I'm a super detailed writer and very wordy - if you can't get through this, I understand. If you can, please share your thoughts. Thank you all!
So here is my story –
Brief history of us: My wife is 43, I am 34. She identifies as queer, I am a transgender male. I was born female and have lived as male, very happily and stably for 10 years. I have a career as a special education teacher and my wife “the creative” is currently building her clientele doing hair and just recently certified as an independent artistic educator for a major professional color line. My upbringing was pretty privileged in Orange County, CA. Both parents still together and despite being fairly conservative, have always loved me unconditionally and supported my transition 100%. I have been very lucky in my life. My wife however, was not as fortunate. Her father left her and her brother when they were around 6 and 7 years old. His reason for leaving was the crazy mother. She was abusive, unstable, demanding, and just plain nuts. After the dad left, she consistently abused my wife and her brother both physically and emotionally. They were also sexually abused by their older half-brother. Fast forward to their adulthood and while my brother in law has had his share of relationship issues, he is in an 19 year marriage with 3 sons and doing very well for himself. My wife on the other hand, has been in multiple relationships with addicts, abusers, and unstable individuals. She has had relationships with women, cisgender men, and transgender men like myself.
So I met my wife about 6 years ago when she was still married to another guy and I had a girlfriend. We were just acquaintances at the time with mutual friends. Fast forward two years later when her marriage fell apart due to cheating on the husband’s side and I had since long ditched the girl I was dating. Christine and I were instantly drawn to each other at that time and moved very fast. Looking back, we shouldn’t have moved at even half the speed we went, but you do stupid crazy things when those butterflies happen. We got engaged 6 weeks after starting to date, I took her to Maui and proposed on the dive boat. She loves the ocean and boats. Her family joked “is the ink even dry yet?” referring to the divorce papers from her previous marriage. At this same time, her father, who had been out of most of her life and just recently came to live in town (Vegas), had a stroke at her birthday party and ended up in the hospital for about a month before finally passing away. This was a very hard time in her life and despite everything, we stuck together, even through a miscarriage during a winter vacation we took going up the California coast.
My wife is a runner. Meaning, she has a tendency to take off when things get too difficult. She throws in the towel. Either it is too intense or scary for her or she just gets impatient. Her father was very much like this, married 7 times. I can’t tell you how many times she tried to run from me in the first year when we had an argument or disagreement. Each time, I would talk her down off the ledge and things would be pretty good for a while. Then something would come up and it would happen all over again. We decided to get into counseling pretty early in this relationship because we both felt a lot of love for each other, but couldn’t seem to resolve a single issue without a horrid fight and her threatening to walk out. We ended up moving to Northern NV back in 2013 because I was tired of Vegas and she was too. We’d both been there for over a decade. Once we got here, things got pretty crappy. Our sex life was non-existent, I was very distant, etc. Not sure why when I look back, maybe because of money issues. Then, as things started to improve we decided we really wanted to move forward with adopting children and so, got involved in the local foster care system. It was a long and arduous process to get licensed as foster parents and within a couple months, we were matched with a newborn 2 month old and her 17 month old brother. I can’t even describe how amazing this time in my life was – but at the same instant, very trying for our relationship, that was already not so strong. We went from childless to having two babies in less than a week. There was no adjustment period, nothing. Just “here ya go, enjoy!”. My wife had agreed she would work part time and stay home with the kids while I taught. This way she could build her clientele as well as be with the kids. We struggled with money, but between my parents helping out and the extra money coming in for the kids, and maybe a few bucks here and there, we made ends meet.
There were multiple occasions in which my wife determined that our relationship problems were too great to attempt to solve and we should just end it. I should probably mention at this point, that I haven’t been a very good listener. It is in my nature to want to solve any problem that lands in my lap. It is my instinct to analyze and determine both a reason and a solution. So when my wife would consistently come to me with frustrations related to our relationship, I was very quick to either dismiss them as being irrational or blame something else. I think this has been the biggest source of her resentment towards me. She just wanted to be heard and despite telling me that over and over and over again, I just couldn’t figure it out. There have been other things that she had complaints about, such as feeling like I didn't help with the kids enough, etc. But in reality, I really have done the best I can and I am extremely involved with my children. I have worked hard to improve in the areas she has felt I lacked but always fell short with listening and validating her feelings because I didn't know what I was doing.
