Introduction - least creative title

[Closer2]

She has been talking about marriage with OM since Nov. She saved the text messages in a document. Every single one she's ever sent him in emails, text, FB chats. Almost 1000 pages..crazy. They've been friends since high school so most of it was just chit chat. It looks like the EA started about the time she told me back on D-Day. D-Day was in Dec and she told me the A started in Oct. That's about the only part that was truthful.

I'm really glad I found out. I knew there was more to the A than an EA. I haven't snooped in weeks, but I've had this feeling lately that there's was more going on than I knew. My hunch radar was going off the charts.

It hurt like hell to read what I did, but it has certainly given me the strength I need to just let her go. I don't have much hope left, if any. That's not as hard to accept as I thought it would be. When I started posting here, hope was what kept me going and working on my self. I feel better mentally and physically now, than when I first discovered DB.

I like the changes I've made and I know my kids are happier around me. Even my STBX pointed out the changes I have made when we talked tonight. She said she feels attracted to me now and is feeling feelings she didn't feel two months ago. I don't think she's blowing smoke about the attraction, but she thinks I'll hang out and be plan b.

I feel less attraction and love towards her. I don't know her anymore and I don't like the person she has become.

I'm setting her free. She can go.

[Closer2]

Just posting here because I can't sleep. Rewatching Breaking Bad again. Maybe I should find a new passion like Walt did?

Do people that find texts or letters from a cheating spouse typically read all of them? Do they read just enough to know that there is cheating?

It's hard for me to read 900 pages of teenage love text messages between my wife and another guy. She was so miserable and so mean anytime they discussed me. I never talked that way about her. I was a bad husband, I know I was. I was disconnected. She would push me away and eventually I just stopped trying to be close. We had separate lives in the same house. I had no idea how to fix it and didn't even know if I wanted it fixed. If only I had picked up DR or DB before she dropped the bomb. The downward spiral was so obvious. I don't know if I'll be able to let go of the tremendous regret I feel. Why didn't I work harder to save my M? For her and for my kids.

To hear her say last night that she has started to have feeling for me again and is confused was bitter sweet. I felt great that she feel an attraction and love, but it's not enough for her to stop her affair and focus on our family.

I did tell her that if she is willing to devote 110% to our M, to build a new M, I would devote 110% with her. That it would take time and it wouldn't be easy, but I would like nothing more than to give it our best effort. I knew it wasn't a good time to say that last night, but I wanted her to know that I'm willing. I also wanted her to know that it wasn't something to be taken lightly. From reading Sandi's post about R, I knew it was too early to even consider R, but I wanted her to know I still haven't give up completely.

Today was very different than the tears from last night. The spew that came out of her today was evil. She is going to try to deny the 50/50 visitation. Something we agreed on months ago. However, I caved and let her have expanded basic visitation because I thought she was coming out of her "EA" and didn't want to make her go nuclear. The decree hasn't been signed approved by the court, so I can change it. I have a feeling that she will do mediation and well end up in court. I can't afford court, but I'll figure something out.

She wants to come over tomorrow to get some of her stuff and drop off the kids. I better try to get some sleep.

If you read this, thanks for reading me rambling vent.

[TenBook]

Just posting here because I can't sleep. Rewatching Breaking Bad again. Maybe I should find a new passion like Walt did?

Do people that find texts or letters from a cheating spouse typically read all of them? Do they read just enough to know that there is cheating?

Don't to it Closer. It'll only torment you.

It's hard for me to read 900 pages of teenage love text messages between my wife and another guy. She was so miserable and so mean anytime they discussed me. I never talked that way about her. I was a bad husband, I know I was. I was disconnected. She would push me away and eventually I just stopped trying to be close. We had separate lives in the same house. I had no idea how to fix it and didn't even know if I wanted it fixed. If only I had picked up DR or DB before she dropped the bomb. The downward spiral was so obvious. I don't know if I'll be able to let go of the tremendous regret I feel. Why didn't I work harder to save my M? For her and for my kids.

Stop blaming yourself. An A is the worst act of betrayal. You are the one working on saving your M. You didn't take the cowards way out and just had an A. You took the high road.

To hear her say last night that she has started to have feeling for me again and is confused was bitter sweet. I felt great that she feel an attraction and love, but it's not enough for her to stop her affair and focus on our family.

Those statements are their to hurt you or to make her feel better by making you feel better. We have all been victimized by these statements. Stop the lies.

I did tell her that if she is willing to devote 110% to our M, to build a new M, I would devote 110% with her. That it would take time and it wouldn't be easy, but I would like nothing more than to give it our best effort. I knew it wasn't a good time to say that last night, but I wanted her to know that I'm willing. I also wanted her to know that it wasn't something to be taken lightly. From reading Sandi's post about R, I knew it was too early to even consider R, but I wanted her to know I still haven't give up completely.

I said the same thing. And what was told to me was that you are basically giving her 100% control. When I saw the look on my W's face it was not one of hope, but one of disgust.

