WAH with one foot out the door and one in.

[V2pt0]

Ugh, frustrated. Allowed H to draw me into an R conversation last night that got heated and that was totally unproductive. Just more of the same stuff that has already been said. Just lots of hurt and anger coming out on both sides. I should have STFU, but I could not stop myself. Part of it is because of having to put aside my needs and allowing resentment to build up. Anything recommendations on how to deal with aftermath of convo? Just ignore it and get back on the DB track. So worried I took huge step back last night.

The good news out of the convo is that H is seeing my changes, but not at a point to trust them yet. He even mentioned being happy sometimes to come home. The biggest hurdle is the fear he has of trusting me right now.

One if the things he did mention is that there are some days that I am not as engaged. These are days that I decided to pull back, LRT, and allow H to lead/initiate. He is seeing that as inconsistent. My response was that it was just based on my perception that he was not in mood to engage and I wanted to give him space Is there a better way I should have responded to this comment?

Please tell me having convos like this is not the end of the world. Need help on how to react/engage today to do damage control.

[Matt777]

I certainly can't say for sure, but the way I understand things is that this process is going to be continually going forward linearly. There will be steps forward and steps back. The key is what you LEARN from the interaction.

Figure out what is working and do it. Figure out what isn't working and stop doing it.

Sounds like you need to be more consistent in your techniques as it seems to be causing confusion. I think either disengage more or less to keep your actions consistent. Without consistency, it's hard to trust the actual changes.

You can do it!

[Zues126]

OK, I normally don't do verbatim pastes from email exchanges but this was from 6 months ago and I'm skeptical it will come up, nor do I truly even care at some point.

This is an email I sent after a heated conversation with my WAS. We had argued about children, money, and the divorce. I was really frustrated due to MONTHS of not speaking my mind, and her running me down with some crazy talk. When she started telling me that "me having the kids at my place overnight would be disruptive to their schedule" I remember replying that "DIVORCE was disruptive to their schedule yet she made that choice, she's not going to prevent me from spending time with my family". So yeah, pretty worked up.

What I did afterwards is send her an email with a recap of the points SHE had been trying to make. I wanted to let her know I had at least heard her, and re-frame the conversation as not such a negative.

Whether or not it was effective as damage control I don't know, but I felt better having sent it.


EMAIL

That was obviously a difficult conversation for both of us. We have never had the best communication and conflict resolution skills, this is a heck of a situation to try to work on them. Children, finances, legal process. Could it get much scarier? Although I regret allowing myself to get as emotional as I did, I do see it as a sign that things are going better that I still feel mutual goodwill has been preserved.

It couldn't have felt that I was even hearing what you said, so I want to let you know the points I remember you making:

********RECAP OF WHAT SHE WAS SAYING*******

If I left something out or misunderstood please let me know. I want to continue to do better as coparents than we did as a couple. Now that I've had a chance to paraphrase your words and look at them objectively I really agree with pretty much everything you're saying.


(PS I was able to say I agreed with everything because it was mostly vague...i.e. we should try to minimize the impact of the D on the kids...I agree with that! Doesn't mean I won't be spending my time with them, but I do agree with the idea...so I was able to paraphrase and agree with much of what she said.)

[V2pt0]

Thanks Matt and Zues,

Not as much damage control needed. I don't think. I verbally apologized this morning when he woke up and said I should not have engaged in conversation last night as it has been emotional week. That because of emotions running high that it caused me to say some stuff that was irrational and hurtful. Surprisingly, H actually engaged in conversation and asked questions and affirmed some of the stuff I said last night as valid points. We were both much softer and compassionate in our conversation today. These are some of the comments he made:

**H actually said that he has never stopped trying to work on our M and is still trying now but that it hard trying to figure out how to work through it all. H said that is why he is still here. H said he would have already left if he truly was done trying. I said this was nice to hear because I was under the impression he had all but given up.

**H basically said he wants to try and figure us out but he is afraid of trusting me and he knows I feel the same with him. I validated this and said I understand why you would be afraid to trust me with so much hurt and anger.

**He is afraid of taking risk to fully jump to reconciliation with no guarantees it will work. I validated this and said I felt the same, but that the only way forward is a bit of a gamble and leap of faith in each other.

**He also seemed to imply that he does not even know where to start to get to the other side of this but that he has an interest. I agreed that it is overwhelming and that neither of us are patient people and we need to be ok with the fact that this will take time and not happen quickly but if we worked together instead of as individuals that we could get there.

**H agreed or acknowledged that a great of what gets said by both of us is out of hurt and he knows it is hard on both of us and that we are both trying to work through the best we know how.

