Because I felt she was trying to feel the desire to work on our M again.
Because I was hoping that her going through MC and hearing C say that contact with OM is not a good idea and how it's about what we both put into the relationship that this would make W realize that we have a long hard road ahead of us but that the longer OM is involved the harder it will be.
Because I trust my W when she says OM and her are friends.
Because I know I need patience and also need to sin for my failures as a H.
Because I don't want to end things even though I know they should be ended because of financial reasons beyond emotional reasons.
Because I see progress and every step forward I want it to be a larger step.
Because I think her talking to OM might make it easier on her.
Because I don't know if I can trust her saying nice things about me while also saying she doesn't know yet.
Because she changed wanting to go to MC because of wanting to end things peacefully to maybe wanting to see if she can feel she wants to work on it.
Because I would hate knowing I am a failure at 40 with no kids and pretty much sacrificing that. I was okay not having kids because she didn't want kids but now I wonder if I made the right choice.
Because I have gone for dual citizenship here and I would lose my native country's citizenship unless I am married to a US citizen.
Because I am stubborn and a fighter and I hate giving up.
As to the other question. I am open to an open marriage IF and only IF we are in a good space. From what I understand about these things that is the only way it would even work. Initially I thought we could get there but when that didn't lead to progress I realized that W might not really desire that and she either wants me to change or she wants out but doesn't know how.
So we had our MC today and I kind of lost it. I know I should have kept quiet but I knew this was a ticking time bomb. I mentioned that I kind of don't feel I can give W space with OM involved. She admitted at the session that while he said he would leave her alone so we can work things out that she begged him to stay since they are both going through the same thing (ending a relationship. Ironically he got cheated on by his GF). She expects a D and fears being isolated. She told MC that she doesn't want to be M. She confirmed that all physical activities stopped (I kind of knew that given our unique situation of W not driving and us pretty much being in same place 24/7) but that she admits it is an emotional connection.
I confronted her about what happened on the trip and she said it was just as friends with me and that there is a familiar touch that is nice. And because I had said let's take it day by day (which is true...I just assumed she would slowly engage in NC with OM).
MC told her that clearly she is confused about what W wants as she cannot be working on the MR if she is also talking to someone about leaving the M. W said that she just doesn't know what to do. She wants to feel in love with me but she doesn't (I am not sure WHAT she misses, she says we have fun, we enjoy similar activities, she said before we flew back home that clearly we have great sexual chemistry, she thinks I am great at my profession and she would love for me to also be in another State...to me that is marriage: a profound friendship where two people enjoy each other's company regardless of what we do...) --> I do recognize that my impatience and impulsiveness and focus on money often prevented us from enjoying things. Add to that that during fights we both were mean and it escalated and whereas I want to fix problems at once, W needs space. So those are HUGE things that were never set up right.
MC asked me (when I gave the chance...ugh I really need to be better controlling my emotions but this had been weighing on me for weeks) if I wanted a decision now. I said I can wait as long as W needs but that it would be easier if OM is not in the picture. MC said that she has never heard of a situation where someone else was involved and it being good for the R. She also said that W is perhaps giving conflicting messages and false hope.
I mentioned how I don't feel a next MC session makes sense but W pleaded/asked that we go. So I agreed. W. also said that while she would feel empowered to think about us in a different State that here she feels trapped and feels that she needs to move out to clear her head. (At home she added that she knows she takes me for granted and kind of needs to know what happens when she misses me and I am not right there to help her.) and that because our lives are so intertwined that it is hard for her to have time for herself and is always worried what I think... I interrupted (shouldn't have done that) and said but that is because of OM.
MC said that she thinks we can get out of this but only IF both of us commit (yeah...I knew that, hence why I was so emotional). She said that some couples come out stronger after one of the people moves out. She also told W that I am communicating better in these sessions (although I was bad today and need to apologize to her) and that while I am clearly emotional that it is obvious I admire W and I love her and think she is amazing.
At home W suggested extended stay in a motel as an alternative. I said if she really thinks that will help and she isn't just doing that to prolong the inevitable that I can accept that. That I will try to not think OM is over there all the time. She said he won't come over. (I am trying to recall if she said all the time or implied not at all.) It doesn't matter. She knows how I feel and either she thinks she needs to get him out of her system and have more PA with him OR he truly is being a friend.