In the last year, my wife's clientele has doubled and she had expressed a desire to work more hours to get away from the kids a bit more and have a sitter. I agreed, hoping that she would feel a bit less tied down. This wasn't really the plan, but things change so I went with it. She also started a long process towards becoming an independent artistic educator for the color line she is so passionate about using. In this time, her brother and his family managed to buy a house just behind ours. It seemed like things were really coming together and it was all going to be happily ever after with my kids having their cousins next door, etc. I however, started to notice that my wife was becoming increasingly occupied by her tablet and phone. Watching YouTube videos about hair and makeup, browsing social media, etc. This would often be happening for hours while she was with the kids or me. Her brother and his wife noticed it too. Around the same time she stopped going to their house and just hanging out like she used to. She also started smoking more regularly (we both quit with vaping) and gaining weight.
Not more than a couple months ago, she was contacted by an old friend with benefits from maybe 15 yrs ago, who now lived in the area. I have never been jealous or untrusting of my wife because I had no reason. And in fact, we have opened our relationship up a couple times to play with others here and there. This woman, whose highest grade level completed was 7th, also had a daughter about my daughter's age and so this was a perfect excuse for them to hang out. I didn't have an issue at first until I noticed she was hiding her phone screen from me when I walked in the room. At that point I got suspicious and checked her phone out. I saw that she had no message history from this girl, despite chatting with her regularly. Then I see a conversation with her best friend which included “he doesn't know I'm going to ask for a separation.”
This was horribly devastating to me so I went into panic mode. I started watching our security cameras when she was hanging out with this friend and they were definitely getting frisky but, she swears nothing happened. I came home as the friend was leaving and I could barely speak I was so upset. We had a long talk after she swore nothing had happened. At that point, a lot of stuff was suddenly clarified for me. I had been emotionally disconnected in this relationship the whole time. Not on purpose and not because I didn't want to be, but because I didn't understand. I screwed up big time. I told her this. I have told everyone. I have owned it and vowed to change it. As for why, I am just gonna have to assume that an old relationship I had where the girl played games with me really screwed me up. Bad. It was extremely painful and I have been on Paxil ever since.
It was at that moment that my wife supposedly (according to her) wanted to start fresh. She owned up to some things she should not have done and told me everything was new. About a week later she brought up the whole open relationship again. She had been weaning herself off Lexapro (started after her dad died to take the edge off) and was just insanely horny all the time. I agreed but somewhat apprehensively. Probably a bad idea, but everything seemed so good. She found a cisgender guy to be a friend with benefits and seemed quite pleased with him. Actually ended up staying later at his house than I had suspected and gave me quite a scare the first night as I didn’t know where she was and she didn’t call. A couple mornings later I was browsing her texts (we allow this when we are open to keep transparency) and found out that she had not used protection when she slept with him. That is very much AGAINST our rules. She apologized profusely and said it wouldn’t ever happen again. I was upset and angry and felt disrespected and betrayed. But I got over it.
Now we are up to about two weeks ago when my wife left for Los Angeles for her final phase of educator training. She was gone for 5 days and got to meet up with a couple friends while there. I didn’t bother her much because I knew it was a stressful thing for her and she was busy practicing and studying, etc. I also had my two toddlers on my own for the 5 days as well. When we went to get her from the rental car place I could sense she was a little off. I can’t place the feeling, I just sensed “off”. I thought it would be nice to go out to dinner and celebrate. We got there and immediately she started worrying about money to pay for dinner. I assured her that we had money and I wouldn’t take us to dinner without being able to pay for it (we have been living paycheck to paycheck racking up debt lately because of numerous issues). I then told her that she should try enjoying being back with her family instead of getting on her phone to check the account. She immediately bit back at me super angry. The rest of the dinner was tense and cross words went back and forth periodically. I did call her a “giant ball of bitch”, which I should not have, but trust me, she has called me plenty of names over the years and we just get over it. We both get heated easily and say mean things and then apologize. So the next morning from work I apologized and said I was glad she was home. Her response was basically “I can’t do this anymore, I want to separate.” At that point I told her the relationship was closed and we would talk later. No more sex with others until this gets figured out.
She said she wanted to move into the back room and then out of the house ASAP. Naturally this has been devastating for me and I have been all over the place with my emotions and interactions with her. I’ve gone from angry to wanting to talk calmly, to balling like a baby, back to angry, to indifferent, to angry, to sad and hurt, to indifferent. It is nuts.
