15 seconds. That's about how long it lasted. It started with this momentary flashback to how I felt at BD, like "OMG, my M is dead!" And then I was like "oh yeah, I already knew that, lol." And within the next minute I was totally fine.)
Thats great Zues. I have not yet had to deal with the duck or any other OW he's been dating since H realized the duck wasn't perfect after all. I don't look forward to it. And I hope I can move past it as quickly as you.
I just experienced a small flashback myself imagining that being said by my own D4. Something to prepare myself for in the future I guess. Its good that feeling only lasted a short time for you Zues.
Accept what is, let go of what was, and have faith in what will be
I've probably learned more about myself from your threads on here Zues than anyone else. You're a huge inspiration and were my inspiration to read Sexual Control which broke me of my thoughts on my own addictions that they were completely "cured" since I had 90 days of sobriety.
Congrats on all of your self exploration and sobriety from porn. I've been talking to a good friend from home today who told me not to worry about my own substance use (abuse) in my M since it was only due to "my W's lack of intimacy and affection for me."
I had to argue on her behalf that whether she had intimacy issues of her own or not, I was the one that chose to drink and smoke my negative feelings about them away, instead of talking to her like an adult...or addressing them at all. And then turn to porn to deal with the feelings of upset afterwards.
Maybe somewhere in the middle lies the truth with addictions that surface during marriages. Would they have come up with a different partner that didn't trigger the underlying issue below the addiction? Maybe, maybe not.
Would you have not needed to use porn with a woman that was naturally different than your W and allowed you to express your sexuality in a manner that was more conducive to who you are by nature? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe your porn use wasn't about sex at all, but about self esteem, or abandonment. NMMNG talks about virtually all "nice guys" having a sexual compulsion.
There are a lot of variance in sexual taste and I don't think it's fair to label yourself one way or another (bad or good) just because your taste may be on a more non conventional end of the spectrum. Granted, staying away from porn may drastically change your tastes, but it also may not. I know lots of men and women that both are into less conventional sexual exploration and don't look at porn.
One of the challenges of predicting future behavior based upon past behavior in a M, I believe, is that in the new R, you're with an entirely different human being. One that may completely put you at ease in ways that you were triggered beyond belief in your old M. Maybe the next woman though will trigger something completely different.
I agree that the best way to make sure that an addiction doesn't resurface is to address it, to address what's underneath it, and then to add in a management step like a 12 step program or the one that you are using.
Abstinence is like holding your breath, you can only do it for so long. One of the benefits of a 12 step program or yours, or DB, is that it makes us address what's underneath the addiction so a porn addiction that's being abstained from doesn't just turn into a gambling addiction because of undressed abandonment issues. Then you can breathe again.
Thanks for all of your sharing, and honesty, it's really helpful to read your posts.
M 39 W 36 T5 M3 BD - 1/15 Separated - Same Day Served 9/15 D finalized 6/17
Wow, Zeus. I'm in sales too and that apology really hit home for me. That's what is is all about and I've undervalued myself too long. I'm worth a hell of a lot more than how I've allowed myself to be treated and if ww can't or won't see that and chooses to go elsewhere, that's her loss, but I won't cheapen my product to fit her selfish needs.
M-33 W-33 S-11, S-8 M-11, T-14 BD - 12/26, Divorce Filing and admits to affair (her) 4/18 I moved out 5/23
I'm just blown away by the kind comments. Thank you all for your support and goodwill as we stumble along the path.
Pigpen, you're right on. I'm getting to a point where I'm less and less anxious about who I am and what I want. It's not so exotic that I'm ashamed of it at this point, and really it's not cast in stone either. I'm more interested in communication and exploration that iron clad expectation. And if I'm with a partner that meets my basic needs I don't think I'll have any problems trying to twist things around to compensate.
But even if my needs aren't being met I will walk a different path. Pyrite- my DB coach talked to me today and we were talking about my ability to navigate my next R. She said you're not ready for a new relationship when you're ready to trust someone else- you're ready when you trust YOURSELF. When you trust yourself to be able to respond in ways you're proud of, to be the person you want to be. Well, I'm not ready to date because I'm married...but I DO trust myself.
I won't reply to all individually, but again, Sunny, Fogg, Pigpen, Ripken...it's an honor and a privilege.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
But even if my needs aren't being met I will walk a different path. Pyrite- my DB coach talked to me today and we were talking about my ability to navigate my next R. She said you're not ready for a new relationship when you're ready to trust someone else- you're ready when you trust YOURSELF. When you trust yourself to be able to respond in ways you're proud of, to be the person you want to be. Well, I'm not ready to date because I'm married...but I DO trust myself.