She shows compassion towards me when I am sad so I think that's a good sign. What is a bad sign is that I need to be strong if I want her to feel safe to come back. I really hope I can stay calm and she can see I am giving her space DESPITE knowing she talks to OM that maybe she will feel safer but part of me also thinks maybe her moving out would be the best especially if she commits to more MC which she said she wanted to do (I confronted her about her saying she wanted to date and she denied that at the session so maybe her thoughts did change or she is worried what MC would say). It would require an insane amount of emotional regulation on my part but it is important I focus on myself. I don't like feeling this way and it makes me whiny and unattractive.
At home she also said she regrets sleeping with him because he is a friend. When I mentioned it later she changed it to well not regret but...and she didn't finish. She did say we both need IC as well and she said she needs to do it and encourages me to do the same. Honestly, I need to work on things but for me it is mostly not knowing which side of W to belief. The one that comes closer to me. Laughs with me. Says we have sexual chemistry. Says she can see us live together in another State. OR the one that says she doesn't want to be married. Maybe both. Maybe neither. I can have patience. I have enough work to do...it's just that both of us want to leave the State in the next year. Figuring all this out how to leave AND how we feel about each other is going to be insanely difficult. The benefit I guess is that I can focus for a job so wherever I would go W COULD potentially follow me and do her PhD. Or maybe it just means we wait another year.
I do know we are both exhausted. I do know I love her. I do know she seems to care about me (in some fashion). I know she is worried about the finances when she moves out. I know she has major fear that I will hurt her. I know that in the past we both have been too excessively violent. But she starts to validate more and more that she contributed to the problem. And that we both have been emotionally abusive (my fault was only seeing her part for too long and not seeing how I did the same and sometimes worse). I know she validates that i have made huge changes for the better (she mentioned that to counselor as well) but that she feels it is too little too late. I told her that that is part of the reason I am frustrated because I was asleep for so long.
One other thing she said when we were home and she was in pain in her shoulders and neck and I did what I always do: rub it. She said it feels so good. So familiar. I love feeling that touch. She then sighed and said she messed up but doesn't know how to do it in this home. To me that is a glimmer of hope that what seems to be the biggest problem is getting over the fear of me, the resent towards me from the past and especially the too little too late. She even said we did so much bad to each other that it may be too much to overcome and I said: precisely because we both contributed that it is just important we start with a clean slate.
So maybe her moving out for a bit and not having me immediately there to rub it. Not immediately there to talk about her day. Not immediately there to think about our problems OR for any intimacy. She will either miss me and want to come back or decide she really wants out. Perhaps it will be too easier for her to do the latter. But I cannot control that. I can only control becoming the best H I can be.
My secret hope is that on Wed at our next session there is NO added drama from me. I have said my peace. She knows how i feel (and yes she did say I initially said something else and I explained that was fear). The MC now knows everything that is going on (except W talking about extended stay). But I don't know if she is mentioning these things to just delay the inevitable (because when I asked during the MC if there was anything that could change for her to want to recommit and she said not right now, not how things are. Which is different from what she said at home).
I know I need to detach and GAL. I know I need to accept that maybe she really is toying with my emotions. I know...don't believe anything she says and only half of what she does. But which half?
Long story short: I came to this board without knowing the full picture. When I found out about OM I acted way too accommodating. I slowly backtracked which of course makes sense why W is confused. So I am beginning at week 1 of this process.
there's a lot in this so I'm going to just pick a few parts out. Others will focus on the OM more than I will- at the moment --- just b/c I want to focus on a few of your past comments I found maritally dangerous.
This is Not me defending your w's affair!
I don't know how conflicts were resolved in your family or origin or your wife's. That would be something to really look at. Do you recall how your parents or siblings dealt with conflict?
IMO, You are here largely b/c you both don't know how to fight fairly, so there's fear in her, and you don't actually resolve conflict. So feelings are pressed down, then they brew, and fester, and morph into intense feelings of resentment and alienation and for both of you - depression.
You have mentioned, repeatedly that you have a temper, you frequently "escalate" things when you are "emotional" (but really, when else would you escalate other than when it's emotional? I mean it's not much of a reason. )
You used the word "Violent" in arguments. That's a huge red flag to me and frankly, that bothers me so much that I can barely speak to the OM issues, without first saying WTF??
YES ^^that is something to fix asap. Otherwise It can literally be fatal. (I'm not being overly dramatic either. Tempers, stressors and affair partners are bad combinations.)
What are you doing to address your ability to express feelings of anger without losing control of your mouth or tone?