The morning she told me that, she started looking for places to go. She ended up on the phone with the daughter of one of my good teacher friends (now family friend) who stupidly mentioned that her mother said that I said “christine isn’t interested in the kids and on her phone all the time”. Well I didn’t say it even close to that, I just expressed concern. But it got twisted and fueled the fire. That night she left me at home with the kids and stayed “with a friend”. Turns out, it was the friend with benefits and she did sleep with him. She was gone all night, had her phone turned off (Find my iPhone tracks the location) so I couldn’t call, text, or track her. I need to say now that I have NEVER tracked her before the night she didn’t call and was out with that guy the first time. She came home at 630am so I could go to work. A few words were had and I left. At this point I was pretty certain that she had gone to this guys house. We met for emergency couples therapy that I had arranged for 10am that day - nothing much came of that except her confirming that she was about a half inch from wanting a divorce. The following night, she left and was out until 1am. I woke up to her at 530am letting the dogs out and confronted her about cheating. She denied and left the room. 10 minutes later she comes to my bedroom and confesses everything, sobbing, saying she’s f***ed up, saying she is easily influenced, scared to death to lose me, telling me she was texting this guy and talking to him on the phone the whole time she was in LA and how she loved the attention and it made her feel wanted.
So that was Thursday last week. Friday she “went to an event” for which she got dressed up much nicer than usual. When she came home, I asked if she wanted to talk. She said yes and so we talked. She told me so many things so out of the blue I was shocked. She wants a 2nd relationship that is a dom/sub and how the event she went to was a meetup for a fetish group (just social, no sex) and that all of a sudden, for the first time in her life, she was turned on by the idea of a cisgender man being dominant with her and taking charge, and she was loving the sex. Then she tells me I’m a lazy lover (AS IS SHE!!!) and that she doesn’t feel the same for me anymore and is confused about so many things. The next morning I confirmed that I thought she should move out (since that is what she said she wanted anyway).
Every day has brought a new round of emotions for me. Yesterday I consulted with an attorney regarding a legal separation agreement. I then went home and talked to my wife and we came to agree on some terms. 70/30 in favor of me with the kids. Their cousins and aunt and uncle live 200 yds away and this house that I bought is their home. They need to have a “home”, not bounce back and forth between mommy and daddy constantly. So they will get 2 days/nights with mom and the rest with me. I will take on all of the debt we have accrued during the marriage, keep the $1300/month stipend (from adoption) to cover child care and other kid expenses, she will not owe child support, and we are going to wait on equity from the house until there is a definite decision after some time apart. I don’t believe there is much equity since I bought the home last April. Should the equity be more than her share of the debt, well then she will get a little out of it. However, that home was bought with a $36,000 GIFT down payment from my parents. We live in a 50/50 state, so not sure if that means anything in my favor or not.
She cried a few times during the conversation last night, mostly reacting to not seeing the kids all the time and not having money to live on. It is hard to feel sorry for her right now considering she has put herself and all of us in this position and refuses to try and find another solution besides what is happening now.
I am absolutely 100% convinced at A) she is in perimenopause and B) she weaned off her meds way too fast and it has coupled with hormonal imbalances and past trauma to create this giant sh*tstorm of hell. Additionally I should say that there has been NO ABUSE, NO ADDICTION, AND NO CHEATING on my end. I also spent the majority of my summer with the kids while she worked (I’m a teacher) and was like super dad the whole time...she even said it as well as others. I have done everything she has asked of me in regards to helping with house duties, kid supervision, etc. My one true and only fault here is not knowing how to listen and connect. And even in spite of that, I figured it out and am willing to make that change to save this marriage and our family.
That was very long and I doubt anyone bothered to read all the way through - but if for some reason you did, I would love to hear thoughts, support, anything. I am pretty devastated right now and could use outside perspectives.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
I was upset and angry and felt disrespected and betrayed. But I got over it.
You "got over it"? How would you two communicate about these kinds of hurts and disagreements? Or were they just swept aside with no real resolution?
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
I did call her a “giant ball of bitch”, which I should not have, but trust me, she has called me plenty of names over the years and we just get over it.
Heres that phrase again...
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
We both get heated easily and say mean things and then apologize.
My one true and only fault here is not knowing how to listen and connect.
