'Right fighter' - really. Who is always right? You just need to grow up on that one. Sorry 2x4. I'm don't know everything and neither does anyone else. Might not like it but it's true.
Surfer.
M46/W40/D8/S6/T20/M12/Separated 6/2016,W takes kids Issues2009 Wpartying w/g.f's2013on EA2013PAdeniedWleavesMBR ImeetAP/EAhalts VariousBDDates MFCourse WSpew EAresumes I halt Wrages DBIng4/2016
It sounds like your situation may not be so bad as it seems, as long as you can get to the point where you are living in the same location. It's not an excuse, but perhaps the main reason for his straying was simply that you weren't available, and he wanted someone, anyone, to fill a physical role. And then he got caught up in it a little more than he expected and started to have feelings for her. It doesn't necessarily mean he did it because there was anything wrong with you. But then maybe he saw differences between the two of you and saw things he liked in her that you didn't have.
I think that is what has happened with my husband. His reason for looking for a second wife was something that simply we can't do anything about so I don't feel I failed him in any way, but nevertheless once he found someone he has gotten a bit carried away with it all in terms of being a bit obsessed with her and thinking she is perfect (anyone is perfect if you don't live with them yet). But we don't have any serious inherent problems between us that should drive us apart so I am trying to take a face value his assertion that he knows he will get bored of her in a year or two, and if history repeats itself like with our marriage I would expect him to start reclaiming his space after 6-7 months, which will coincide with Ramadan this year when his temper will go sky high from 2pm to iftar and I have already told him he will be spending that time with HER, not me--there's at least one benefit to polygamy hahahaha! But it should help to speed up the detaching that he needs to do.
But truthfully, I think what is working for you is working for me too. I'm very confident in the fundamentals of our relationship and I have made a special effort since we have been apart to always remain very cheery and upbeat when we talk and it seems to be working at least in keeping things good between us. I even managed to get away with a joke today about suggesting he run away from his wedding to join me to do something else around the same date and he didn't get angry and just said well you can do it if you want, but not with me. But I felt it was a good step because he didn't get nervous about me making a joke like that and think that I was trying to sabotage things.
Surfer, I was pointing out what I did wrong before the A and how I am trying to change that.(I was 2x4'ing myself, ) "Right fighting" is the supreme form of stupidity, you can be right or be happy. I was showing my former behaviors that I am working on changing. The reason I have been so affectionate and warm towards WH, also showing him I am willing to be forgiving and gentle, is because I am showing him what he can lose if he walks away. More importantly I am making these changes because it is the right thing to do. Obviously I was presenting it utterly wrong, I am working on stopping the bad behavior and doing a 180, I wasn't saying these previous behaviors were good, quite the opposite.
I read the 5 love languages and took the online quiz. Later I convinced WH to take the quiz and he came out very high on the Physical affection. So I have made myself warm and touch him a lot now, this results in him softening and turning back towards me. Sadly when he's been at work I am out of sight and mind, his mind starts to forget the warmth and affection, he starts to remember the "list" of my previous behavior. So I've come to expect these pendulum swings when he is out of town. I was expecting him to go cold again. I wasn't expecting the non sequitur comment about the OW and broke the rules by showing my temper.
2Lady, My WH CHOSE to work away from his family for money. I requested he stay with us and settle for less money for 2 years until I completed my residency. When he met this woman and started having sex with her 3 weeks later. I don't think anything I did or didn't do can justify his behavior. It is zinah and punishable by death in our religion. He had an affair because he is an insecure man with low self esteem who felt his ego stroked by a 20 year old nurse who told him how amazing he was because he was a doctor. If men could just take multiple wives like picking different flavor foods (get bored with one just get another) then I would not be part of this religion. I don't think our situations are comparable. Polygamy the way my husband tried to approach it is haram. She was kufr and her wali would not have consented. The fact that they committed zinah and then WH tried to shoe horn his situation into polygamy is disgusting and an insult to the true reason polygamy was practiced during our prophet's time. The Ow said point-blank she did not believe in polygamy and was just humoring my WH when she said she would consider it.
M 10yrs T 13yrs BD #1Oct 2015-PA between WAH and COW BD #2 April 2016-WH resumed PA, she broke it off Jan 2 2017 WH says he wants divorce April '17-Letting go 2018 D busted DD8, DS6, DS3
1) Keep showering him with affection* 2) Don't withold**
* - If it works do it. Do you make sure you look sexy but aloof when you do this? ** - Men hate withholding. Full stop. Never do it. Who did you learn this behaviour from? I will explain more when you tell me.