How will you learn to resolve conflicts in a better/different healthy way?
Your w has said she'd like a different marriage with you, so what would that look like and how are you showing her this?
(I'm not referring to OM but to your behavioral issues, specifically being worked on).
As for you being okay with her being polyamorous, "if you are in a good place", what does that mean? Are you also polyamorous?
Or do you mean if it's sex with another woman?
I have to say I'm having a hard time envisioning this working out well for you. That's partly b/c to me, being in a "good place" maritally would eliminate the perceived need for other lovers. I guess I'm mainstream in that way. I have read about swingers and open marriages. And their increased divorce rate.
So my main question would be,
Why throw gasoline on a fire, when staying married is hard enough as it is?
More later...
hang in there.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
If we were able to look in on that MC session where you "lost it", what we see you doing? Do you scream, pace around, throw things, curse, threaten, try to punch something? What be the main thing we saw that told us you had lost it.
As for as you considering an open M, have you ever been closely associated with the practice? I'm wondering if this more accommodation for your W.
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Because I felt she was trying to feel the desire to work on our M again.
Based on something she said or did that caused you to feel this way?
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Because I was hoping that her going through MC and hearing C say that contact with OM is not a good idea and how it's about what we both put into the relationship that this would make W realize that we have a long hard road ahead of us but that the longer OM is involved the harder it will be.
Has the MC made it clear........or have you been disappointed the MC didn't express enough of what you wanted your W to hear? From the quote above, have you been disappointed in the MC or your W's response?
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Because I trust my W when she says OM and her are friends.
But I thought you snooped and discovered they were more than friends.
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Because I know I need patience and also need to sin for my failures as a H.
Do you feel your failures as a H, justifies your W's affair?
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Because I don't want to end things even though I know they should be ended because of financial reasons beyond emotional reasons.
Could you explain what you mean, please?
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Because I see progress and every step forward I want it to be a larger step.
Can give one of the ways it has progressed?
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Because I think her talking to OM might make it easier on her.
I don't want to sound rude, however, this line of thinking is setting you up for something bad. You must not accommodate her EA/PA, nor a so-called "friendship" with OM.
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Because I don't know if I can trust her saying nice things about me while also saying she doesn't know yet.
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Because she changed wanting to go to MC because of wanting to end things peacefully to maybe wanting to see if she can feel she wants to work on it.
Okay
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Because I would hate knowing I am a failure at 40 with no kids and pretty much sacrificing that. I was okay not having kids because she didn't want kids but now I wonder if I made the right choice
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So, you were okay with her not wanting kids.......and you were accommodating her wishes over your own. But if she doesn't stay with you....it makes you a failure and you sacrificed the kids? I hope you will remember this when trusting her in other areas of the MR.
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Because I have gone for dual citizenship here and I would lose my native country's citizenship unless I am married to a US citizen.
Ohhhhhhhhh!
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Because I am stubborn and a fighter and I hate giving up.
How do you act when you are stubborn and a fighter?
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Because I don't think but rather feel.
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That's not good, b/c your wayward wife is operating out of emotions, also. There has to be someone with functional brain power!
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
IMO, You are here largely b/c you both don't know how to fight fairly, so there's fear in her, and you don't actually resolve conflict. So feelings are pressed down, then they brew, and fester, and morph into intense feelings of resentment and alienation and for both of you - depression.
Oh you hit it on the head. Although I think I mentioned this somewhere here: when she says something to me that is mean I shrug it off as her being just in the moment. She believes everything I say. I took her saying those things for granted and that added gasoline.
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You have mentioned, repeatedly that you have a temper, you frequently "escalate" things when you are "emotional" (but really, when else would you escalate other than when it's emotional? I mean it's not much of a reason. )
Yes. It is mostly because W doesn't seem to recognize that still speaking with OM is just something that is okay. I should have been firmer from the start that while I can forgive her for that indiscretion because clearly I caused her to drift away from me that any continued contact is not good. I was worried to lose her, and I thought maybe it could just work. Whatever it was, I didn't act well.
The past few weeks any meltdown was solely around OM, either her texting him, either her mentioning wanting to hang out.
On the other hand, beyond this sitch I have come to recognize that I also need to count to 10 more often. Especially when I feel cornered I can lash out. For the most part I am usually very calm. But what happened with W is that for too long I was afraid of what was happening with us (pretty much entire decade of knowing her) and I let things slide and when it reached it a boiling point it escalated.
