This Buttercup knows that the Dread Pirate Roberts "killed my love."
The young man I married "Wesley" was so awesome. Everyone thought so. Now that same "everyone" is in shock at his actions.
I don't know what it was about this week. My guess is that it was 2 years ago that I discovered the emotional affair. Now it is obvious he was unhappy with turning 49, and chose to seek validation from adoring co-workers.
When I discovered it, he did not want a divorce; he wanted to work on the marriage But He Didn't. I see now he was so conflicted with his new path: He has been unhappy for years and kept hoping it would get better. The young suitor inside remembers the love and attraction and he "gives it a try." He gives it a try for years, all the while being discontent.
He disconnects and falls out of love. He perhaps is depressed: no desire to change, no desire to fight, no desire to examine his feelings. Retreat and discover that others make him feel pretty good. In comparison, he can't see what he has. He has a damn great wife, awesome daughter, amazing family, successful job, dream home, fabulous vacations..... and this old man looking back in the mirror, and this old man seeing an older woman replacing the Bride Buttercup.
Dissatisfaction grows and now here he is, out of love, in the fog of ow, moving out to minimize any responsibilities, telling himself that by providing financially is making sure the LBS is "taken care of."
I've dropped the rope. I am letting him go. I was able to get catharsis with an intense interaction yesterday and I realized: I'm right in the middle of this situation, in limbo, and I will not stay on his road. I'm on my own. And surprisingly, I am discovering I am having some compassion for the place he finds himself. It doesn't make me hurt any less, it doesn't make me want to divorce, it makes me see his hurting and wonder if he will ever realize that we have something worth keeping. He may never realize this. But I realize that. I've done everything I can to hold this M together. I am strong and true to my values. I can hold my head up and present the best example of an independent woman to my daughter. And hopefully, I'll be able to sleep at night soon.
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support)
I have read a good deal of books on the subject and can give you some suggestions when you are ready.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
I will give you a bunch of homework assignments to read. This POST is under reconstruction and we will be working on this as time goes by, this is the most current version.
Now you have all the tools to read. Let us know how your doing and if you have any questions.
I suggest that you read the entire thread in the resources. You can also pick out some people and read their whole story.
Depression is the key to the whole thing and it is always present!
Believe none of what he/she says and 50% of what he/she does.
I would not ask him/her anything unless you can have no expectations. Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure. You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H/W as controlling or pressure.
Lets not worry about him/her. Lets work on you! Start your homework assignments. Something to DO while you are on moderation. GAL. Eat, sleep, exercise and take a deep breath. In general take care of your self first. Detach the single most important thing to DO.
Your H/W has given you a gift THE GIFT OF TIME use it wisely
Oh, buttercup. Besides the fact that you are referencing a favorite movie of my family's, you have written exactly my situation.
I too have dropped the rope. My H had been having an EA with a married woman from his office and everyone (office, her H, their-formally our-friends)just seems ok with it. Now that we are separated and H has filed for D, he acts as "Uncle H" to her family and they include him in activities. I am hardly on the radar.
H is acting like he is such a nice guy, so concerned with taking care of me, but its more like a way to appear like a nice guy while getting what he wants. Nice would have been communicating how he felt in such a way that we weren't in this situation. Not letting someone else into our R and triangulating. I played my part in our problems, but I have been making an effort at changing myself. He just gave up on the M.
Anyway, this
I've dropped the rope. I am letting him go. I was able to get catharsis with an intense interaction yesterday and I realized: I'm right in the middle of this situation, in limbo, and I will not stay on his road. I'm on my own. And surprisingly, I am discovering I am having some compassion for the place he finds himself. It doesn't make me hurt any less, it doesn't make me want to divorce, it makes me see his hurting and wonder if he will ever realize that we have something worth keeping. He may never realize this. But I realize that. I've done everything I can to hold this M together. I am strong and true to my values. I can hold my head up and present the best example of an independent woman to my daughter. And hopefully, I'll be able to sleep at night soon. wink
is true for me as well. I'm with you on this journey. Love your words of strength.
M-51 H-54 2D-27 and 25 M-26 yrs Bombshell and IHS 7-29-15 He moved out 10-3-15 D filed 1-27-16 D final 10-27-16
buttercup, Welcome to the MLC Forum! I'm sorry you decided to come over to our side of the world...but...you will find some that the posters are just as nice and helpful here as they are in the other Forums.
Dropping the rope is a very good thing and I hope that you continue to let him go. Your h needs time and space to figure things out.
