair the damage with his Ds, and especially the youngest.
OK, my fingers crossed… to read more of the positive updates from you! In any case, I would take it to have an apology and a recognition that I was a good Mom and wife (hehe)…. You’ve got at least that! Can only imagine how it feels… So happy for you, Heather!
M:50 H:52 S28 (my S from previous marriage) M:17 + 3 BD: 06/12 S: 06/12 - H works in another state
So sorry to read that you've had some stressful times helping your mother. At least you now have the power of attorney and your brother is POA. These actions should make you feel a bit better since you live a ways away.
As for Matt, sounds like he's waking up a bit. He feels old because he's abused his body with drugs and alcohol over the years and yes, his crisis took a toll on his body as well. In time, as he heals from within, he should start to feel better with respect to his health and mental well being.
As for his anger issues, he needs to see someone about that. He needs to find ways to deal w/that anger in a productive way, i.e., work it out of his system.
I think you are very wise in not making any promises to him about the future. After all, it's just been a few months since he has started to wake up and until he has gotten himself away from the OW and on his own and doing what he needs to do to fix himself, he could slip back into the tunnel.
Hopefully, in time, he will grow up and become a more mature, grounded man to his family.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Just asked for 48 hours to take a breather. I was honest that I was feeling that ol' codependent pull again, and some fear of him pulling the plug.
When I get that weird, nagging, terrible feeling in my stomach... time to step away, and focus on me. He was nice about, reassured me he wasn't pulling the plug, but agreed to step back for 48. He abided by the 72 hours last time.
Phoned into a meeting, got some support from friends. Eating lunch, then back to work. Listened to Melody Beattie yesterday for a long time.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Thank You Bright! So nice to hear from you!!! I hope you are doing well. Thanks so much for the feedback.
Taking this SLOWLY, and focusing on myself. The distance makes a huge difference. Once I reached the stage, where I knew I'd be find without him, that's when he reappears.
So good to hear from you ;-)
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Taking a breather sounds like a good idea as the contact you've been having sounds like quite a lot at such an early stage and with OW still somewhere in the mix.
I never once saw anyone post - Wow, I took that a little too slowly....only ever too fast. And this sounds a little too fast right now IMHO.
Gentle withdrawal, space for you, occasional contact, no R discussions and absolutely no expectations. Then if he consistently comes forward, you'll be pleasantly surprised and can move gently forward yourself...
JMHO of course and I hope things continue to move (very slowly!!!) in a positive direction
T 13 M 7 Me 48 H 46 SS 15 BD 7.14 PA D final 5.16 (H filed)
We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
Thank you Sotto. That sounds like sound advice. I think all this stuff with my Mom kinda pushed us together a little... at least, I felt more open to his attention, because I was stressed.
Until he is living AWAY from OW, and solidly clean, nothing has really changed, no matter what he says.
It's one of those things where, when someone rejects you and disappears, then reappears, you kinda feel like filling them in on all they missed. Our youngest daughter has been doing the same thing. For me, there's this fear of him disappearing again, and I feel this urge to get in time, before the bomb drops again.
But, I'm really only interested in a NEW, and Improved MATT anyway. And, he's got a way to go. If it's meant to be, it will be.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Acting on the impulse of fear is rarely productive, especially in this process. I understand the wanting to benefit the most you can whilst he is open to that. But that is selling yourself short.
Build connection whenever he seeks you out. Look for those opportunities and times where he is fully there and available to connect. Forcing it at all other times is counter productive. Until he is all-in he is most likely to withdraw if confronted with more than he can handle.
Keep your boundaries in place but just because he isn't where you need him to be doesn't mean nothing has changed. It is a slow process with much hidden beneath the surface.
Best wishes
R 25 years M 14 years S11 & S13 Working on it alone since Oct 2014 M in trouble a lot earlier (~2 years) Feb 2016. 1st R chat in a yr. Next R chat Aug'17 Still together
Twenty-four hours into a time-out. It's really helping. Getting back into the flow of my life.
Ellie, No, I would not seek out someone on a dating app/after a date with the remarks he made. Still, I've confronted him on some of what he has said, and he admits to feeling very scared being face-to-face with us after all he has done. When Matt is scared, he says stupid shid. I can see that. Time will tell.
I need to get clear on what I'm looking for in a partner. What do I want? What dynamic with Matt am I not interested in repeating? Am I able to have a NEW relationship with him? I'm not sure.
