WAS or what (2)

[roist]

Great post from another thread.


Quote: it's amazing how someone can be so cruel. I know everyone here excuses it by blaming it on Affair Fog, but let's call it what it is. It's cruelty. She knows exactly what she's doing, and she's willfully and intentionally doing it. This is why I'm ready to file.

WRONG. Unless your spouse is a serial cheater she ended up inan affair after a long time (probably years, maybe months) of feeling like she didn't matter to you. When she asked you to do things and you didn't do it, it told her that it didn't matter to you what was important to her. After having an A myself, I can tell you that the 'affair fog' is very real. I wanted my M to work but for years my H did nothing to improve our M or to help me. I was so lonely and Idid not want a divorce and the A 'just happened'. Iknow if you haven't had one you can't believe that is true but it is. It was someone I had known for years and was friendly with and suddenly I was attracted to him. Iwent home and told my H that Ineeded to know how he felt about me and he said "I don't feel like talking about it" and left. The next time I saw OM I initiated the A because I was tired of being lonely. At no point did I want my M to end. People say "if you are going to have an affair just leave" but many people don't want their M to end, they just need to feel loved again. After years of feeling lonely and unloved you are completely wrong if you think it is going to be easy for her to just give that up when she knows what it has been like for her to be in a M with someone who has ignored what she needs the most. She isn't trying to be cruel, she is trying to figure out if she can trust the new you enough to give up her 'chance at happiness'.

Quote: Perhaps the EA/PA is the deal breaker, and if that's the case we'll all have your back on this decision. Having said that, I'm all for letting the dust settle before making a final decision, especially if you have other things going on for the next few weeks.

Maybe it is adeal breaker for you, only you know that. However, as the one who had the A, it always ticks me off that people think having an A is worse than years of treating someone indifferently, not being your best you with your spouse, failing to try, whatever it is she went through that made her think havingan A was a good choice. I am not defending her decision to have an A, I wish Icould do it over and make adifferent choice, but the person who made that decision was alonely, empty shell of the person I really am. We go into M thinking the other person will meet all of our needs. This is completely unrealistic but we don't realize it and when we feel ignored and uncared for we make stupid, hurtful choices. I was unable to even think about what it did to my H at the time, Icould only feel how happy I was to be happy again.

Quote: W and I had a slightly deep R talk today. Of course, most of it centered on everything I do wrong, with no acceptance of responsibility on her part for the A. Sigh.

My H and I went through the same thing. Iwould explain to him everything he did wrongand he felt Iwas blaming him for my A. I realize now that it would sound that way to someone but at the time Ireally just wanted him to understand WHY I did what I did. She is responsible for the choice to act on her attraction, you are responsible for doing whatever you did for so long that she thought you didn't care. (sorry, Iread your last thread but not your first..I have limited time!)

Quote: I don't understand why she is so nice to me, invites me to do things, and then at the same time is keeping om around and is so short with me when I text her about things involving D2.

She's definitely confused...I just wish I could handle it better.

See, you do know, she is very confused. She may very well want the M but be afraid to trust your changes are real. I know I was. I was infuriated that my H was suddenly doing things I had asked him to do for years now that I was finally happy again. Ithought "how dare he"!

Another thing...when we were trying to reconcile, it ticked me off that everything focused on the fact that I had an A and not on all of the years leading up to it. The A is not the problem here..remember that

_________________________

[roist]

Regarding my last journaling. I still don't know if my real motivation was to end the painful limbo or a tactic to save marriage or both. Regardless after spending the weekend with my boys (& w) I am determined to find the strength to not be the one to split the family. In other words I want to be able to look my boys in the eyes and honestly say I did everything I could to stay together. When / if we get to that point I intend that it is said that it is my W who wants this and not me. This is not a blame game or guilt trip but this is about me standing up for what I believe.

I still would appreciate any views, comments or advice.

In the meantime I am going to try refocus on me in a positive way. I have backslid when thinking about me to focusing on how hard it is, on unmet needs and on uncertainty. I need to focus more on my actions, my changes and my happiness. I'll outline more on that when I have time.

Tomorrow is W's birthday. I got some small stuff but each item us something she mentioned she likes/liked in the last six months. I don't expect any gift will change our situation but it felt good to have listened, and acted upon. This is def something I will carry through to future R. I also got the boys to do a painting for her. That was something fun to do with them and involve them in birthday.

[Zephyr]

Before i take off out of town, i Wanted to drop a quick line to let you know I'm thinking about you and hoping for some peace of mind for you.

Your struggle is not easy and you have laid out an emotional plan to keep yourself going.

The post.from earlier this week that included the text from your wife discussing the cohabitation...it has been bugging my brain all week. Did you say who the text was to. I know we are not supposed to focus on that [censored], but I am curious if she is just seeing you as a roommate and that is all right now.

How are you trying to change THAT perception or dynamic?

[roist]

Thanks Z for thinking of me and posting before you head off.

As for the text a more accurate term was cohabitation and not house sharing as I posted. I was the one who see us as glorified roommates.

I don't know how to change her perception. ..... without breaking rules and pursuing. I could go on for a long while here but would involve a lit of mind reading and focus on stuff I can't control.

I don't know if that is all I am to her. Sometimes I am sure she wants mire other times less. Hard to read.

