The moderators can pull this if they think this is inappropriate but I found nothing in the rules that are against this.
I've found sandi2's perspective invaluable and know that many few the same. We love it when she drops in on our threads and some even ask her to in other people's threads. I know I'm not alone in looking through her thousands of posts.
I was hoping that we can have a thread asking her general questions about wayward spouses.
To start, I'd like know how to deal with an ambivalent ww in general.
Last edited by Cadet; 11/21/1610:44 AM. Reason: bolded question #1 - cadet
- m and ww in 30s - s4 - m 11 yrs, t12 -ilybinilwy ~5/16 + request for OM - bd 7/16, confirm ea and strongly suspected pa - 9/16 ww claimed to have broken contact with om
- m and ww in 30s - s4 - m 11 yrs, t12 -ilybinilwy ~5/16 + request for OM - bd 7/16, confirm ea and strongly suspected pa - 9/16 ww claimed to have broken contact with om
Wow Jug! I am honored..........and humbled. I appreciate Cadet posting the links to my threads. If I can help anyone, I will certainly try. My problem is trying to do it with fewer words than it probably takes.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I hope this becomes a nice place to get sandi2's advice!
- m and ww in 30s - s4 - m 11 yrs, t12 -ilybinilwy ~5/16 + request for OM - bd 7/16, confirm ea and strongly suspected pa - 9/16 ww claimed to have broken contact with om
Are there any signs that the W is feeling a loss and or showing remorse? My W has made some recent changes. My expectations are 0 but I can't help but notice she is different. Maybe she is playing/manipulating me.
I just thought I'd ask.
M:50 W:53 MR:20 D:21 S:17 S:11 BD-Sept 2015 Suspected PA Sept 2015-Confronted W & OM Dec 2015 Actually EA In house Sep:Jan/16-May 2016 W moved out:May 22 2016 OM-Intro Oct/17-On scene July/Aug 2017
Are there any signs that the W is feeling a loss and or showing remorse? My W has made some recent changes. My expectations are 0 but I can't help but notice she is different. Maybe she is playing/manipulating me.
If you have ever seen how a person acts when they realize the harm their actions have caused..........then that will give you a clue to how she feels when the remorse is authentic.
If the remorse is genuine, she will not have that intense anger lashing out toward her H. She will not make her digs at him when talking. She won't be sarcastic or bitter with him. She may feel so ashamed she acts uncomfortable around him. Her attitude will show humility. She may, or may not, make statements of feeling shame. She will feel so much sorrow and regret for her actions that have torn her M apart....and her family apart, that she may cry when she sees him leaving with the kids, or when he tells her good-bye on the phone.
Different women will respond to those feelings in different ways. She may not say anything right away, but the H may detect a softness about her overall. She isn't the unwilling, mean, blaming, and selfish person he had previously witnessed. She loses the entitlement. She does not display any behavior or attitude of disrespect for her H.
I believe it is critical that the H does not take her back immediately upon her apologetic statements. He can forgive her, but apology is not an automatic shift into reconciliation. It is a neccessary first step. It is also critical that she freely expresses her sorrow to him and apologize........without any prompting from him. . She may not express everything at one time, and if he eagerly jumps in and suggests they reconcile........it could stunt the progression of her journey back from her waywardness. He should not try to help her by putting words in her mouth. He needs to be quite and kindly listen. She may, or may not, ask for his forgiveness or ask if she can have another chance. But if she does, the H can either tell her he has a lot to think about, or he can calmly tell her he forgives. I think it's important that he doesn't assume that anything else comes from this moment. This is not reconciling. It is her expressing her sorrow and, maybe, apologizing. He should not start asking about her feelings for him, the future, etc.
On the subject of what are some signs that she is suffering loss....... it completely depends upon what is her loss. Some H's may never have a clue to what that one, or final, thing was that caused her fantasy to crumble into ashes.
An entitled WW who begins to experience loss to material things or not getting her selfishness appeased.........will usually show anger and vindictiveness. An accumulation of things could be effective in opening her eyes to her reality. However, it may not change her heart. As long as she displays resentment, sarcasm, bitterness, disrespect, and has a rebellious attitude..........she's a long way from feeling any remorse.
Let me add that in most cases, IMHO, her experiencing a particular loss is not a guarantee reconciliation will take place. However, I do think that it is necessary to break her stubborn pride, replaced with remorse, and prep her willingness to open the door for reconciliation.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
- m and ww in 30s - s4 - m 11 yrs, t12 -ilybinilwy ~5/16 + request for OM - bd 7/16, confirm ea and strongly suspected pa - 9/16 ww claimed to have broken contact with om
Hi Sandi2, my sitch has moved at warp speed, but I'd like some of your thoughts. I'll give the background first.
11/3 was BD. She told me we needed to work on some things in our relationship and she was willing, that there wasn't someone else. (via text)
Later that evening when we spoke face-to-face she admitted there was someone and she'd been seeing them for about 2 weeks, but wasn't sure it was real enough yet to lose me.
Less than 1 week later she told me she wanted to separate with intent to D and that her telling me she wanted to work on us was just her telling me what I wanted to hear. That this OW made her feel happier than she's ever been and just at ease with herself so she was no longer worried about losing me, she wanted me gone ASAP so the OW could start coming to the house. (It was her house prior to our M)
I'm now moved out. The week after she said she wanted me gone she stayed at OW's every night we didn't have my SS. The night before I moved out we had him, but she decided they'd stay at her dad's that night rather than staying at the house.
She was a mess that night, crying, constantly apologizing for hurting me, hugging me more than once for long periods of time not wanting to let me go. While previously she had told me she'd rather be at OW's than with me any time, she now was telling me she had been gone all week just because it was too hard to be around me. It made her hurt and reminded her of how she hurt me.
She said she has never been more ashamed of herself in all her life. I made the mistake of telling her I still didn't want to S or D, she just looked at me cried and said nothing. I didn't beg, bring up the "good" or even cry myself as I watched her fall apart so I felt like I remained overall detached as to not push her away by being desperate.
After that she continued to tell me sorry, how unfair it was for her to be such a mess since she caused all of this. I just listened and validated that I know it is difficult for her too.
She kept saying how hard it was to see all of my things packed and how she never imagined us here in this situation. She told me she does in fact love me and I stated simply that I don't what she means by that anymore. As a friend? Like a family member? She just looked hurt when I said those things and said she isn't sure how she feels about anything really. After that they left.
I could see the hurt and confusion on her face, and it of course gave me hope that she was second guessing her decision, but now we're apart and she can fill her time with the OW as much as possible. Do you think she was truly remorseful? I know that even if she is it doesn't mean that we will reconcile. I just wanted your thoughts on that.
Me: 35 W: 32 MR: 2y T: 3.5y SS11 BD: 11/3/16 EA: 10/26/16 PA: 11/11/16 W asks for S/D & ILYBINILWY 11/13/16 Status: I moved out 11/19/16, GAL I filed for D: 12/14/16 D-day: 3/10/17
A lot of people here talk about "garnering respect" from their wives, by a Man... I'd be curious how one delineates "controlling" from "boundaries" I've struggled with this along my journey as I know my wife would say that I was someone that had to be in control of most aspects in our lives.
So how does one garner the respect without appearing to be controlling? (Sandi2 hoping you'll chime in on this one ;-)
Me: 40 W: 45 T: 13, M: 11 1 D: 9
Suspect A 6/15 ILBINILWY 8/15, and 3/16 EA/PA Discovered 3/16 EA admitted 3/16 W Moved out 4/16 W opens R talk and says A over 1/17
