hold on! - 8

[u-turn]

It is hard for me to hold my ground with this. It is not usually in my nature - I am a compromiser (if that's a thing) a giver, a your needs above my own type of person. This is opposite of what I have ever done. It does feel empowering, but makes me feel like an a-hole too.

Yesterday, she said she went to speak to her aunt about an empty condo that she could rent - I said that's good.

Today she's back to tears. She feels we are acting out of anger. She asked me if we could go see a MC to work through this and help see each other's perspectives and not act out of anger (I don't feel angry by the way). and eventually take the kids to help them cope. I said that I would consider this. I don't think it is to R at this point, but it may help us cope.

Then she asked me if I would like to plan something with her and the kids to get away for a couple days. I don't know about this and I told her that (I think she was again surprised by my reluctance). She said she is going to go. Maybe she should just go with them somewhere.

found yesterday that her license is now suspended and has a court date set for dui.

I am working today so S17 & I can go fishing tomorrow or Tuesday.

[Sotto]

U-turn, I think you know the answers to your own questions already here.

Your W sounds like she is trying to draw you back in - into a trip, into MC. And if you allow yourself to get drawn in again that way - you'll be off around the loop again.

Because your W is still foggy and still involved with OM, and still hasn't done the work and so on. FWIW, I think holding firm is the line to take here, and if your W wants to go and rent a condo - great...

[Vanilla]

U turn

I wanted to interject and I usually refrain until I have read all the threads. I have read through your last four and will read the remaining ones by Wednesday.

So bearing that in mind, I agree you should stay in your home and W move out. You are the steady parent in this sitch. The non wayward one. I had not picked up in my quick read and in my notes if you had read No More Mr Nice Guy, but I believe you should do so, it was an eye opener for me.

MC is a very poor choice whilst there is an A or compulsive activity. Effective IC yes by the bucket loads, fantastic but MC is an excuse for a WW to say "I tried everything" in the hope that MC will agree the M is over. This can be an easy way to be let off the hook. So if it were me then I would say " MC only when your A is finished". I agree with Toots another go on the merry go round with that.

Your bed WW To lie in.

If WW wants a trip away with the teenagers her choice, knowing she has no license let her deal with it. Be firm, the boys could go if WW has proper transport arranged, please let her handle it. She has a DUI that is very serious stuff and no insurance. This is other than being an ah, in fact it is the reverse of that. It is letting WW make her decisions and implementing, it is stopping 'back control' which is passive control tactic. It is upfront, honest and has integrity. The reverse of your thinking, DB is counter intuitive!

You may want to consider your teenagers safety, although perhaps the older boys drive?

You may be aware that I fostered children, teenagers mainly. Your oldest S will be most likely aware of the truth already. The others are old enough to handle their R with their mother. Whilst I agree that lies are unnecessary, then please do not "truth" out to make a point with WW. A considered attitude of "dad is unhappy about the M sitch" and "your mum is making her own choices, it is not my place to say"., would cover it.

U-turn this is tough love, and hard to implement. I am sending you peace across the miles.

V

[u-turn]

Thanks Toots
I think I have been around here for a long time and do know the answers to many of my questions - I know shes just throwing everything at me that she thinks will work. I am trying not to be affected by it. She wants everything status quo.

The thing about wanting to rent the condo - it's not that she wants to - it is me forcing it. She is saying that this is all about me now, giving me what I want. I have asked her to leave a couple times and she says she is giving that to me. I think she will not go and will try other forms of manipulation (kids, visitation, money, her legal troubles, my failures) to push this off. I think this is where the MC offer is coming from.

Her claim is she is not involved with OM, but I feel differently - her stories make no sense, she is not doing any work to prove this to me. I still feel that it is something she is hiding.

If she were to leave I would just watch her go and get on with things. As things are right now, we are still too intertwined.

[u-turn]

Thank you Vanilla for looking in on me!
I have read NMMNG. It is written about me and hard for me to change that (though I'm trying).

I am staying in my home - I have decided this. She may not leave - she is welcome to do so, but when it comes down to it I don't really think she will.

Here is my take on MC and I believe that this is different than other people have commented to me. I really don't think she wants to end our M. She is free to do so and I think she know this. She wants our M to remain as is. So I believe that this is just to appease me, to say - look everything's better now - lets continue. But with this in mind, would a MC convince her that this is not a viable way to have our marriage? It may just be a waste of time and money.

She is claiming that the A is finished. I don't believe this. Her stories do not make sense to me, she is not offering any proof, she is doing no work to convince me otherwise. She has only defended my suspicions with odd stories. (Could I be off of my rocker and so paranoid that nothing she says will be enough for me - that is a remote possibility. But if that's the case, we should just move on because maybe I will never trust her again and I don't want to live like that).