Please feel free to ask questions, vent or just to chat. There is always someone around to respond to your postings.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
You sound strong and have clarity.. He may realize that what you have is worth keeping but sometimes it takes time
I just got off phone with a good friend of mine who tells me her MLCer XH keeps asking her back …she keeps blowing him off..
You never know..but the certain thing here is our willingness to let go..change and move forward in positive ways I like the fact that you have compassion for him.. hang in
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
Peace, I'm going to thank you and take the compliment of being compassionate. H has made me feel so worthless, I'm trying to appreciate "my" qualities, esp those that are all mine.
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
My daughter said that today will be a good day. Yesterday was an interesting day. Visited with in-laws. MIL in rehab and I had only visited twice with H before now. We are very similar and have had tumultuous moments. But from the beginning, she has offered up herself to me to be there for me as needed. (I don't have many role models in my family of origin.) We've been texting and she has been a good listener. We talked over an hour yesterday. Her second husband was unfaithful and she says she understands. She voiced her concerns that since her son has been lying for so long, how much does anyone, herself included, really know him. Her top concern is for her grandchild, who has pulled away from her as well as her dad.
Right now I'm lonely. She's doing homework and I'm doing laundry. And napping. I keep pointing my thoughts towards my GAL goals.
Next weekend I plan to take drill to broken bed and get rid of it. I have a presentation to give at work which I really want to kick ass at. I hate giving presentations. I talk too fast and stammer. Everyone can hear my voice shake.
Finished the book I was reading. My #1 hobby has suffered during the maelstrom. Feeling overwhelmed with being left to do it all has interrupted any cohesion of thought. Baby steps, and I know which book is next (besides the continuous DR & DB).Guess I will chance this week's grocery shopping during the game this evening.
Sending everyone uplifting thoughts for a great day.
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
I messed up. I was jumping up and down to hear that there's a concert with 2 of my favorites and I texted some friends to see if anyone could go with me. This was definitely something H and I would have done together as it was one of our common interests. Then I texted H saying this could have been us😢
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
Hi Buttercup. Welcome over, but sorry you are here. You sound like you are heading in the right direction. GAL is a great distraction during such a hard time.
Stay strong for your daughter, I am sure she is watching closely. Good luck on your presentation. Imagining people in their underwear never worked for me! But it does help to concentrate on my breathing and to know I know the answers to what I am talking about.
Me 48 H 46 S 11 M 2004 BD 8/13 H moved out 2/15 -live in the present, enjoy the beauty around and within you, explore your new future-
My next step is to share the compassion I have for her dad with my daughter. She is angry and I think that's okay. I want to also give her alternate ways of looking at the sitch. Anyone with teenagers want to share their process?
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
I have tried to be neutral with my girls. I want them to feel what they feel. I think they need to know that their emotions are valid because it shows them that I respect them and my love for them is not conditional. I tell them "people are complicated, even when you love them" - I tell them that "love and redemption come in many forms" and that I am always open to helping someone if they ask for help. Finally I tell them you can live your life without bolting the door shut on anyone. Be open, be purposeful and be honest. Let someone's actions define the relationship over the long haul and try not to judge. Of course being empathetic is not the same as creating safe boundaries. That is a whole other thread...
If your daughter can see you be strong and compassionate she'll receive the message loud and clear. I would just be wary of pushing her to make excuses for her father's behavior because this sets the stage for how she will expect to be treated by the men she dates.
It sure is a tightrope.
M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters BD: 5/14 Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW D Final 9/17
“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.” ― Maya Angelou
123Gwen, My daughter is so devastated and disgusted the only excuses she makes are to not tell him how she feels, having found that keeping quiet is less likely to provoke a defensive response from her dad. Yes, she's the acting adult here.
I agree with you about being open and honest. Truthfully, his actions are already having a (negative) effect on their relationship.
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
I found with my D now 20 then 11 that listening to her through her Dads crises and abandonment was important and it helped her through it
I tried to listen to her pain..staying neutral and validating without putting her dad down she seems very happy in her life today to me despite the fact of very little communication and relationship with her dad hang in
while not perfect, I believe strongly that one consistent loving and available parent is enough to get them through
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
Just got text from H saying Expect a petition in the next week or so. He's going out of the country. I took deep breaths and called him to say I was drawing of up paperwork too. I think he was surprised.
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
Breathe! I'm glad he is surprised. It's not as easy as he thinks it's going to be.
Please take care of yourself.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
What an evening. I met H face to face this afternoon when he was dropping daughter off. I didn't want to have him drive away without saying my piece. How he had to text me he was filing, not in person, or even by phone call. Mind you, he's been addicted to the ease of texting for years and conducted his affairs that way.
