Gordie: Pulling it all together

[Gordie]

Random scene from the twilight zone:

Gordie: do you want me to buy you a Valentine's Day gift this year?
W: yes
Gordie: any suggestions?
W: lingerie

[Woke_Up]

Twilight Zone is exactly it...

I'm not planning on asking the question. We did the Christmas thing for each other, spent a reasonable amount.

Doing Valentines says we are in R. If she is still contacting OM at that point, then [cesnored] Valentines.

Ask me in 3 weeks how I got on...

[Dawgs]

Doing Valentines says we are in R. If she is still contacting OM at that point, then [cesnored] Valentines.

^ This

[010207]

Gordie,

do yourself a favor and don't get sucked into that. You're setting yourself up for heartache. If you could do a quiet dinner or a small day trip just to spend time together, I could see that because it has benefits. But a gift, specifically lingerie that may not be for you (sorry, don't mean to be cruel) is too much to ask for right now.

[Dawgs]

I'd go even further and say don't even do that. What is the symbolism behind VD? Love and relationship, right? Now, if she is in love with someone else, even if "imaginary" (I still say where there is smoke...), then why on earth set yourself up for heartache? She'd see it as pursuing and nothing else.

[Gordie]

I posted this over on Lex23's thread:

I never forbid my wife from complaining but she does not do it much. I think she does hold back telling me her issues for whatever reason. She does not think I understand her, and perhaps I don't.

Lex23,

This is perhaps the biggest issue I am facing in my situation, so wanted to share a few thoughts:

*Your W doesn't complain much/tell you her issues...not because she doesn't have complaints or issues, but because she isn't comfortable doing so...this may be her own issue (in my W's situation, that's what was modeled to her in her family and that's what she was taught a good W did)...or it may be her relationship with you (Lex23 doesn't listen to me, so I don't even try to tell him).

*Your W doesn't think you understand her...now this is a chicken and egg from hell...she doesn't think you understand her so she doesn't tell you about herself...and when she doesn't tell you about herself, how can you possibly understand her?

So what can you do to try and change this dynamic?

Part 1. What parts of her complaints about you and your relationship are valid? Here's what I found/asked when I looked hard at myself:

*Do you want to be a guy who doesn't listen to people when they are trying to talk to you? NO!

*Do you want to be a guy who thinks he is right all the time so much that other people think it's pointless to disagree with you? NO!

*Do you want to be a guy who talks down to others? NO!

I could go on and on, but you get the point...what are your issues? What are the questions you need to be asking yourself? What are the things you want to change to be the best Lex23 ever?

Part 2. Does your W feel emotionally connected to you? If not, the above may improve your R with others, but probably not your W. For me, I have needed to improve my communication skills AND my emotional connection to my W in order for her to open up to me and opening up to me includes a lot of what has been lacking in our R: her disagreeing with me, her complaining and getting angry with me, her yelling and screaming at me! Does this sound like an improvement over the fake-calm, conflict avoidance? Yes, it actually is because my W is now being more honest with me than she ever has before and is letting out the things that she has been holding in for years.

[ForGump]

Gordie-- sounds like you're making great strides in understanding why your marriage is falling apart. I think most often it's not just one thing; it's a mix of things:

(a) the things we husbands did that just angered/frustrated the wives for years;
(b) a midlife crisis; and
(c) the wives' personalities/personal histories.

It's good for us to work on (a) but (b) and (c) ... will take a long time to play out and resolve, if at all. Maybe this is an obvious point but I guess I just want to say it's good to try to see what is an issue that is a life-long issue (i.e., (c)), vs. something confined to just your marriage (i.e., (a)).

Just thinking aloud, as reading your situation helps me think about mine.

As for the V-day gift ... my vote is to give her something thoughtful that reflects your warm feelings for her, but nothing explicitly sexual.

[ForGump]

How did you end the delusion?

Gordie, your post on 1/13/17 says your W recognizes that the POM may not reciprocate.

If that's correct, if that's a steadily held point of view by your W, then she's not delusional. She has an intense infatuation w/ the POM, but realizes that it's one-sided. That's a healthier place to be.

Or does she sometimes slip into thinking that he loves her back? And/or that he's actually done certain things to demonstrate his feelings for her?

[Gordie]

***Gordie, your post on 1/13/17 says your W recognizes that the POM may not reciprocate. If that's correct, if that's a steadily held point of view by your W, then she's not delusional. She has an intense infatuation w/ the POM, but realizes that it's one-sided. That's a healthier place to be.***

Yes, I think this is where she is.

***Or does she sometimes slip into thinking that he loves her back? And/or that he's actually done certain things to demonstrate his feelings for her?***

According to her, she believes that he loves her back, but she hasn't actually asked him point blank, so doesn't know for sure.

[ForGump]

She believes that he loves her back

OK, that slides the scale more towards delusional.... (IMHO)