Surfer.
Withholding what? I guess we need to wait for the explanation?
Hi SH, I may have misunderstood you while squinting at my tiny phone screen.
For me, boundaries and consequences are things that are within my control and that I can enforce.
Sara won't be able to make her h do anything if he decides that he is going to talk non- stop about his wayward feelings. If she asks him to stfu, he will just feel justified in his wayward feelings.
If she tells him that he must stop or she will kick his a$$ to the kerb, that's an ultimatum - she's trying to control his actions and forcing his hand.
What she can do is to walk away and resume when things are more pleasant.
On many first -person affair recovery sites, the former waywards confess that it takes time for them to get over the addiction of A. It may take at least 1 to 2 years.
They will want to talk about the op. They will have feelings about the op and will want to reminisce about the A.
These are normal. It hurts like cr@p but that is their reality. These may not mean that they have no intention of working on the M.
Sara will have to watch the actions of her h and be prepared to ride out the waves. If her h shows willingness to work on the M, then I say give her H a chance.
Not all returning spouses jump back into the M as evolved beings dying to show their sincere remorse and unshakable loyalty. There may still be a lot of doubt, guilt, shame and anger.
These are issues that have to be worked through. And piecing will probably be for the rest of the M and lives.
It took time for the waywards to become waywards. It will take time for them to reverse the waywardness.
You can call me Dory/ Grl.
As a wise fish once sang,"Just keep swimming!"
It's no use to go back to yesterday because I was a different person then.
I think my points to Sara are going largely misunderstood... Much too much focus on WH and not enough focus on Sara...
Jksd, I agree with all that you say here, and that is what leads to my question... Why are we focusing on WH? Sara has no control nor influence over him... My words are to encourage that Sara focus on detachment, GAL,thought control and forgiveness... All of these are the first points from MWD in speaking of infidelity... This is what Sara can control... And her reasoning, is what you share Grl... WH should be willing to speak of the affair, be done with the affair, and put in his efforts before Sara can do much with working on the MR...
Has this been agreed to by him? If so, I have missed it.
I will leave this point as it has always been my most focused point and strong belief and understanding with DBing and the the things MWD has taught... The first and most important focus is on ourself first...
Sara, I am always going to be here to support you. We arrived at much the same time and you were there for me as I have tried to be there for you. I do not know what you are going through as I have never experienced waywardness, personally... but I have a very close friend whose W went wayward over 2 years ago and is still with him...he did not have DB until I found it this year and shared it with him...he still has not put the focus on himself first, his WW seems over the OP and willing to work on the MR... The issue is now he is nearly a WAH. She stays...he has set the bar way to high as MWD explains it... He did not work on himself and still continues not to. No GAL... No thought stopping... No forgiveness... No detaching...
These are my points that I am encouraging that get your focus first...
So I apologize if my attempts to nudge you and Cherry into extreme focus on these things first is coming off as anything related to giving up on the MR or tossing the WH out...
Not my intent... I will back up with my advice because I may be a bit hardened to WS as I have several friends struggling...MWD advice is the best, I just pray the cart is not being placed before the horse...I pray that her upcoming book on infidelity comes out soon as she has announced...more clarification of her teachings may shed light for many...
You and your family are in my prayers.
A good quote that I want to share before stepping back is one that I am trying to apply in my own life and challenges, I hope you may find some wisdom and hope from it as I have.
When you focus on problems, you create more problems. When you focus on possibilities , you will have more possibilities. Zig Zigler
I see much possibility in Sara. Once Sara has strengthened herself through the things she can control with detachment, GAL, Thought stopping, and Forgiveness...and WH agrees to stop all affairs with any OP...then the healing can begin no matter the length of time...or ups and downs... You are awesome, strong, and a wonderful person a great mother and a fighter for what you believe in...these all make you the woman that only a fool would leave...already at this moment you are that woman... Keep focus on Sara and you will prevail.
