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Originally Posted By: claire7
People, I think I'm finally figuring it out.

Nothing I say will change his view of himself or of me. But his view of me does not need to be MY view of me... and I also don't need to feel obligated to try to *change* his view of me.

I also cannot have ANY expectations of him. And just because he can't act in ways that I want him to doesn't mean that I shouldn't act according to my values.

He lets off his frustration about how annoying and complicated co-parenting life is to me. So be it.

I can own the part of his frustration that feels appropriate. And just let it be. Let him be someone else's problem.

It's taking SO MUCH right now to curb my desire to just tell.him.off. To tell him that this is all HIS CHOICE and d@mn right it's hard and complicated.

But I"m holding it in.


Claire, this is so good.

You can tell him what you feel, but do it with the voice of the Claire you want to show to the world.

Last edited by labug; 03/23/15 02:42 PM.

Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
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I just read mozza's post to you and I agree with him.

My thoughts, you have a lot of fear.

'Well, duh?' you might think but ask yourself when you haven't felt fearful? When have you felt OK in your own skin? When have you felt good enough?

Fear often keeps up from making positive changes.

The exercise you did was pretty good. I wanted much the same "R". But I expected to have it with me putting in little work and him putting in a lot of work. smile

But when I started being honest about my R skills, I saw how crappy they were. I was doing what I'd learned to do, the same way I learned to tie my shoes or make my bed, without much thought.

Finally I figured out that in order to have the kind of partner I wanted, I had to be the kind of partner I wanted. We were S for over 3 years so we did some coparenting (older kids yes but there's still stuff to do). To have the coparenting R I wanted I had to be the coparent I expected from him.

This is true of all our Rs. We have to be what we would like others to be, honest, compassionate, strong, open.

Bravo for signing up for mindfulness training. Which class are you taking?


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,428
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claire7 Offline OP
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I wanted to articulate some of the things I have done that I am very proud of. One of my bad old habits was to be hyper - critical of myself and not see my own value. Mozza's post could have led me right back into that. So, here are some positives:

1) right after BD, I picked myself up, kept working and being a great mom.
2) I've been treating the depression and anxiety that have plagued me since childhood. I am no longer hyper - anxious about nearly everything. I cannot overestimate how huge this is. I managed to basically save my own life just when my world and future collapsed and I am very proud of that. I could have crumpled and fallen apart and I didn't. It took me a while to start DB'ing, mostly because I didn't know it existed, and partly because I was working on getting out of a major crisis and functioning. I'm not sure I had the capacity to DB at the beginning.
3) Led a week-long training last summer-- left my D for a week to do something new and challenging.
4) did a few home improvement projects, fixed some things, put new furniture together for my D (some of it single-handedly)
5) started baking again, and also have been cooking new dishes, experimenting, feeling more confident and relaxed in the kitchen.
6) have been enjoying work more and stressing about it less, even when it's not perfect.
7) reaching out to friends more--getting out to see friends (which I almost completely stopped doing after having a baby).
8) standing firm on certain boundaries... not taking the bait with H or my parents and getting into arguments.
That's a good start.


Me 38 H 40
D 3
T 8 M 6
BD 10/2013

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What's up?


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,428
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claire7 Offline OP
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Thanks for checking in, labug. I really appreciate it. Been an interesting few days. I've been really mulling over Mozza's perspective. I'm working very hard at seeing my STBX the way that Mozza describes him. I'll admit that I have been holding on to more than a bit of anger. Who cares that it's justified. It's certainly not doing me any good. So, it's time to let go. It's time to let go of the anger I have towards myself, too.

My SIL's father just passed away (a month after my FIL passed). He was a wonderful man, and my heart aches for her and her family, and especially her kids who have lost two granddads in as many months. Moments like this bring up painful reminders that I am no longer part of their family. I'm going to a viewing, and it will be very lonely for me. My MIL and her family will be there. I will really have no one that I can be open and vulnerable with. That makes me sad.

I'll have a car ride with STBX and our D Friday night, which will give me a chance to test out my new dropped-rope attitude, under quite awkward circumstances. I don't know how to make small talk with him. So, my goal is to not be so nervous and self-conscious. To just be ME-- a caring, kind, intelligent, beautiful person.

