And now we wait

[AndrewP]

darnkes - As always you are right on the ball on this.

It's like you believe if you are a good boy long enough, that eventually, your W will pick you. Even the title of this thread suggests that! I may be reading things wrong, but thats how it comes across the page to me. I want so badly for you to go out and be able to take some focus off of all of this, as all you are doing is hurting yourself. You are in a cheeseless wing of the maze. Why do you want to keep running around coming up empty handed?

Hanging my head in shame at the moment - there were a number of other things that I did on my week off - I just didn't bother to mention them much - and yes - they were pretty "pathetic" GAL by many people's standards (sorry Rose - no hard feelings - the word fits here).

I feel "stuck" - in the mud, in the flames that I am standing in because of my WW. I'm trying the GAL thing and yes could be doing better but what remains is that to the outside world and the story I feel obliged to go along with I am a married man whose wife is having problems with him. This is a bit easier now that WW has moved out of the house and I don't have to pretend to be part of a happy couple but I still do have to pretend to the community to be a loving and devoted H. And the truth is - I am - otherwise ForGump's suggestion (and that of many people around me) would be more attractive but still a bad idea. To WW she knows that I'm cutting her out of my life one piece at a time.

The pain and burden of this to someone like me who so values honesty and truth makes the flames burn higher and the only way I can see to put them out would be to blow them out with the winds of truth or to walk away from the mud which to me means pushing for a legal S and not giving WW space and time. "Not thinking about it" I worry could only be done through the lens of a bottle of scotch or in another woman's arms and I'm not going that way. Every day when I return home and see the (decreasing) reminders of W around the house or turn and she's not there brings it all back to me. I tried staying somewhere else but that was even worse. Looking back, the 4 months I've been here DBing or the 6 months since BD1 are just a blink of an eye to a man who has spent more than half his life devoted to making one woman happy. It's going to take time.

I'm spending my time in the cheeseless wing of the maze because I'm not clear in my own mind what sort of cheese I want perhaps. Honestly the main cheese I want is W flavoured. By wandering around this wing where W is not - as my post is titled - I am waiting for her to come to me and not chasing down any of the tunnels she is in trying to follow the DB model. While I wander I try to find the tunnels that have some GAL cheese. In a perfect world I would have both. What WW sees from outside is not the pain and agony of what the reality is but (I presume) a man who is GAL and reconnecting with his friends and the community and incidentally packing up her things. I'm not sure how she'll take today's outburst - we could mind-read here and be wrong and suggest that she would have seen it as me giving up on her coming back. Just like the study notes for a short story the analysis takes more pages than the story - something I agree I need to cut back on to make more GAL room (and actually do more work for my company - hate to think how much time I've "wasted") - but it is perhaps good therapy for me to let this out and be hit with a 2X4 rather than let it stew and boil inside.

2) What was the point of sending this message? What was your goal?

WW may still believe - at least her text implies it - that her A is still a secret. My first reaction to seeing this - and I would have seen it eventually if not directly then someone would have brought my attention to it - was to spew venom all over it. The point of sending the message was to give WW the benefit of the doubt and a chance to put her secret back under the covers and yes - me back in my mud pit. I will admit that along with the anger and betrayal I felt in having my pain be for nought there was also a huge feeling of relief that I could now be FREE. My original hope was that the post would be removed before the close to 100 people who know both of us saw it but that's like my hope for this to have all never happened.

In the end, Im really sorry if this reads like a 2x4. Thats really not my intention.

I really don't know how others here with their WW in a secret A cope with it. I suspect the answer is "badly" just like me.

Thanks again buddy.

[AndrewP]

AndrewP could reasonably assume that W was not living up to her end of the bargain

<snip>

Now, DB principles correctly applied would not have resulted in AndrewP's e-mail to W. But I can why see he wrote it. Maybe that warrants loving 2X4s, but, man, I feel like I'd want to burn her new house down, so a passive aggressive instant message doesn't seem all that terrible from where I sit.

Thanks JRuss and lt0402 - it amazes me sometimes how familiar people in our club get to be with each other's stories. Maybe it's because like a bunch of old war vets we sit around telling the same stories over and over. You know I don't know how this situation fits into "DB philosophy" - I just wanted to either put out the fire or build it higher. Sometimes I look at it from the perspective of Eisenhower who once said "In preparing for battle I have always found that plans are useless, but planning is indispensable." I am an inveterate planner as many will know but also know how useless plans are.

Thanks - and keep those 2X4s handy - you'll probably need them again.

[MoveFrwd]

to the outside world and the story I feel obliged to go along with I am a married man whose wife is having problems with him. This is a bit easier now that WW has moved out of the house and I don't have to pretend to be part of a happy couple but I still do have to pretend to the community to be a loving and devoted H.

That was my point with the GAL. It's time to make new friends that know you as 'AndrewP' and not as 'AndrewP's wife's husband'. I go to a meetup weekly where nobody there has ever met my ex. We go out, have a great time, and then go our separate ways. We talk, but not in detail about personal lives. From this group, I go on 5-10 other outings a year to meet up and do one thing or another not affiliated with the "group". Theres nothing sexual, just going out and having a nice time doing whatever.