That is fantastic news Zeus. Your DB coach managed to put into words the feeling I get when talking to you. I am glad you trust yourself. What shone through more so to me was that you know who you are, and if you trust that person that is awesome. I am sure that the majority of people out their are not even close to being as self-aware as you are, and more than that mindful of the right direction to move with those things in which are not perfect.
This is great news. I should stop reading now and go to sleep before I get dragged down/drag myself down. Those flashbacks you mentioned - I get them too often. On good days I can deflect them. But not reliably I'm afraid.
In a sense what I affectionately refer to as DBing, is prolonging this. But, I have a friend's Ex who is the embodiment of anti-DBing. 3 years on, pregnant to another man, she is still as angry as a cut snake. I would not be surprised at all if she goes to sleep every night hating him and grinding her teeth. I am grateful for her encouragement to continue.
M: 6 T: 12 Kids: 2,4 BD: Jan 2015 S: Feb 2015 EA/PA confirmed: Feb2015/Mar2015
Py- one reason I could never look at my STBX and say "this is unforgivable, we could never come back from here"- I was upset when she walked. I felt we could work it out. Feelings could change. M is precious. Etc. How can I be disappointed with her for walking away because she believed feelings couldn't change, if once she does I get so hurt I start buying into the same thing? Yes, I get boundaries. I get not putting yourself in an abusive R. I get wanted to see signs that a new M would be different, that it wouldn't repeat. And I get not wanting to stunt your own growth clinging to someone else's behavior...but that's not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is just letting the future be the future. You get it, I just think this point of view helps. Oh- glad you're doing better!
So today was interesting. A few months ago a female colleague that I had never met but communicated with via email started getting a little personal. Started by asking me my age, then little by little asking about my family, sniffing around a bit. We weren't flirty outright, but she was definitely very engaged in our exchanges. Well, I found out she was separated with an alcoholic H that had moved out. She wasn't sure if she wanted him to move back in, and he was potentially doing a few weeks in jail. All of her friends said to move on. I told her absolutely not. She is young (27-28ish), has a kid with him, and I said she can sit tight for a year and see if he pulls his stuff together. I preached a bit of DB stuff at her and told her not to listen to friends/family, STFU and be patient. Sure enough, he is sober 2 months, has moved back in, and from what she said they are taking steps in the right direction. I pretty much ended communication at that point because there are serious boundaries in play that I was already crossing (talking to opposite sex about R). My only justification is that I stood up for her M and then backed off.
Anyway, I haven't really communicated with her since. But I'll admit it had been very flattering to have her express some interest, even if it wasn't appropriate. So today I had to meet her for the first time face to face. I was just praying she'd be unattractive. Fail. She was absolutely beautiful. Like a damn Disney princess. Now look. I am not superficial and looks haven't really mattered to me in the past. And you guys know me well enough to know that I'm not looking for a fancy shell. I want a partner that brings quality. But that's my point. I know all of this, and it still woke up some feelings of desire I haven't had for a while.
Now don't worry, I'm not acting on them for many reasons (she's M, I'm M, she's probably not interested now that her M is better, etc) and I never did act on them. But it was a reminder of how powerful that sense of connection can be, and how powerful that sense of attraction can be. It actually helped me feel more compassion for my WAW. Considering that she felt her M was doomed, that she'd never be happy, that she was stuck...if some guy came along and started expressing interest, waking up those feelings...I can get why she'd chase the dream.
I know enough to not do that because I know it's a mirage that will fade away and leave broken people, broken lives, and be built on a foundation of sand. But man. Powerful stuff.
So one more reason to forgive our WAS's. And also...one more reason to have hope for the future. I hope to have those feelings again someday- SOME OF THE TIME- whether it is with my STBX or with someone else. Yes, that's not what I'm chasing. I want a good partner that will go the distance. I want to plan for the worst...but I don't mind hoping for the best.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
I think it's good that you had some feelings of desire. I think it's normal. Good for you for standing for marriage! You didn't act on it and have no intention of it. BTW, isn't the beautiful thing a bonus?
"Considering that she felt her M was doomed, that she'd never be happy, that she was stuck...if some guy came along and started expressing interest, waking up those feelings...I can get why she'd chase the dream."
One thing I read early on is that affairs are based on emotion, not logic...doesn't make it right still but the cheater finds a way to justify.
You will make a great husband someday!
Me-44 (45) H- 50 (51) M-'96
S-18(20)D-15(17)D-12(14)
BD Feb 2014 (he works overseas) home Oct(sep rooms) (EAs possible Pa's unconfirmed) insists wants D through July 2015 no more talk of D since
Your DB coach managed to put into words the feeling I get when talking to you. I am glad you trust yourself. What shone through more so to me was that you know who you are, and if you trust that person that is awesome. I am sure that the majority of people out their are not even close to being as self-aware as you are, and more than that mindful of the right direction to move with those things in which are not perfect.