I think it might be a good idea to spend some time in the mirror to really consider this. What would SHE say are your biggest faults (whether you agree with them or not)?
That was very long and I doubt anyone bothered to read all the way through - but if for some reason you did, I would love to hear thoughts, support, anything. I am pretty devastated right now and could use outside perspectives. [/quote]
Ok so I order both DB and DR - Monday arrival. Wife is moving out within a couple weeks. Plan is at least 6 months.
My one true and only fault here is not knowing how to listen and connect.
I think it might be a good idea to spend some time in the mirror to really consider this. What would SHE say are your biggest faults (whether you agree with them or not)?
Originally Posted By: darknes
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
I was upset and angry and felt disrespected and betrayed. But I got over it.
You "got over it"? How would you two communicate about these kinds of hurts and disagreements? Or were they just swept aside with no real resolution?
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
I did call her a “giant ball of bitch”, which I should not have, but trust me, she has called me plenty of names over the years and we just get over it.
Heres that phrase again...
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
We both get heated easily and say mean things and then apologize.
My one true and only fault here is not knowing how to listen and connect.
I think it might be a good idea to spend some time in the mirror to really consider this. What would SHE say are your biggest faults (whether you agree with them or not)?
[/quote]
Honestly, I have thought long and hard on this one. I have to be honest, I have never felt respected in this relationship. My wife has always been a "if you don't like it, then F*** you, I'm gonna do what I want" kind of person. Her brother pretty much confirms that. Hence, when I have asked for small things like trying to be a little tidier and turn off lights to save energy, or put my stuff back where it goes when she uses it: I have been accused of nitpicking and being controlling from day one. There really has never been a receptive response to it throughout these 4 years. I feel like I have resented her for it the whole time and allowed it to irritate me to the point where I am irritated all the time and feel like she has no consideration for me or my stuff or our shared living space.
You have to understand that you can't control her or control her thoughts. Mind reading and trying to analyze why she's doing things isn't going to do any good. Keep the emphasis on you.
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
My one true and only fault here is not knowing how to listen and connect.
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
I have been accused of nitpicking and being controlling from day one.
OK. So how can you 180 some of these behaviors?
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
I feel like I have resented her for it the whole time
And how about this? How can you change this about yourself? You are making a choice to be resentful. What other ways could you handle this better in the future?
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
allowed it to irritate me to the point where I am irritated all the time
This doesnt sound like you "got over it", huh? Are there better outlets for these kinds of feelings?
Honestly, theres not much you can do with regards to your W and these things right NOW. However, I would recommend looking at some of these behaviors and seeing if they are how you want to choose to live your life going forward. How can you be a better SadDad?
My one true and only fault here is not knowing how to listen and connect.
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
I have been accused of nitpicking and being controlling from day one.
OK. So how can you 180 some of these behaviors?
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
I feel like I have resented her for it the whole time
And how about this? How can you change this about yourself? You are making a choice to be resentful. What other ways could you handle this better in the future?
Originally Posted By: SadDad8
allowed it to irritate me to the point where I am irritated all the time
This doesnt sound like you "got over it", huh? Are there better outlets for these kinds of feelings?
Honestly, theres not much you can do with regards to your W and these things right NOW. However, I would recommend looking at some of these behaviors and seeing if they are how you want to choose to live your life going forward. How can you be a better SadDad?
Some things I have read recently have made me think about how our relationship was saturated by a vicious cycle of disrespect and/or inconsiderateness (I guess that is a word!). At one point, early in the relationship, I suppose I did nitpick a lot. She is a slob and while I'm no neat freak, I do like to be able to walk into the kitchen and cook something without having to clean it first, or maybe have a place to sit and watch TV without 8 million toys, papers, articles of clothing jamming me in the a**.
Having said that, she rebelled tremendously when I expressed my frustrations. I have learned to let a lot of things go in that area, but still, I have requested very reasonably, that the common areas like the kitchen and living room be somewhat picked up so others can enjoy it. Apparently that makes me a control freak.
I truly believe that her past relationships and abusive controlling mother have affected her entire perception of this type of thing.
Yes I need to change how I react to this kind of stuff. That is on me. However, it is very difficult to maintain appreciation and respect for someone that doesn't give it back to you. And that is how I have felt this whole time.
I do not know how to change this. I do not know how to better handle it. I have tried many different approaches, but I cannot deny my feelings. Maybe this is where CBT would be helpful? (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy)
