Keep Wearing Wedding Band? [Thread #5]

[ForGump]

She doesn't want that guilt.

Yes, she always tries to frame it as both of us being culpable. When she says that I've tried to say -- or maybe I just thought of it in my head -- that yes, of course we are both responsible for how the marriage worked, but I wanted to work on it, rather than get a divorce, so the divorce itself is on you, as are any affairs.

I will likely do some type of last resort letter, not so much in the hopes that she'll spin around and change her mind, but to put it down clearly on paper that this is something she chose, not me, and that from the beginning I respected, value and wanted to save our marriage.

[ForGump]

She doesn't want that guilt.

Yes, she always tries to frame it as both of us being culpable. When she says that, I've tried ... to say -- or maybe I just thought of it in my head -- that yes, of course we are both responsible for how the marriage worked, but I always wanted to work on it, rather than get a divorce, so the divorce itself is on you, as are any affairs.

I will likely do some type of last resort letter, not so much in the hopes that she'll spin around and change her mind, but to put it down clearly on paper that this is something she chose, not me, and that from the beginning I respected, valued and wanted to save our marriage.

[ForGump]

Journaling:

Cut out from work at 4, ran over to gym (it's very close) and had a short/light workout. Felt great.

Picked up my son from a playdate at 5:15. W texts that she needs to decompress from the stress of work (SAHM, trying to jump start her career alongside the D).

I got home and got right to cooking dinner. Kids liked it. Then I cleaned the dinner table and the kitchen, including two days worth of dirty dishes that had piled up.

W on FB the whole time.

Got my son ready for bed, but W criticized me for not having him cleaning up his coloring pencils: "I don't want to be the only one telling him to clean up." In my mind I could hear myself responding, "There are so many things where I'm the only one doing it," but I didn't say it, I just worked with my son to clean up his stuff.

W thanked me for cleaning all the dishes.

Now the house is dark and it's quiet. I feel satisfied with today. The word "happy" comes to mind. I know I'm not quite there yet, but that's ok. I think I can get there.

[AndrewP]

^^^^ Like

You'll get there my friend. It sounds like the healing has started.

[PsySara]

Can I marry you?! JK but I would give an arm if WH did all of that! Some of our biggest arguments before his affair was he rarely helped out around the house, and that was usually after I nagged him. I am at the point where I have resigned myself to doing all the housework.

[lt0402]

Got my son ready for bed, but W criticized me for not having him cleaning up his coloring pencils: "I don't want to be the only one telling him to clean up." In my mind I could hear myself responding, "There are so many things where I'm the only one doing it," but I didn't say it, I just worked with my son to clean up his stuff.

Yep, sometimes you just have to pick your battles. I feel your pain here FG bc I always want to defend myself when W does this. Best to stick to what your boundaries are and fight to protect those. Good work!

W thanked me for cleaning all the dishes.

To me that shows your W has respect for you and what you do around the house. Maybe I'm misreading the situation but that seems like a good thing. My W hasn't thanked me for anything in months, just constant criticism. completely disrespectful all the time. If there's any positive here it's that she still has some respect for you.

That visceral, physical, sexual tie I felt with my W ... it is being weathered away by months of her coldness and anger. In a way, she's making it easier for me to divorce her. I'm sure it's her subconscious way of making the world consistent for herself -- it's easier to make me the bad guy and want to leave, rather than to admit I'm a decent guy and still want to leave me.

I'm going through this right now too FG. The coldness and meanness make them horribly unattractive. I find myself wondering now, if I didn't have a child with this person, would I have already filed. My IC says the coldness and anger show their ambivalence. It's a defense mechanism to force themselves headfirst down the path they are moving along. Hell, my W went so far as to get a tattoo on her wrist that says "Let Go". If they are so hell bent on leaving us behind why even bother expending the energy to beat us up at every turn. They always seem to be trying to reinforce their image of us as the bad guy so they aren't forced to look inwards at their real problems.

You are doing the right thing by not stalling but making her drive this thing. Keep being strong and you will be good. we are both headed down the path of getting out of this in house S stuff. It will be interesting to see how things shake out of we ever escape it. I'm guessing things will be different with the 24/7 stress of W being removed, but who knows.

[ForGump]

Can I marry you?! ... I am at the point where I have resigned myself to doing all the housework.

Why? So that a few years down the road you can feel mothered and suffocated by me? Non merci!

PsySara, I hope you somehow find yourself married to a true partner in the near future. You deserve nothing less. Every mother deserves nothing less. Every woman. Every person.

BTW, look at Ruth Bader Ginsberg's op-ed piece in the NY Times today. She has some good stuff in there about marriage and the support she got from her partner, who actually ran their kitchen. That made me feel good, because I can really hold my own in the kitchen.

[ForGump]

LT-- I appreciate your thoughts.

At this point, I'm kind of done being strategic. Done with 180's. Done with picking the right battles -- I don't want any battle, period, because it's all pointless. Done with "doing what works." I am just working on being authentic, being me, being good, holding onto my values, and loving my kids. I try to be kind to my W but no more than is welcome (and not much is welcome), and, again, not because I'm trying to bust anything, but because I believe that's how I want to treat another human being.

The woman I loved isn't there no more. I don't know what happened to her, but she is gone. I think some combination of personality disorder and midlife crisis took her away, and quite possibly the person I thought I loved wasn't quite there in the first place. She may have made a mistake choosing me. She may have forced herself to fit a role she never felt comfortable about. Doesn't matter -- I don't have to have the answers.

She probably has some respect for me, somewhere. But much of her actions are driven by guilt. So her thank you was probably given so she can feel better about herself. And I think what your IC says is absolutely right. I know she knows and remembers very well who I was in her life, and how much I adored her. Which is exactly why she has to make such an effort to be annoyed and angry at me.

But you know what. That's OK. I forgive her. I have no anger for her, just sadness. Reminds me of "I forgive it all," by Mudcrutch. Which is actually one of her favorites.

I send you my best wishes, LT -- a fellow traveller.

[CT1118]

FG - that was a good song suggestion. I'd never heard it.

I understand how you feel, I know things can feel like you are scamming your W into coming back, scamming yourself into being who you are not. I would suggest you take a second look. The 180, doing what works, the strategy - you should know by know that is all to be a BETTER you, not a different you. It is not about your W. If I am mistaken, I do apologize, but I am telling you this because I care about you as my friend. Your posts, they don't read like you are doing something that works for you. Your reply to Sara, even if meant in humor, seemed so self deprecating. I do not have the answer, you do. I am only asking that you keep searching for it inside yourself. I hope you had a good day today buddy.


Please take 10 minutes to read this:

http://bulletin.kenyon.edu/x4280.html

You can also search for it on youtube - this is water.

[ForGump]

CT --

I feel pretty good about myself. I feel pretty good about moving on -- at least for myself. I am, as I keep lamenting here, very sad for my kids. Being here in this forum has helped me through some rough times, and has helped me find some direction in these hard times. Having a decent IC helped a lot. And time heals. Something happens, as you see your W behave the way she does, day after day, week after week, month after month. Over time, I have come to see and feel, that the D isn't about me. It's about her. Sure, yes, it's also an opportunity for me to own up to my failures in the marriage, as every partner has failures in a marriage, and it's an opportunity for me to make myself better. I believe I'm doing that.

I'm not done hurting, but I'm able to see that there is goodness beyond the hurt, after the hurt.

Thanks for your friendship.