I dont have to pretend to be anything or anyone. Im just me hanging out with my friends.

walk away from the mud

This is EXACTLY what you need to do. But what difference does a legal S agreement make at this point? Either way, you need to build your own life, your own social support structure. Frankly, I would consider beginning to distance yourself a little from your "SIL army". I am sure you are going to begin to wear thin with them if you continue to drown them in dealings with your W. As you mentioned before, one did some FB activity you disagreed with. I fear you are beginning to head down the same path with them as you did with your other friend.

"Not thinking about it" I worry could only be done through the lens of a bottle of scotch or in another woman's arms and I'm not going that way.

I wholeheartedly disagree. I didnt mention above, but in my weekly events I described, I have never consumed one drop of alcohol or touched another person. But for 6 hours a week or however long each gathering is, I can immerse my mind into bowling or a concert or a game of pool or whatever. By thinking about other things, I trained my brain to think about other things.

I will admit that along with the anger and betrayal I felt in having my pain be for nought there was also a huge feeling of relief that I could now be FREE.

You could be free to what? Share all around town what a sadluck guy you are that your W fled a loving marriage into the arms of a predatory OM? I dont see how other people knowing about an affair really changes anything. And frankly, if your village is as small as you say, and your W is openly wandering around town with OM, then likely, everyone knows already. The only thing having this out in the open does is let you talk about it to others in town....and why would you want to anyway? Whether the affair is a secret or not, I dont see how you gossiping about it helps you in any way at all.

[AndrewP]

walk away from the mud

This is EXACTLY what you need to do. But what difference does a legal S agreement make at this point?

Because I am living in WW's lie. And before you ask, I am living in that lie because to not live in that lie would be to not be true to my oath to her and would put barriers in front of my dream of her one day returning. By going for a S I would be telling W that "I give up" and "I don't want you any more" which I feel would push her away as a too big of a 2X4 whacking her and not just DBing. Yes - practically speaking we are S and yes - it's not a well kept secret but it also still a secret. As I've made it clear to her (and is part of DBing) - she has to decide where her future path lies - I don't decide it for her. That's what she said she has moved to to accomplish. My decision is that I still want her but that if she chooses to walk away then I will let her go (with a D boot up the @ss but that's beside the point).

And yes - I do try to keep things to a minimum with the SIL army. I was in a very hurting place when I burned out my other friend and (at her request) provided her with a journal every day which got to be far too much.

I will admit that along with the anger and betrayal I felt in having my pain be for nought there was also a huge feeling of relief that I could now be FREE.

I would be free from supporting WW's lies.
I would be free to openly pick a fresh path and walk down it with my head held high.
I would be free to purge those parts of WW that I would want gone away.
As long as I'm wandering the cheeseless tunnels then I am not free.

PS - GAL dinner planned a while ago for Friday with burned out friend on a patio so that I can listen to her problems for a change.

[JRuss]

That GAL plan sounds great, AndrewP. Keep it up! I find that momentum is huge for GAL. One thing leads to another in a virtuous circle, and you end up doing better.

[ForGump]

A few quick comments:

My point in asking you to ponder the kind of a woman you'd like is not really to encourage you to date right now. But to see if you can break out of you obsession w/ your WW as the center of your universe.

That leads me to my 2nd point: we can quibble about FB and updates and text etc., but my take is that your planet still revolves around your WW's sun. You need to escape her orbit, FB or no FB. I say this not as a coach, but as a fellow sufferer.

You still expect your WW to discuss issues w/ you in a reasonable way, and critique her for irrational/unreasonable/inconsiderate behavior. But you gotta remember: "Ignore 100% of what a WW says and 50% of what she does."

Finally ... 14 hour work day? That in and of itself needs some consideration. You cannot G.A.L. if you have so little free time and you're so tired from work.

AndrewP, I wish you courage & strength. We all suffer together. I send you good vibes.

[pinn]

Gump... I agree with darkness... That exercise is pointless at the moment (meant to post that earlier when I first read it) and counter productive to APs goals. There are plenty of other ways to break from having WW being the center of the universe.

Hang in there Andrew we have all been there. That 24 hour rule is hard but a good one! It has saved me many a time. I blocked my WW on fb a year ago and never have been back on her page. I unfollowed anyone who might post something that would bother me. My thought was that there was no way in hell I am going to torture myself over this.

[AndrewP]

Thanks ForGump.

I know that there is a lot being written about my "FB obsession" and yes it is there. However I've unfollowed her some time ago and only see things that she has been tagged in or posted herself. This totals 7 posts since she moved out July 21st. Doesn't take much of my day (other than today when I went ballistic or agonize about her being in pain (2 posts)). I don't see the usual noise or traffic. So - perhaps not quite in "orbit" around her FB but as a stray meteor that I keep half an eye on in case it decides to take out the dinosaurs. With that said - W was the centre of my universe for a long time and yes it's taking me time to start spinning around my own axis especially with being in a limbo right now about the future direction. If you think that this is tough on me - it's probably (mind reading!) at least as tough on WW and I expect we both want some closure here.