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You used the word "Violent" in arguments. That's a huge red flag to me and frankly, that bothers me so much that I can barely speak to the OM issues, without first saying WTF??
Yes. And this is also part of why I focused on her being the problem for too long. Yes, I have pushed her out of the apartment (I was afraid and did that assuming she would apologize and say she was wrong...wtf indeed) but over the years she has been more violent with me that I said she has anger issues. I blame myself for being arrogant and not seeing that I too had anger issues. I told W actually today that I no longer want to win the fight at all cost. And to both our credit for the past three months we may have yelled at times or been upset but we have not had escalating fights that became violent (violence also being slamming doors, throwing stuff on the ground).
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YES ^^that is something to fix asap. Otherwise It can literally be fatal. (I'm not being overly dramatic either. Tempers, stressors and affair partners are bad combinations.)
I would never forgive myself for letting myself get too violent. The worst I could see myself doing is physically pushing her out which i have done before. But you're absolutely right. I think we both let things come to a boiling point and neither of us liked that. That pattern needs to stop.
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What are you doing to address your ability to express feelings of anger without losing control of your mouth or tone?
How will you learn to resolve conflicts in a better/different healthy way?
We will have to see my updates in the coming weeks but I think the MC session helped me become calmer. MC now knows W still talks to OM and W understands now fully that I am not okay with any contact. OM is also apparently afraid of me (which is funny because I am usually described as a gentle giant and OM has guns). I have mentally told myself that W has two choices: she can either contribute to the R and any contact with OM is purely as friends (and I am almost inclined to believe that) OR she can decide to play with my emotions and still engage in a PA. If she does that I expect her to either experience more psychological distress (right before I discovered evidence she was really at a low place and even seemed suicidal although she now denies saying that) OR for her to admit it and say she needs to move out and we need to pursue D.
Am I completely at ease? No. But W is afraid of me at times and she has legitimate reasons that go beyond OM for that. Now her not wanting NC doesn't help. But her fears need to be removed. Only I can do that and that can only happen when I stay calm. So I need to keep myself busy. And I also plan to journal whenever I have dark thoughts so I distract myself.
Will I succeed? Time will tell.
I also expect MC will help us with that and I believe that once W does IC she will receive tools to get over resentment. I have already mostly focused on the present and barely bring up the past.
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Your w has said she'd like a different marriage with you, so what would that look like and how are you showing her this? (I'm not referring to OM but to your behavioral issues, specifically being worked on). As for you being okay with her being polyamorous, "if you are in a good place", what does that mean? Are you also polyamorous? Or do you mean if it's sex with another woman? I have to say I'm having a hard time envisioning this working out well for you. That's partly b/c to me, being in a "good place" maritally would eliminate the perceived need for other lovers. I guess I'm mainstream in that way. I have read about swingers and open marriages. And their increased divorce rate.
Just as a clarification. W ONLY mentioned this the day after I discovered the PA. And maybe a few days after that. She has no longer expressed that desire. She IS a sexual creature but after she learned I too felt we didn't have enough sex she seemed to see me in a different light. The sex we have had lately has been more passionate and wild. This may be a good sign or it may not be. But I almost think W felt she was in a sexless marriage and couldn't see herself be a 30 year woman who wouldn't have much sex anymore. I do have some insecurities but have been way more open about them.
On the other hand from a theoretical perspective I COULD see myself being okay with polyamory. The ONLY way this works is communication and trust. Neither of which exist right now. I personally am completely fine having sex with only and just my W. But I am an academic so I explore that question differently than perhaps I should.
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Why throw gasoline on a fire, when staying married is hard enough as it is?
Well I think W needs to figure out if she is throwing gasoline on our R by remaining friends. She has said once she feels she wants to recommit she would break contact.
From my part I was way too accommodating and that of course confused W. But you're right. It was playing with fire. Honestly, she said herself that it was easier for her to work on us while she could see him. And that she saw me in a different light once it became a PA. She did seem less cold and more wanting to be intimate a few days before I found evidence BUT this was mixed with distress.
If we were able to look in on that MC session where you "lost it", what we see you doing? Do you scream, pace around, throw things, curse, threaten, try to punch something? What be the main thing we saw that told us you had lost it.
Funny you ask. I interrupted both the MC and W... probably the best term is "sounding frustrated" my W didn't seem to get that me getting emotional was because she keeps talking to OM. MC seems to agree. I did have tears near the end. So perhaps "losing it" doesn't describe it well but I was NOT calm, overly friendly and respectful.