(((((PsySara)))))
Me 46 Former W 46 D19 D7 BD Feb 2016 WAW moves out 4/16/16 D final 6/1/2017
It's time for me to start changin' the way I look at the world......and at myself. ~James Howlett aka Wolverine
All noted. You can be happy or right this is true. However, whilst you highlight your H's insecurities perhaps 'right fighting' may be a product of your own. I'd scratch death the surface a little more if we're you. I say this because my W is still 'right fighting' but much much less. MIL is big on this too. Why doe people do this do you think? Be honest because it's something I need to understand. Are they over competitive, insecure (hate it when people don't agree and validate) or something else or a combination?
My W used to say I did the 'out of sight out of mind' thing. To some degree this is true of course because when you're at work you're working you're not supposed to be sat thinking about you and your family all the time. Also, when you are having (non-wayward) fun elsewhere, why not have fun rather than dwelling on your partner etc). Again when my wife raIsed this I thought about it. I wondered if she felt that there wasn't enough affection, chasing or possibly control over me on her part. If I am honest I think this again has some foundation in insecurity. What do you think?
What I am trying to understand is whether there is some insecurity in this behaviour from my W - granted her sitch is different to yours but there are similar languages here.
BTW you seem a little better rested and I am pleased about that. I hope you are feeling better.
Surfer.
M46/W40/D8/S6/T20/M12/Separated 6/2016,W takes kids Issues2009 Wpartying w/g.f's2013on EA2013PAdeniedWleavesMBR ImeetAP/EAhalts VariousBDDates MFCourse WSpew EAresumes I halt Wrages DBIng4/2016
Dory, Thank you for your thoughts. I am trying to work on myself and make myself a less stubborn, softer and and warmer person all around. I am trying to put my ego on the back burner. Most importantly I am trying to build positive memories (now) so my WH has something to think about when he is drifting.
SH, MWD tells people that you can influence your partner, she is very adamant about that. The entire design of her DBing is about how you can influence the people around you by truly listening to them and then doing trial and error. She has an entire video on youtube saying "You can push their buttons because you installed most of them." She is has been clear that it can take one to tango and save a marriage, it is the one way her technique differ from every other marriage expert. My WH hasn't spoken to the OW since June when I confronted and found about their second affair in April. Mostly this is because she cut him off and walked away. Meanwhile he's been pining and withdrawing from her. So while his thinking is wayward he is not still in the affair.
Surfer, You asked why I was a "right fighter?" Good question and one I am still thinking about. My first thought is it's an ego issue. I grew up in a contentious family where arguing was constant and sometimes ended in violence between my brothers. I really struggled with apologies. It felt like losing a piece of myself to be wrong. (the arrogance, right??) I've gotten better about this but still have a looooong way to go. As far as "out of sight, out of mind." I am not expecting my WH to dwell on us constantly, but when he is living away from us he starts to question if there is any benefit to being married to me. He will start to say we aren't compatible, we argue too much, we never have any fun, etc., etc., However when he's here he says how much joy and love he feels, how much easier it is to forget the OW. It's hard to paint your spouse as the villain when she's sitting there and doing and behaving on good way, ykwim? (this is addressing my marriage)
M 10yrs T 13yrs BD #1Oct 2015-PA between WAH and COW BD #2 April 2016-WH resumed PA, she broke it off Jan 2 2017 WH says he wants divorce April '17-Letting go 2018 D busted DD8, DS6, DS3
I just caught up on your sitch. I totally agree with what you said "do what works". Shower him with affection. You have seen the results of what that does. The results are positive. Although maybe not always perfect, it is positive and over time will strengthen the relationship.
I can relate to your struggles having 5 little ones of my own and know how hard it is to work full time and balance everything else in the house. You are amazing!
H-46 XW-38 T-7 M-6 S-9,8,8,6,4 S 11/30/15, I filed 12/8/15 EA 2/1/16 D dismissed 3/24/16 PA 3/18/16 confirmed 4/22/16 XW files for D 4/1/16 - D final 11/17/16 Finally moving forward...
) "Right fighting" is the supreme form of stupidity, you can be right or be happy. I was showing my former behaviors that I am working on changing. The reason I have been so affectionate and warm towards WH, also showing him I am willing to be forgiving and gentle, is because I am showing him what he can lose if he walks away. More importantly I am making these changes because it is the right thing to do. Obviously I was presenting it utterly wrong, I am working on stopping the bad behavior and doing a 180, I wasn't saying these previous behaviors were good, quite the opposite.