Actually I don't expect any discussion from WW much less reasonable ones. The last contact I had with her before this "explosion" was about a real one in the village (no one was hurt) and was of an FYI nature. Ignoring those I've not discussed anything with her since she moved out July 21st. This particular post was one by one of her friends who tagged her in it. This friend doesn't like me at all and I can easily imagine this friend "teasing the trolls". I looked back to what I sent WW and it was terse, to the point and then stopped. No fishing for details and only a tiny bit of "oh poor me". The slightly over-the-top and immediate reaction by WW made me (mind reading emoticon) think that she agreed that the post could be taken the wrong way. Surprising that she implied that her secret is not out among her own friends including this one - not going to mind-read / speculate about that right now. I had assumed that they all knew and were cheering her on. Some "definitely" know because that's how I found out.

Part of my GAL because I have little "group activity" time is to form that group online. I've connected / reconnected with many neighbours and people from around the world and had a number of stimulating discussions with them - yes online and not IRL which fits more flexibly into my schedule. Sadly part of that "GAL" is right here which I think in most people's minds doesn't count but it IS an important outlet for me to release a lot of what builds up inside me in a safe place. I also try a lot to "pay it forward" here and will go visiting to other people's threads just like you do to lend encouragement so it's not all about my drama - more like community service. If WW ever comes back my dream would be to oblige her to become sandi3 but can't see that happening even if miracles do happen and she does come back.

The 14 hour day counts from when I leave the house to when I get home. I spend about 5 hours a day commuting. I work from home 1 day / week (Wednesdays) to catch up on sleep and historically spend more time with W. And yes - I've been trying to change that for about 3 years. I've been with this company for 13. I'm hoping to hear about a new higher paying much closer job in the next few days. I had been searching for a new job for some time ramping it up last summer which I think is part of W's problem. She hated the idea of me giving up a good paying job for something as mundane as GAL especially since it added risk. I was very close to a lower paying but more rewarding job when BD2 hit and I chose family and fixing my MR over work.

[ForGump]

AP-- I think truly detaching means we have to unhitch our daily emotional awareness and cycle from our WW's. That's kind of a corny, philosophical point, not concrete, but I'm starting to think that kind of thinking would be helpful for me. You might call it a "top-down" approach rather than "bottom-up". Start w/ high level concepts, and work your way down into the details. I need to get to a place where my brain does not revolve around her, both positively and negatively....

[dream]

There's so much I want to say... I don't know where to start! I'll try to keep it short.

"IS" she still thinking and trying to make up her mind?

Look at her actions: She moved out. You saw OM at her place. You saw her leaving her place with OM... she's clearly not hiding from him.

You asked us not to respond to your super long rambling post, so I'll leave that be.

This morning WW had received only 4 response comments to her call, 3 of which were from people who know she's moved out. One was her boss who just said "take care". The other two responses made me go "er?" because in my "trying to make sense of things" world - they didn't make sense. I suppose it depends on the narrative that she's been feeding them. The responses were for her to "be patient - things will work out". They believe they are waiting for something to happen to/for WW? Maybe they think the ball is in my lap? I'm pretty sure that one of them does not know directly about OM. I was tempted (but didn't) reach out to them to ask WTF? The last response was of strong support and love from a very sweet and very religious lady that has been a great friend to WW for many years who has no clue as to any problems. Probably made WW twitch a bit.

WW dutifully pressed "like" on each of the responses EXCEPT the one from her boss which again was just weird.

Maybe this post had nothing to do with your relationship.
-Boss said to take care and WW didn't "like" her post. Perhaps WW has applied for a new job?
-"be patient things will work out"... again, maybe she's waiting for a response on something not related to you. a job offer. a house offer.
-It's possible that these people know more than you think. WW could post something on FB and block certain people (you, your supporters, etc) from seeing it.

You can set yourself free at any time. You're choosing to wait around while your wife explores a new romance. No one said you had to sit around in the mud. In fact, we've all encouraged you to continue living your life and better yourself. Do you think your wife will want to come back to you if you've changed nothing about yourself? She obviously wasn't happy in your relationship... because if she was, she wouldn't have fallen in love with another man. It's not your fault that she cheated, but we all have things we can work on to improve ourselves. I know you've cut back on drinking. What else have you done for you? Any ideas what went wrong in the marriage?

I really don't know how others here with their WW in a secret A cope with it. I suspect the answer is "badly" just like me.

They find people who don't know their WW and spend time with them. This is why doing activities with new people is super important!! With new activities to focus on, people don't have as much time to mind-read about with their wayward spouse is doing/thinking.

How far away is the nearest town/village with people that you don't know? Perhaps you could explore new friendships there.