All I know for certain, the girls and I have missed him in our lives. But, that doesn't necessarily mean he needs to be my romantic partner. And, it's way too soon for that anyway.
I know I still need to create a solid business and financial life. I'm getting there, but have a way to go.
Just thinking out loud.
Thanks for the feedback. Have an awesome day.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
I think the wisest thing would be to look at this in stages. You have had a stage of not being in contact or just occasional contact for a good while.
What may be happening now is a stage where you may be in touch some more and he wants to spend some time with you and with the girls. And that's fine if it works for you.
But I would make this stage 'potential friends again' only and I would make it a good long stage - a year? During this period, you could be in touch more and see how you feel about it. How he seems. How consistent is the progress and so on.
But during this stage, I would take any thought of romance off the table. You are not in touch as romantic partners and it would be too soon to consider doing that (IMHO). If he wants to ask about 'us' you could reply - it's good to be in touch again, as for more than that, I would need some more time - or whatever similar reply works for you.
The next stage - if at all - might be to reconnect romantically. But there's no need for you even to think about this (or put any pressure on yourself - or him) at this stage, because this isn't that stage. I'm not saying any of that would be easy - and you would need a clear head, cool heart and strong focus on your life independent to him - but I think it would be wise.
I agree about the anger and the racism - neither are great behaviours to be around - and you may want to be clear about that from the outset.
Hope this helps a little anyway and I think you are doing well. Goodness knows how I would cope if my ex wanted us to be in touch again
Xx
T 13 M 7 Me 48 H 46 SS 15 BD 7.14 PA D final 5.16 (H filed)
We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
Sotto is 100% spot on w/her advice this morning. Relationships should begin as an acquaintance, then friendship and then on to a romantic one. Right now, you are just an acquaintance and that means getting to know him again, i.e., just as he is doing w/you. You may find that you need to explore this new relationship for 12-18 months before anything romantic happens.
Heather, I do not want to see you and the girls hurt/disappointed w/him again. Always remember...patience and his actions need to match his words.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
People who AREN'T racist do NOT say racist stuff when they're scared or off-balance. People who are normally good at HIDING their racism say racist stuff when stressed or off balance.
I agree w/kml 100%. When people are stressed they tend to spew what is actually on their mind or how they feel about certain things. If he didn't have these thoughts, he wouldn't have blurted them out.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Jury is still out. He has 30 days clean, and he got the new job where he will be drug tested. This job is part of his plan to move away from OW.
I'm hearing the guy I used to love. The anger seems to be lifting as he continues to do things, which build his self-esteem. He hasn't mentioned counseling yet. Therapy is one of the terms of our agreement, if he comes to visit for Christmas.
For today, I'm enjoying the progress, but remain focused on my super full, busy life.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Great news...but I hate to sound like a Debbie Downer...but it's only been a month...he's got to prove himself and stay on the path of recovery for at least 12-18 months. He definitely has to earn your trust and respect back. After all, he really did a number of you and the girls and hasn't been there for them for a very long time and now since he's seen you are succeeding and are happy, he wants part of that action. Heather, I know you are a smart lady...but be cautious when it comes to him. As the old saying goes "the proof is in the pudding".
Keep the focus on you and your girls. He's got his own journey to complete...
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
I agree Job. We are quite a ways from reconciliation, or even a point where he'd be a regular fixture in the kids' lives.
I'm still going to enjoy today though. It's been a really long time since he had 30 days clean.
I guess, from my perspective, the things he thought would make him happy... drugs, OW, life free of kids and other responsibility proved to be as empty as we all know they are. And, now, he sees his family getting back to loving life. There ain't no such think as a happy drug addict/MLC-er. I'd like to think it's not so much he wants to ride our coattails, but more like we've created something worth working toward.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Not that we weren't worth it before, but our lives are different now. I'm different. I KNOW my value. I'm not giving myself away for nothing anymore. I expect more. And, I will not put everything we've worked so hard for disappear for the sake of someone with 30 days.
The jury is still out. I've traveled this road many times with this same addict. This time, however, I KNOW I will be fine without him.