She has stated a few times recently in different ways about doing some stuff that it is better as two. At these times she seems to want to go in the same direction at the same pace.... together. I am talking about doing and organising mostly but it starts there. Last week I said we need to do xyz and she had just a doing it literally minutes earlier. I joked that as usual she was one step ahead. I meant it as a type of cheer leading. I added that i'm catching up and she answered something like WE should be try to go together and not have one chasing/following the other .
I could mind read this negatively or positively. She could be criticising me doing my own thing without waiting for her or for nor being on same page as me. Could be she genuinely wants us to be "together". Could even be a test to see if I start pursuing. I am not going to mind read, but my feeling is this is a good sign. That being said she rarely knows what she wants to do, so planning stuff together is at times not easy. I try to plan together but won't waste a weekend waiting to decide together. I get busy, though available (mostly). When this happens she sometimes hovers in the vicinity doing odd stuff or asks if I need/want help. I am trying differentvaporoaches to working together on stuff but have not worked it out yet. Maybe it has to come from W. I also validate and agree whenever she comments about stuff like working together.

Anyway I am in a better place (today. At least for now!) I have reread my threads and I thank you Z 1 for your frequent replies and 2 for having the patience to tell me over and over the same advice. Rereading your posts that really struck me. Thanks. I hope for me that I am better listening to my W!! I think so but I am mindful all the same.

Have a good gaming week

[roist]

Sandi
Reading all your posts esp recent ones to ghost and your new we thread, I have a question about my situation, that I would like to hear from you about.
Living together. ....... albeit as roommates..... how do I regain my wife's respect ? I know there is no magic bullet etc. I see many lbs struggling with that one esp when still living together. I have not even had an official bomb drop. I have valued your previous insights and follow ad much as possible your advice of GAL, 180s and detach.

Is it advised to continue that for as long as it takes and see what happens after limboland. Your recent postings to others indicate such limbo can last years.

You often speak of a strong sign and making W realise she is losing H.. I would be interested in your (and other vets) views.
I know some vets such ad georgiabulldog advocate a tough move.

I am detaching and slowly my mindset is changing.

[Zephyr]

Years is definitely not unrealistic roiste. Whether we are together in our marriage or apart...it will take years for us to get to that place where we need to be to be truly happy.

Codependency, breaking through the fog, overcoming that WAS mindset of 'it is over', learning to trust each other once more...that will take a long time.

It sounds like you are doubting yourself. I am there sometimes, wanting to just say phuck it, maybe all of this is not worth it. I keep going back to the beginning and thinking how awesome life can be.

It is hard, it will be trying and taxing. It is going to push every limit you have, bit when you chose, you will know you've done Truely everything you could have and you can chose with a soft heart.

You are doing well!!!

[Zephyr]

Just dropping by to say hi.

I walked into each of my son's bedrooms today to give them a kiss before I went to work. They were sleeping soundly, but I did it anyway. I often do this as a reminder to myself of what those souls mean to me. I do it to draw strength to keep up standing.

Sometimes I need more, so I steel a hug from them.:)

We have to keep up hope for ourselves and remind us what is truly important in our lives!!!

I hope you are well today.

[roist]

Z and anyone else reading, I'm doing OK.

My recent journaling is not a sign of desperation but just asking if anyone has another view of it

I'll be on holidays from middle of next week and looking forward to that. Will be fun. Won't be on here at all, but I'll catch up in September.

Things have been OK or even good with w in relation to interactions etc.

This week we hadn't the kids. I am busy at work so she came with me. So for the last few days it has been almost 24/7 together alone. There were no bad moments and quiet a few good ones. One day was so good that a few Yeats ago we would have ML after it.

Communication has been good too with a definite shift in her . Instead of saying I would like to visit X city some day, it is we should. Doing stuff in the future together is mentioned more. Interactions have been better and she openly talks about more stuff and I get more validating chances.

All this is positive.

Without being a moaner, I guess all the signs means he is staying and things are not so bad. Time will tell if we are rebuilding a foundation or not. For a while now I have felt she is nit going anywhere, but will she be really here is more important. I can put in years to get to where I want us to be but years of limbo idk.

My little moan aside I am doing OK.

[Zephyr]

I'll be on holidays from middle of next week and looking forward to that. Will be fun. Won't be on here at all, but I'll catch up in September.

How awesome. Hope your travels go smoothly!!!

This week we hadn't the kids. I am busy at work so she came with me. So for the last few days it has been almost 24/7 together alone. There were no bad moments and quiet a few good ones. One day was so good that a few Yeats ago we would have ML after it.

I'm glad the day went well for you...it does help to have stress free time without the kids sometimes

Communication has been good too with a definite shift in her . Instead of saying I would like to visit X city some day, it is we should. Doing stuff in the future together is mentioned more. Interactions have been better and she openly talks about more stuff and I get more validating chances.

Yes...yes...yes, she absolutely needs to know she is being heard and understood and what she says you actually give a [censored] about. This is awesome stuff here...and a big part of the start of a reconnection. I could be wrong, shocking I know, but that connection is absolutely positively something that has been missing in your marriage for a while now. Mine too, so this is absolutely necessar step. Hell I like coming home a men listening to wife go on about her day. There were years when I would avoid it like the plague because it was a reminder that 'any dissapointment she shows is a reflection of how poor of a job if provider I am doing'

Stupid, right. Sigh.

All this is positive.

Without being a moaner, I guess all the signs means he is staying and things are not so bad. Time will tell if we are rebuilding a foundation or not. For a while now I have felt she is nit going anywhere, but will she be really here is more important. I can put in years to get to where I want us to be but years of limbo idk.

My little moan aside I am doing OK.

Moan and groan all day. We all feel your pain in this. It is ok to feel that pain as long as we don't let it control our actions. You are doing very well!

Have a great trip.

As for more traffic on ur thread, I know it helps to post on others threads, even if it is just to say hi or good job or whatever.

[Zephyr]

Be safe on your holiday!!!