If she plans a trip - I am telling her that I do not want to go. I feel this is for her own selfishness and I would just be a driver. I think she will not go then and blame me for wrecking the kids spring break. They will survive - I will try to do things with them daily.

By the way this would only be with D15 and S17. S20 has moved on and has washed his hands of us. Maybe he has figured all of this out, but I really don't know.


Thanks for your wisdom!

[Starsky309]

Marriage counseling would be a waste of time and money.

Maybe, MAYBE I would offer to do FT (family therapy), with you, your wife, and your three children. They are all old enough, and maybe some good could come of that as you'd have the FT's assistance in dealing with some feelings about the damage that's already been done to the family. But I wouldn't do MCing.


Starsky

[Georgiabelle]

^^^^^^

Yes (save the $$$), and quite frankly, the MC wouldn't *convince* your W of anything.

Hang in there:)

[CaliGuy]

U-turn

I have followed your sitch as we arrived here about the same time. (Just looked ..SAME DAY .. lol) I don't always comment but I have kept up. I feel some parallels with your sitch and mine, like you said I agree your W does not want to end the M, she is cake eating or attempting too.

Like you I had the impression MC might have some good come out of it .... we went in May , like you my W said the A was over, like you I was not trusting ... my gut told me differently but I figured getting her into MC we could figure things out. Well ... the OM was still in the picture and the MC was nothing more than a "See I tried ... we just don't work" move. So yeah ... do not waste your time there.

If your W truly wants to save the M, she will pull out all the stops to prove to you she is committed, owning the pain she caused, wanting to start to clean up the mess she made. the NMMNG touches on some key points ... but yeah for guys like us its tough to be the 'ahole' ... however its not being that way, its being confident we no longer need to put up with this emotional abuse, we can and will survive if not flourish without them if need be.... I told my W I know where I am going and it would be great if she was a part of that .. but just the same I will be just dandy without her and I meant it .. when she started seeing it was true things began to change and continue to do so ... she tests often trust me .. but I am still forging forward, its up to them to catch up.

Do not compromise ... you know she will not respect that, hold your ground .. its tough love time .. she has had you where she wanted up till now and you acknowledge she is pulling out the stops to keep you in check .. be strong and hold firm ... I was told here .. "she is gone anyway .. nothing to lose at this point right?"

[u-turn]

Thanks Starsky & Georgiabelle - I think maybe the money for this could go to IC for me and hopefully for W.

All along or at least early in my sitch she has said that we need to work on ourselves before we can work on our marriage. This was and is true (clear statement of what DB is all about too) and pre-db I was skeptical of this concept - I just wanted it all back. But I feel that her position and my position have swapped now (she wants to fix M and not work on herself) and I have a hard time believing her "changes"

Caliguy - started on the same day - does that make us twins? Thanks for your support. I've come to realize that I am truly unhappy with the way my life with her has become and not just upset about the cheating and lying. I do not want to continue this way with her and would rather end it all with her than continue feeling like this. I feel that any compromise would just eat further at me. makes me less me (if this makes any sense at all).

As I twist: I didn't go with W & D15 last night to wherever they were going. I told her that I had plans - this is completely not what I would normally do (I also didn't really have plans except to not go with her).

She texted me later "why are you unhappy?"

Why am I unhappy? You have no idea? She's trying to get me to open up to her again - seemingly not to fight, she seems to want to help me. She keeps saying that.

I did respond "I don't like any of this but don't know how to change it - I am unhappy with all of it." (probably weak statement from me)

today she asked again to talk (text), I did respond to her:
I am unhappy with us
I am unhappy with you
I am unhappy with me

w: all things we know and need to work on.

me: I am worried that I am not going to be able to make it back from this (maybe that was cryptic and didn't make sense)

she asked if I am suicidal. (I don't know why she would get this feeling - I don't share these thoughts with her (aside from the one time))

She wants to talk tonight and perhaps journal our daily thoughts to each other and share this with each other.

I don't know what to think of this - is this more manipulation or trying to get into my mind more? or Does she really care?

Thoughts about this journal?

For a year I've been hoping for a change and for her to open up to me and share her feelings (pre-db I was the one who was sharing my feelings and asking her to do this to)(since db, I have shut down sharing my feelings and I have really gotten used to this - I am not completely comfortable opening myself up to her because I don't feel safe with her having this information).

I don't really know how to put this, but I am a little confused by this change.

[Starsky309]

U,

It's not your job to assuage her guilt, and to make her feel better about her destructive choices.

"I'll be fine" should be your only response. "Not what I would have chosen, but I'll be fine -- I realize that now."


Starsky