Today was very different than the tears from last night. The spew that came out of her today was evil. She is going to try to deny the 50/50 visitation. Something we agreed on months ago. However, I caved and let her have expanded basic visitation because I thought she was coming out of her "EA" and didn't want to make her go nuclear. The decree hasn't been signed approved by the court, so I can change it. I have a feeling that she will do mediation and well end up in court. I can't afford court, but I'll figure something out.

Don't let those ray's of hope manipulate you into losing custody!

She wants to come over tomorrow to get some of her stuff and drop off the kids. I better try to get some sleep.

If you read this, thanks for reading me rambling vent.

This is hard for you, hard for anyone. But if you know that she really is gone, you will realize all those contradictory actions and statements are only their to in the end, hurt you. I too will try to follow my own advice

[Kramer]

I'm sure that I'm in the minority here, but I read every message between wife and OM. Yes, it was extremely painful, but it allowed me to see the depth of her deceit and how far gone she is. I tend to idealize our marriage and latch onto all the good times, while forgetting about all the heinous things that she has done in this affair. I need to see how badly she was talking about me, and her disrespect and disregard, to refocus my thoughts.

Don't get me wrong, I don't do this all the time. However, it has helped when I start to have a pity party.

[Mozza]

I don't know how you guys do it. I never read anything between WW and OM and the smallest thing I know hurts me. Sure, I'm curious to see what was going on, but it seems like reading these exchanges would only keep me in the past and thinking about WW, which would be counterproductive on so many levels. My job now seems to focus on myself, the present and the future. I'm not all that good at it, but I go at length to avoid situations that make it harder.

Why didn't I work harder to save my M?

Because you didn't want to be M with her but you didn't have the courage to leave her? This is the provocative suggestion that my IC put to me early in our consultations. I resist the idea to this day, but it does give me a different take on the S, so I share it with you.

I did tell her that if she is willing to devote 110% to our M, to build a new M, I would devote 110% with her. That it would take time and it wouldn't be easy, but I would like nothing more than to give it our best effort. I knew it wasn't a good time to say that last night, but I wanted her to know that I'm willing. I also wanted her to know that it wasn't something to be taken lightly. From reading Sandi's post about R, I knew it was too early to even consider R, but I wanted her to know I still haven't give up completely.

I don't understand these "buts" where the LBS state that they know what they should avoid, yet give a reason why they did it anyway. I find them on the threads of many Nice Guys who are trying to save their M, yet they make no sense. The professions of love, the pursuing, the confirming-the-door-is-wide-open, it's all counterproductive. It makes it more likely that she'll go and less likely that she'll come back. It's in DR, NMMNG and Models. Sandi2 is at a loss to understand why LBS can't get it in their heads. She's started threads to explain it, she asked the question and answered them, she's shared her experience. Yet, so many LBH just want to tell WAW, one last time, that the door is wide open because they don't want the WAW to think that they are moving on. But that's exactly what she should think to have second thoughts. Anyway, it's all very very basic DB and it's been explained a million times around these boards. I guess I'm so puzzled by these statements because I work so hard to rein them in, even though I want to write them, say them, sing them, carve them. I do it because that's the only thing that doesn't damage my sitch further. Perhaps it's a matter of self-control? Or you just don't really believe that's how it works? Or that your sitch is different?

[Closer2]

Thanks TenBook, Kramer, and Mozza. I really do appreciate the advice and/or comments. I've never been one to talk about stuff going on in my life or emotional stuff. That was a big problem STBX had. That's changed recently and it just posting here helps tremendously.

I'm not reading the chats anymore. I know what I need to know.

Mozza, I never wanted to leave her. I didn't have the guts to ask for help. We would talk, both of us would make short lived changes, then we be back in the rut again. It was text book stuff. I keep stuff bottled up too much. I still do. I'm working hard not to keep everything inside because it explodes out eventually. Just like NMMNG states.

I don't understand the "buts" either. I feel like I have this new piece of Ikea furniture, I really want to build this and it's going to be awesome. Only, I don't I have the instructions. I've read the instructions. I have the tools. I know what parts need to be in place, but I can't get the damn thing together to save my life. Thinking of my M as cheap furniture probably isn't healthy, but my point is I ask myself why I said what I said shortly after I said it.

I have a hard time STFUing when I get rolling in conversation or a debate. I feel like I'm trying to sell her on me. Like she's a hard nosed client and I'm going to win this deal because that's what I do.

I can't do that with a R. I know I can't talk her back to me. I'm going to have to work on having the internal buzzer go off when I sense myself wanting to try to reason with her convince her. I must be better about choosing my words carefully and not letting my emotions take over when I talk with her. Self-control is a big issue in those instances. The only think I can control I myself, I need to repeat that to myself over and over.

It's hard work. This is by far the hardest thing I have had to deal with in my entire life. People that have been divorce multiple times are crazy. Maybe they're just used to it.