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As for as you considering an open M, have you ever been closely associated with the practice? I'm wondering if this more accommodation for your W.
See my response above this post. This keeps being brought up in here but in reality W hasn't mentioned it. At one point she said she wants to be single and date again (maybe that first week after I discovered PA) but when I mentioned that during our last MC session she shook her head and said no she just feels she needs to be out of the home and rest. (at which point I 'lost' it and frustratingly said: you can have all the rest you want if there is NC. She calls that blackmail.
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Because I felt she was trying to feel the desire to work on our M again.
Based on something she said or did that caused you to feel this way?
She mentioned future steps. Liking that I can ease her anxiety. Looking for jobs for me in the state she wants to move to. Being more intimate towards me (not just sex)
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Has the MC made it clear........or have you been disappointed the MC didn't express enough of what you wanted your W to hear? From the quote above, have you been disappointed in the MC or your W's response?
No MC said that at the end of intake session that it is best that there are no other people involved. W in car after session said she couldn't yet commit to that. I was accommodating and of course that caused inner turmoil with me. I hated the idea of another fight so I just nodded. MC made it VERY clear that in her knowledge no couple has successfully resolved things when there was someone else involved. She also told W that because she is in MARRIAGE counseling that speaking with a person ALSO going through breaking up their relationship only leads to confusion.
I wonder if I can stay calm for a prolonged period that maybe W would be more comfortable letting him go. Like I said above...her fear of me is legitimate despite me not wanting her to be afraid. But I can only accomplish that by staying calm REGARDLESS of what she does. (in her eyes the PA is completely separate from our issues which in some way is true)
So yes, disappointed in W that she cannot even let him go just yet. And I told her that if she does that that it doesn't mean we are fixed. But it would be easier for me to when she asks for space and privacy to just do my own thing.
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Because I trust my W when she says OM and her are friends. But I thought you snooped and discovered they were more than friends.
Yes. She claims they are friends. First week she wanted to date me one night and go to a hotel with him the next night. THANK GOD his work hours are insane so they just went for a drink. She claims that night she said she could be friends with him. Maybe a day or two later she said when I discovered PA she still expected to sleep with him again. But ever since she says the conversation has been about jokes. Apparently OM offered to remove himself but she claims she begged him not to abandon her. In MC W mentioned OM could be a resource WHEN we would be divorced as everyone else she knew there has a connection to me.
Is she in denial about this? Possibly. Would she sleep with him first chance she has? Maybe. But I decided to take a risk. Not only am I going to see a friend for a few days after mentioning in MC that I have been afraid to leave her alone. She either gets rest and perhaps wants to recommit...or if she sees OM and continues PA she would likely experience psychological distress again like it happened right before I discovered evidence. Now, this time I wouldn't necessarily have evidence but it should help with W's fear that I don't give her space and privacy. W also mentioned considering doing extended stay in a hotel for a week to see if she would miss me. It has a huge risk of her being able to see OM. But it is clear she cares about me. It's clear she is exhausted. So nothing will improve unless she finds rest.
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Because I know I need patience and also need to sin for my failures as a H. Do you feel your failures as a H, justifies your W's affair?
Umm. Partially. I think I am able to forgive her for this because I wasn't innocent. I heard her say she wasn't happy. I heard her ask for MC a few years ago. I knew I wasn't perfect.
But I don't think she is justified to continue doing this WHILE also talking about possible future steps with me (trips, fixing house, moving to another state). She validates that I have made changes and improvements so at this point I don't think she is justified to have an A.
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Because I don't want to end things even though I know they should be ended because of financial reasons beyond emotional reasons. Could you explain what you mean, please?
Well divorce means we both go from two incomes to one. From living relatively comfortable to struggling. Emotionally I still want us to be married but beyond that there is a great financial cost from divorce. Now if there was no emotional investment money shouldn't be the reason you stay married.
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Because I see progress and every step forward I want it to be a larger step. Can give one of the ways it has progressed?
When I came to this board she was cold almost mean. She would hide her naked body from me. She wouldn't even want to do anything like go to a movie. Since then she has wanted to spend time with me (and this has continued despite my emotional breakdowns), she went from basically no intimacy not even a hug to last week on the trip having sex once or multiple times every day. From laughing in my face that nothing could save the marriage to more and more talking about possible future plans. Now, mix in some fear as to how I reacted at times the progress stopped.