I know we are not supposed to be having R talks, but this is the most vulnerable and open that H and I have been in many, many years and I think we both feel good that some of what we have both been holding in is coming out. The fact that he is actually take time to reflect on our conversations and sharing his thoughts and feelings seems to be good thing. He is not as closed off as I thought.

[Sotto]

**He is afraid of taking risk to fully jump to reconciliation with no guarantees it will work. I validated this and said I felt the same, but that the only way forward is a bit of a gamble and leap of faith in each other.


The convo above sounds pretty good, but try to stick just to validation and pull back from the 'suggesting.' In the above example, I think it is best to stop at the black text. Or if you want to discuss the way forward, maybe ask the question - how do you think we can move forward?

With the orangetext, I think you may risk him not feeling heard. There was another example of this, where you're saying let's work on this together instead of as individuals.

Mostly looks like you did well with the validating, but I just thought I would point these out. It's helpful to catch yourself - Am I pushing my own agenda and wishes here? Am I truly listening to him or just trying to move things forward? Is this pressure? and so on.

Hope this is helpful, and good luck to you! T :-)

[V2pt0]

Spent the entire day with H and it was really nice and normal. First we both took the dog for an hour long walk. Then we went to in-laws for Mother's Day. Have great hour long drive down. Then spent four hours chatting. Considering what we have going on behind scenes, from the outside you would never guess it based on our interactions today.

I did have sad moment of realization that depending on the outcome of all this, I may in the future not have a relationship with his family in the future. Makes me wonder if it ever cross H's mind that he would be loosing that as well with my family. H seems to think that we will stay close friends should we D.

I also had a realization that as spouses trying to save marriages on our own how vulnerable of a position we put ourselves in. Yes, detaching is somewhat a protection from this investment. It does make me proud that I am allowing myself to be this vulnerable.

[Painter]

You should be proud! All of us who stay in a situation with high emotional uncertainty and risk with our hearts open, because we chose to honor our commitment and work on ourselves to become better people, should hold our heads up high and feel really good about ourselves!

[gan]

BW - really happy to see the progress in your situation. Your comments around vulnerability resonate with me. I worry that I walled myself off too much post BD. Keep on keeping on!

[Huddy]

Here, here Painter! Print that out and stick it in front of your eyes.

[V2pt0]

Question to vets out there. Is it possible that your S has actually started to move on to trying to reconcile with out telling you? I don't want to get my hopes up, but I think I am starting to see signs that my H wants to try and work on M.

I just had odd conversation with H over our interaction yesterday. So at the in-laws H passed around his cell phone to show photos from work. His dad got to photo of woman in park and ask who it was and get weird look on his face. I of course asked to see photos and got to the photos of this woman. They did seem seem some what questionable in the way she was posing. I probably would not have questioned it in past if there had not been A. I obviously still have lots of thoughts around A as not all questions have been answered and there is obviously trust issues.

I did let the photos affect me yesterday, but I thought I had kept it check. However H did notice and even made comment about behavior when we stopped at a store on way home, but I just came up with an excuse and let it drop. We had had casual conversation about work and other stuff when we got home. I felt like I let my questions about this person subsided. He worked on a project and then went downstairs. I stayed in my room because I figured we had a lot of together time yesterday. I really did not think much of it.

When I got home from bootcamp this morning and the first I saw him today, he said are you done being weird? I tried to Brush it off, but he pushed to have conversation and actually delayed going to work. He then brought up the photos and knew that they were the result in the change in my behavior yesterday. He then asked if I was going to always question and not trust him and who he us with. Basically, he was asking when and if I would be able to fully trust him again. I said I wanted to trust him, but that he had to understand it would take time to fully recover. I said it was the same for him and trusting that my changes and things I am saying are true. I said. Can tell you want to trust me, but can't fully right now and he agreed. Anyway, it was like he was wanting to push for convo about affair??

He also made comments that he is working on our friendship as first step but that it is hard that it is still awkward. I just agreed and said yes, but that it is going to take time for things to go back to normal because a lot has been said and transpired over the last 6-7 weeks. I also said that I am having a hard time being fully open at this stage because I don't know what is thinking and I know he is holding back. I also said it is hard to know when he wants to engage, if he wants to keep engaging, and when he needs space. I said I thought we are both holding back and have walls around each of us and he agreed. He also brought up reconciliation and how to get to that stage when we are still at awkward stage. I said it was going to take us trying to spend more time together as friends and the more we do that the more comfortable we will be again. I said I am not on a timeline right now. Anyway, there was more, but it was a very calm and constructive conversation. He is opening up more with his feelings and thoughts and pushing to talk. I assume this is a good sign? Is how I am responding ok?ni feel as though I am getting an opening here and don't want to blow it.