[Closer2]

Hello DBing board. My situation is getting out of control. I'm having a very difficult time with this divorce. STBX will not respect my boundaries. The first time she did not respect them, I asked her to leave. She did and she would return home at 7 AM to care for D4, pick up S9 from school. Then leave after I got home, sometimes she would leave after the kids went to sleep.

That was very hard on the kids. It was hard on me because of how much it upset the kids. It was also difficult for me detach when I would see her every morning and every night.

STBX became very upset after a few weeks. She asked me to let her come back to the house. She promised to she would respect my boundaries and told me she understood that I wasn't punishing her, but protecting myself. I felt relieved that she could see I needed the boundaries in order to get through this divorce.

Then last week, I found all the FB chats she has been having with OM. It was clear that she did not respect ANYTHING about me or boundaries. She lied about not having sex, not going to see him, not texting him while I was in the house. Every boundary was mocked by her.

I realized last week I have no control of this situation. She is gone and she will hurt me with no remorse. She will do what she wants to when she wants.

Yesterday realized that I can't live like this. I asked her to leave the house and if she did not leave, I would. She told me that she knows she has made terrible mistakes and she wants to refocus on the kids and the house. She wants to help me get it ready to sell. That she will not leave to go visit OM anymore until we sell the house. She said that even though she knows I'll never believe her, she really does want to stop hurt me.

I listened and validated. I told her I don't think I can trust her right now, but I do want to get the house sold. If she really did want to stop hurting me, she needs to stop lying. That's the only boundary I have now. Just stop lying. Go off with OM, call him, text, just don't lie about it.

Again, she assured me she wouldn't lie. She wanted to work together with me and try to rebuild a relationship so we could be good co-parents.

Then she says that she'll be out of town for the weekend.. WTF???? She's going to OMs to tell him all of this on Saturday and spending the day with her sister on Friday.

She calls me today to see if D4 can stay at her sisters. I ask her to put D4 on the phone so I can talk to her and tell her I love her. STBX busts into tears and tells me she is at OMs.

Wow, not even a full 24 hours. She is sick. I am just as sick for even thinking she was being honest about helping me with the house and not wanting to hurt me. If she had told me she was going to see OM on Friday it wouldn't have made it any worse than leaving on Saturday. Why did she even lie about it? I don't get it. I just don't get it.

Her mother, sister and friends help her pursue this relationship with OM. I dread that my D4 is going to learn that to be happy you just have be selfish in life. Crush those you swore to protect if it makes you happy.

The divorce is almost final. Should be stamped by a judge next week. I'm struggling with what to do. I need to go dark, fully detach. For my sanity I have no other choice.

Should I move out? She has no job and she can't make the house payments. She can get the money. She won't make the repairs needed on the house even if she has the money though.

Should I stay in the house? Change the locks? I can drop off D4 at my parents everyday and have them pick up S9 from school. I can pack her clothes and put it in the driveway for her pick up.

I know I need to detach. I know people can do it when they are in the same house. However, everyone that must live in the same house and tries detach understand the difficulty. I have tried many times throughout this situation. I understand that I have made mistakes and I have given her way to much slack. She has abused me because of that. She thinks I will give in to whatever she wants because I have shown her time and time again that I will. She doesn't understand just how completely finished I am with her. My breaking point has been reached.

[MrBond]

"Then last week, I found all the FB chats she has been having with OM. It was clear that she did not respect ANYTHING about me or boundaries. She lied about not having sex, not going to see him, not texting him while I was in the house."

And so what are your consequences going to be?

"Every boundary was mocked by her."

Actually she's not mocking them. She can't give up what she's doing.

"I realized last week I have no control of this situation."

This is true and you shouldn't control the situation. You can only control yourself.

"She is gone and she will hurt me with no remorse."

This is a notion you're going to have to stop. She's not "hurting" you. Those feelings of hurt are what you do to yourself. She is living her life the way she wants to same like you and everyone else. In fact, she's not thinking about you but herself. Doesn't mean that she's intentionally hurting you.

"She will do what she wants to when she wants."

She has a right to just as you do.

So if you say she crossed YOUR boundary, then you need to implement what YOU feel is necessary. But it's not about you.

[Closer2]

Mr. Bond, thank you for replying. Very thought provoking.

I asked her to leave the house the first time she didn't respect my boundaries.

After several discussion, crying from her, begging from the kids, I let her come back.

I don't know what to do now. I want to distance myself from her. I want to go dark. I need to go dark. I can't go dark when we live in the same house.

I want to be better about not letting her actions have an effect on me. It's hard. Wow is it hard.

She just sent me a couple of texts. The first text said, "I am having a breakdown. I can't handle anything. Take kids. whatever". Second text said "I will pay for you to live somewhere else and will forgo seeing him for 7 weeks. He already knows."

I'm not even sure what those mean or how to respond.. "Yay!" I'm not going to respond.

[MrBond]

Have her leave again. She's at that critical stage where she's thinking she might hit bottom. These are the consequences of her actions so whatever you do to protect yourself is a part of that.