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Because I think her talking to OM might make it easier on her. I don't want to sound rude, however, this line of thinking is setting you up for something bad. You must not accommodate her EA/PA, nor a so-called "friendship" with OM.
Not rude at all. I kind of agree. But I have begged, demanded, pleaded, asked nicely both in and outside of MC to please enter NC. Other than insisting she leaves the house I don't see what else I can do. She now KNOWS I am not happy he is still around. And she claims that it has been weeks ago when she last talked to him deep into the night which is something she did early on...mostly because he works late hours.
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Because I don't know if I can trust her saying nice things about me while also saying she doesn't know yet.
I mean... She doesn't know if she wants to be married yet says I look amazing, smell amazing, am amazing...all sorts of things. I guest worst case scenario she is lying. Best case scenario: she still is in love... other likely scenario: she cares about me but isn't in love.
Honestly, I asked her today to think about what it is she is missing in our R (other than our fights and conflict resolution needing improvement) she says she loves spending time with me, thinks we have great sexual chemistry and laughs with me. She calls me her best friend. To me marriage is a solid friendship where you love doing things with each other.
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Because I am stubborn and a fighter and I hate giving up. How do you act when you are stubborn and a fighter?
Well I am not telling her to just leave. It would be easy to just get this over with. I am basically living with someone who wants to be in her own room. Who doesn't say ILY. Who has already found someone she loves having sex with. Who is still there. I mean... that is a lot of extra things to deal with and especially knowing that with every day it drags on that I am wasting restarting my life. But I see it as I am already restarting my life and hopefully my W jumps on board at some point. It's easier to do that if she lives under the same roof.
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Because I don't think but rather feel. That's not good, b/c your wayward wife is operating out of emotions, also. There has to be someone with functional brain power!
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I agree In the first part I was able to do that and I slowly got her coming back. Then I discovered the PA and ever since I am having difficulty controlling emotions.
At the same time I am not turning down intimacy because I really feel it rebuilds some connection. It doesn't fix everything and I am trying not to initiate it. But I do think W missed some sexual passion with me for some while and maybe this will at least be a building block. Not that everything is fixed. But if she thinks of me just as a friend than not having any intimacy seems like a danger.
You have been given a lot of great advice. I was in a similar place to you after b d in September and was just like you, including allowing myself to listen to my w speak openly about OM, entertaining an open M, and a general willingness to do anything to save the M. The two best pieces of advice that I got here and seriously helped were to believe and then act and then say:
1. I will not be in a three way relationship. 2. I want to be your H not your friend.
I was afraid if I believed or acted on or said those things that it would be the end of the R. Instead, those were important steps in reclaiming my dignity and self identity apart from my W.
Another observation from your posts is I think you think and analyze you and your W and your situation way too much. It isn't helping you. Analysis is good. Over analysis suffocates and paralyzes you. I have learned this the hard way. That's one of the reasons why GAL and one day at a time is so important, to free your mind to think of other things or nothing at all. To do otherwise is too taxing and draining to do for the marathon that is before you.
Peace,
Gordie
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
But the emotional temper thing is still an issue. You seem to think b/c it's mostly about OM, it's alright. It's not alright to interact the way you two do, with any conflicts and this is a loaded one.
*you were not calm or in control of yourself when there was no OM in the picture, so it's something you have to work on.*
It is not attractive to see a man who cannot remain calm. It says "I cannot control myself" and is often coupled with a man who seeks to control others, ironically. Do not confuse a hot temper with romantic passion.
So I'd want to know what you are specifically doing to address your "heated communication" issues. We can all calmly compromise when a topic is not emotional or terribly important to us. That's the easy stuff we learn in school.
But dealing with a tension filled conflicting desires/emotions and lack of certainty about outcome, is always going to happen in life.
So whatever boundary or line you create, you still need to deal with this^^^ issue.
I know you are in pain. Gosh I don't mean to hammer you about something you already regret. I'm rooting for you.
I just worry it's being sort of tossed aside as not that big a deal. A vague promise to talk to a MC about it...
Throwing/breaking things, pushing her, are significant red flags to me and continue to be.
You can't just say "if she stops seeing OM then I'll be calm" - THEN we will handle things in a way we have not before...
how's that going to happen?
I know she has issues too.
But she's not here working on the m, you are.
Keep at this.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