We "talked" for an hour. He doesn't say much and is defensive. He wants our daughter protected from nastiness and his bank account protected from me. Because, before he left, I checked the mail and there is the filed petition from his attorney!
Have had time to review the paperwork. He's only willing to provide me support for 14 years (age 65) until My Golden Years! He is so good at telling me what he thinks I want to hear when he is with me, and then is underhanded. The next 2 years are written down as he has wished to proceed. I get no say. I have no control. He made a veiled threat that he won't be "as generous as the courts" if I drag this through expensive lawyers.
I know not to believe what he says. Which is why I'm up at this ungodly hour. He wants to be friends. Why can't he realize we had something beautiful?
I'm tired of the lies and yet they are just beginning. I thought I saw a glimmer of possibility until I actually read his petition. His attorney seems inexperienced, but I don't know for sure. Who came up with this lovely settlement, and the decision to sell the house and split the difference, and to he!1 with me after he retires.
Even child support seems flimsy. He had promised her the world. Now she has a broken shell.
Oh, Butterc! Start researching D laws in your area. Talk to your L. Don't react too much to what's in the petition...often its the L's twist on H's ideas. You have more power than you think. Maybe mediation can help?
My H told his L he wanted it to be the nicest D she'd ever done (his explanation to me). He also said he asked for mediation because he thought it would be the two of us at a table working with the mediator. He encouraged me to call his L to ask questions, so I asked her about how mediation would go. She told me she would be in a room with H, and I would be in a separate room alone, and the mediator would go back and forth! I told her that sounds pretty lopsided,; guess I need my own L and she said yes! When I told H he was floored. That's not what he wanted. Anyway, B. Ls are by nature manipulative. She wanted me to L up. More hours for her to bill. Keep fighting for what you believe in. Keep your faith in what you know and don't be too surprised by the BS you encounter along the way.
M-51 H-54 2D-27 and 25 M-26 yrs Bombshell and IHS 7-29-15 He moved out 10-3-15 D filed 1-27-16 D final 10-27-16
Talk to an attorney about what is reasonable in your state.
In my state, the rough norm is alimony for half the number of years you were married (if alimony is appropriate). Lifelong alimony would be unlikely unless you were disabled. (Perhaps if you had never ever worked and you H had a boatload of money, but otherwise, no).
Also in my state, alimony is always subject to revisitation; that is, if HIS financial circumstances change, like he gets fired or becomes disabled, he can petition the court to reconsider his alimony obligation.
So, for instance, in my case, my ex wanted to reduce the number of years of alimony from 12 (1/2 our marriage) to 10. I agreed to it because I knew that he would be eligible for early retirement from his job in 10 years, and could probably get the alimony reduced or removed at that time - and when he DOES take the early retirement, I get a portion that is equivalent to the alimony anyway (I did negotiate this away for something else that I wanted, so I see it as a win.)
In your case, you may want to try to get the alimony continued to whatever your social security retirement age is ( probably 66 or 67 years depending on your birth year). Then at least you will have that income to replace the alimony. If you have been married for 10 years you can claim the spousal benefit based on his social security if that will be more than the benefit based on your own earnings.
If there are enough assets to make it financially feasible, you may want to consider taking a lump sum instead of alimony. I wish this had been feasible in my own divorce. My ex (who is not good with numbers and budgets and taxes, etc) has apparently been laboring under the mistaken impression, for 7 years, that he is paying 1/4 of his income to me in alimony. The real figure is 11% once all taxes are taken into account. Much of his bitterness in the past few years has apparently been about writing that check every month! And unnecessarily so, because he didn't understand the true figures. If we had been able to negotiate a lump sum in the beginning, that might have been better. Also you need life insurance on him that will pay his alimony and child support obligations if he dies.
Child support is usually by formula. Depending on your state, you may not be able to do any better than what the formula gives. You will want to write in stipulations for other things though, like funding college, paying for childcare and extracurricular activities like summer camps etc.
Keep in mind when you negotiate the tax implications of various choices too. He gets to deduct alimony from his taxes - you pay taxes on the alimony income. On the other hand, if you get a lump sum settlement at the time of divorce, there are no tax implications for either of you. Child support is not taxed.
What is best for you depends a lot on your particular situation and your earning capacity as well as your assets and your need for cash at present. If you're not good with math and taxes, find a friend or financial counselor who can help you work through various scenarios. (For the record, your lawyer may not be very helpful with this - I definitely was more savvy about taxes etc than my divorce lawyer, although he was great in other ways.)