Yet, whenever they wake up, even if it's just for 30 days, it's nice. And, it's nice to have some good news come from his direction.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
I am keeping you, your family and your xh in my thoughts and prayers. I pray that he's finally hit bottom and come to realize that you and the girls were the diamonds in the tiara. He still has a ways to go and I hope, that in the months ahead, he can make amends and be there for all of you.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
I'm not making any changes in my life, with the exception of allowing him in a bit for conversations and texts. I'm also asking for some more support with money items related to the girls.
Right now, I'm enjoying his progress and attention, but our lives are steady and sane.
One observation: I want to feel I'm able to completely be myself in my next relationship. I want to be able to RELAX and be myself. I want someone who doesn't judge me, or hold me up to ridiculous expectations. I want someone who values me for my good qualities, without comparing me to some stereotype of what I'm "supposed" to be. I'm not sure if Matt can accomplish this for me. But, for me, that's a hill I will die on--after all we've been through.
The racist/political B.S. is addict anger. There were two sorta subtle, psuedo-political remarks, and one about millenials--which was stupid.
Part of the addict Boy Scout Motto... "I will hate everyone and everyone will hate me, because I will behave obnoxiously and hurt people in whatever way I'm able." Not to mention, I will placed ridiculous judgments on people, so no one will judge my own insane behavior.
It dissipates when people learn to love themselves again and feel some integrity. Still, time will tell. He's a dangerous mission, and I haven't agreed to take it on today. I will quietly live my life and support him when he chooses light vs. dark.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
I'm doing well. Just finished a big project, or, at least I'm almost done.
As far as ex-H:
-More than 60 days clean. -He started a new job with drug testing passed the initial test. -He was super funny-took some at-home tests, but still worried 43 days clean wasn't enough. -Just when I think--that's it, we won't hear from him again--he says/does something to renew my confidence. -We started a four-way text message this week--sorta slowly, SLOWLY allowing him back in the fold. Wary, cautious, but the kids were thrilled to be able to joke and have fun--even via text. -60 days does not a year make, but taking things slowly-still glad he is in Ohio and we are here. -Received a very sweet card today-addressed to me-with money for our daughter's class.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Slowly he is inching his way back into reality and staying sober. Take each day as it comes and keep your expectations at zero. The holidays are fast approaching and he may be popping out a bit more because of it.
Hang in there!
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
I heard a great tip for obsessing, courtesy of Melody B__t_ie. Try to force yourself to obsess, when you aren't. You can tell the difference between healthy obsessing and toxic obsessing using this trick. If you are just feeling passion about an idea, project, vacation, whatever, you will be able to force yourself to obsess.
If it's unhealthy obsessing, then try switching over to something healthy. If I'm obsessing about Matt, force myself to think of a work project or house project I'm excited about--Use the energy for something constructive.
P.S. Kinda funny watching him interact with the girls. When he left, they were awkward, young, etc... Now, we have two Amazing Confident Women. If Dad says something stupid, he is called on it immediately. He made the mistake of calling us "hens." They were all over him like a monkey on a banana. Oldest: Dad, that's incredibly sexist and I'm not impressed.
He apologized.
One day atta time.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
It's been awhile since I've posted. Thought I'd check in :-)
SIX years since BD!
MY kids are AMAZING. I'm so proud of my girls. My oldest, who had such a hard time through these past five years or so, is on her own, seeing an awesome counselor, building a life, staying sober. I'm so proud.
Youngest just went to her first formal dance. Has some great friends and her own small biz babysitting dogs.
Most of all, they are happy and laugh a lot.
I've got these two strong young women, who are blowing me away. I was so worried with their ability to recover. But, we made it.
Matt is still clean. Going on five months. He took a job, where he is drug tested. He works a pretty insane schedule, alot of night shifts. He checks in with all of us daily. We have a group text. He gets particularly chatty on his all-nighters. Youngest loves it. She loves everyone talking as a family. Oldest comes as goes. There's no pressure. Both girls find him annoying, and he is. Trying really, really hard to fit into a really tight-knit group.
It's been very strange having nice Matt back. He's may be nicer than he was before? The support has been pretty weird. Last night, our youngest had a panic attack at the beginning of the dance--Aspergers reaction to noise and crowd. We all coached her through it, and she was able to get past it and have a good time. I think it meant a lot to him to be a part of an actual family situation again.
He's also been sending me money to help with things like our dog's recent cancer surgery. She's fine now, but paying off the surgery.
Anyway, taking it slowly. None of us ready to be together in person yet. Not sure if I want a relationship, as in a romantic relationship with him again. I'm not sure I can see him that way? He did a lot of terrible stuff.
I do, however, feel like we've reached a point, where it's okay to accept him in our lives again. I'm trusting my gut. Today, he feels safe. Today, I can accept that this is our family, no matter how weird it looks and no matter how different from what I hoped for. We have a connection to each other. And, the girls are perfectly capable of handling him now on their own. In fact, he's been really brave sticking it out through their gauntlet.
When I feel some resentments building up, or old anger, I have some close friends who are recovering addicts to remind me... One Day atta Time. His sobriety is the first priority right now. There's no possibility of anything else until he's sober at least a year.
Interesting Points for those earlier on in this journey:
-OW means nothing now. Not sure she ever did. He doesn't remember calling her his soulmate. "We have nothing in common. We did drugs together. She isn't the smartest and sorta annoying."
"I said a lot of stuff out of pain. I was hurting and trying to hurt everyone else."
-OW means nothing to ME. This has been HUGE for me. I was so obsessed about her. I feel nothing where she is concerned. Not threatened, not angry, NOTHING. She was a sad predator, who took advantage of someone who was really broken. He allowed her to invade our lives. But, today, she really means nothing.
-It wasn't all wine and roses. In fact, it wasn't ANYTHING like I imagined. He described his Thanksgiving. He had dinner alone for $10 at a buffet. Honestly, I think this has sorta been his life for the past several years. He describes a life of work, drugs, loneliness, isolation, sitting in this chair I let him take from the house and watching movies. I remember he talked a lot about movies early on after he left. I think watching movies alone played a big part of his down time. ALONE ALONE ALONE. What he describes, even with OW, is alone.
-Missed his family throughout, but didn't have the ability to fix all the damage he had done. He also described this deadness. He was like a zombie.
-I don't think he even knew where to start to make it back. He describes a fog, where he just put one foot in front of the other. He also describes being very easily led by OW and his family--all of whom were pushing him to "follow his heart." He has cut off his family from his life since he quit using.
-He appreciated my staying in touch. I would text him from time-to-time and ask how he was. Give him a little of what was going on with the girls. Not over the top, but just enough to let him know, "We are here. We care about you. Take care of yourself."
Not sure if this will last. Kinda have a feeling though, the partying isn't something he wants to return to. However, it's hard to know if the issues that caused all this could return. It's too early to predict. Okay with daily interaction. Love having nice Matt back. But, not sure I'd ever want to live with him again, and focused on my life and my business.
The girls have made it clear, that in order to come visit us, he needs some counseling in addition to getting clean. None of us are prepared to return to Crazytown.
I'm loving having a state line as a boundary from him and my family. It's made such a difference in our lives to be able to live in a place without the constant memories and threat of seeing someone who might stir up pain.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
What a lovely (and real) update. It is good to see that someone can take the time and do this right and when the time is right, the stars align. I think for most, there is some positive sign and it goes right back to rug sweeping and hoping for the best. You have resurrected boundaries for everyone's best interest and each of you is doing your part.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
He hit 6 months and signed a lease away from OW. He moves into his new place April Fools 😊
OW is not happy and still pursuing and trying to break his sobriety. She doesn't like his sober friends. He took personal items important to us as a couple out of his current apt. to protect them--like a painting we got on our honeymoon and some photos of us at 19 and 21. Just in case she goes cray cray. It's been nice having him back from the dead.
Still okay, not ready to spend time with him yet in person. He saved stuff from all of us as a family. Kept it close.
OW was very, very controlling and possessive. Learning bits and pieces. Not asking too much yet. Not sure I even care honestly. She really, really doesn't matter. Never thought I'd feel this way. His sobriety and my own sanity is priority. I need to stay clear-headed and keep building my business. Actually, really enjoying work. I'm certified in email marketing, inbound marketing and content marketing. Need to take better care of myself though. Still get resentful about juggling g everything alone. Yet, wouldn't want a newly-clean addict helping me--that wouldn't really be help.
Taking this one day Atta time.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
It's so wonderful to hear an update from you! Kudos to you on rebuilding your life and for being that rock for your girls.
It's important for those of us still in the muck to know things ease with time. Thanks for taking time to post as I think about you often!
Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13 BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room" 8/15: H back to MBR 10/15: H back in dorm room 1/18: H files, now divorced