P.S. another reason to consider a lump sum - alimony usually stops if you remarry or cohabit. I didn't think that would be an issue for me, but now I have a steady man for 3 years, and might consider having him live with me, but we have to wait another 3 years since I need the alimony money to help pay for my kids in college. If I'd gotten a lump sum my marital or relationship status would have been moot.
Just noticed that you are 50 and married for 17 years. In that case, alimony until you are 65 is quite a good deal! (Unless, as I said, you are disabled or something).
One value in having an attorney of your own, even if you mediate, is they can tell you what is a good deal or not. It may be that your H is offering something quite good right now out of guilt - if so, try to get him to sign on the dotted line ASAP as they almost always become much less generous as time goes on.
The first thing to do is breathe! It's going to be one step forward, two steps back for a while. You'll need to take a good, hard look at your bills and what's coming in money wise and then determine if you need to reduce some of the bills (especially if they are for things that your h subscribed to).
Spring is around the corner and when you are feeling a little bit better, you might want to spring clean, paint walls, move the furniture around and make the home yours. If you determine that you have to or need to move, spring is a good time to start looking for a new place to make as your own.
Make lists of things that need to be done and check them off as you go along. There is no set time to do all of them. Rome wasn't built in a day and it's going to take a while to figure things out. Be kind to yourself because you are going to have ups and downs for a while until you are back on level footing.
Come here to vent, ask questions or just to blog. Many of us have been through what you are going thru and have come out the other side and then there are others in various stages of walking the path and trying to figure things out...but there is always someone around who will listen and provide some advice, suggestions or just validate you and what you are dealing with.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
We just don't know the future, do we? Did we know they were going to be leaving? They fell in love enough to marry us and stay, then their feelings changed enough to leave. Do we know that they won't change again? We don't. We also have no control over anything they do or think. But we can learn to control ourselves. We can learn to change that which we find needs to be changed to make our own lives better, within ourselves.
It certainly won't be easy. Especially at our ages and with what we thought our future was going to be like changing so drastically and in such a short time. I have to make all new friends (getting there), look for a new (much smaller) place to live, sell or donate half of my "stuff" or more, get it moved,deal with new stress induced anxiety, depression, and pain and go back to school for gosh knows what, find a new job...and do it all without my best friend, support system, and stress relieving lover! I'm sure you're right there with me! But...it can be done!
Through all of this, I still want H back. So, redoubling DB efforts. Strong, patient, so very,very kind. Buttercup, we are so similar in our situations. Let's try to trust this process...we will be better for it either way.
M-51 H-54 2D-27 and 25 M-26 yrs Bombshell and IHS 7-29-15 He moved out 10-3-15 D filed 1-27-16 D final 10-27-16
AAAAHHHH I just accidentally deleted my post before I could post it!
Hi cil, I am doing all right. All week I think about coming on the boards, but as a stay-at-home mom turned full-time employee, my weekends are reserved for me, my daughter, and laundry. Still waking up almost every night and really feeling the strain of fatigue during the week. Silver lining: my office is being straightened up in the process of making my financial affidavit.
mut, thanks for the peace-sending. Right back at ya!
job, I read and reread your post all the time. It is something I can strive towards. I continue to make baby steps.
I decided to go off social media (not these forums) because it is hindering my progress. I had sent a nasty private FB message to the OW, who managed to screenshot it, send to my STBX, who then reprimanded me because he was "disappointed." I told him the truth, which was that it was never meant to be seen, that I deleted it soon after I sent it, that I posted an apology which she didn't get because she had blocked me by that point. Then I got defensive: I'm disappointed by his destruction of a life, a marriage, a family. I didn't write that but I did cancel my FB account. He had fired me publicly as his wife on his page. His photos did not have me in them for the past 3 years. I didn't see it. I was blind. Well, not really, I was able to see and hear him lie all those years. He had gotten a major role as a kid in a movie that made a superstar out of the actor who replaced him (must have had a better agent) because he is obviously Best Actor in leading role in Our Marriage.
nel, Thanks for stopping by. I am going to read your sitch and catch up with you.
On the very positive side of GAL. I was able to save a little girl's life last week when she had a severe allergic reaction. I have the grateful chocolate bunny sitting beside me now.
Buttercup
Me 50 H 51 M 17 T 20 D16 H EA Feb 2014 BD Sept 2015 H moved out Nov 2015 W Filed D papers Mar 2016
Kudos for saving that little girl. You were in the right place at the right time.
Please take care of yourself.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