I'm not sure what my future holds. I hate being a single mom. I hate being alone. I miss being held. But I'm going to be great. I set some specific goals for myself (starting with getting to bed earlier, and meditating). I am looking forward to what's next for me.


Me 38 H 40
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T 8 M 6
BD 10/2013

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A suggestion, stop focusing on what you "hate" about your situation and focus on what's good in your life.

What we focus on expands. I used to think that was mumbo-jumbo but it's true. It's so much easier for the mind to ruminate on the negative. WE have to work to go move to the positive.

In the SIL situation instead of going from her loss and how that affects you, stay with your thoughts of her and what you can do for her.

You're a baker, bake a cake. (I'm from the sorta-south, that's what we do when people die, make food.) Even if it's not the custom where you live, I bet her kids would enjoy it.

Do you have a close friend with whom you can be yourself?


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
Joined: Nov 2011
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*"instead of going from her loss and how that affects you" should read from her loss to how that affects you.


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
Joined: Apr 2003
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Hey Claire,

I wish there was a way to "like" Bug's post. Like her, when I started this journey, I thought it was mumbo jumbo to focus on the positives. At the time, I felt it was a version of sticking my head in the sand because there *were* things to worry about. Those things will always be present, so...

A couple days ago, someone put a saying up on FB that I really wish I could have captured to put here and sprinkle it like fairy dust to those who need to hear it. It went something like this, "If you are depressed, you are living in the past. If you are anxious, you're living in the future." Let's take any clinical diagnoses out of that equation and just settle on the general reality of it. It's true.

When I started this journey, I was a few months away from turning 41 with kids who were 8 and 5. I lived in a house that we had moved to just 2 years prior, and it was a honey-do project house in a great neighborhood with a great upside and in the best part of our school district (which we chose because of our youngest's diagnosis). It had a huge 3 car garage (built for those 80s cars) and it was winter when my XH moved out. We got one of the biggest snowstorms Denver has ever seen that March, and as I was shoveling with my then D9, I was really angry with him and verbally saying nasty things. He was off living in an apartment (and I didn't know where it was because he wouldn't tell me) and having a great time watching the snow fall and drinking hot toddies all day. I was stuck with kids that had a severe case of cabin fever and that shoveling was non stop. Anyway, my then D9 snapped and just stood there and yelled at me, "Jeez, Mom! Give it up already! You've got a roof over your head, plenty of food in the house, people who love you, we have 2 shovels and I'm helping you. STFU and be grateful!"

It was my very first introduction on "what you focus on expands". Because what she said was more than true. What I found out later was that he was holed up in his apartment and wondering what we were doing. It bothered him that he wasn't filling his duties as the man of the house, and he felt guilty. What a total waste of energy and time. It will never mean that life is perfect, because it's not. But the quicker you can get on board with accentuating the positives, the quicker you get on board with the happiness thing.

I hated the same things you did and had a list of things I hated about being divorced with kids, living on my own. But my annivorcery is coming up on 10 years, and here's what I can tell you I LOVE about being on my own.

1. I'm the boss of me and my household. I make good decisions, am reasonable, and I parented responsibly knowing that I would make the right call for the right reason.

2. I enjoyed deciding on the fly whether or not I was going to eschew chores for more fun things. My XH is of Norwegian descent and grew up in a household of people who valued hard work. All.The.Time. I respect the hell out of it. But sometimes you have to recognize that there is time for fun too. So rather than feel guilty about reading a book on the patio instead of mowing the lawn, I reveled in the joy that I felt by deciding to do what made me happy at that time.

3. There were no more fights about the TV. See #2 for the reason behind it. He grew up thinking a little TV was ok, but that it was primarily a bad thing. I happen to have grown up with kind of the same value, but the kicker? I love sports. I will watch sports that I love, including baseball. During baseball season. Every night. Of course, I usually have it on for sound and will work around it, but it makes me happy. I am the boss of my remote, and it thrills me.

4. See #2 for mores about mealtime. A big healthy meal, with all of us seated at the table was his preference. It's nice. But my now D21 and I learned early on that eating dinner in the family room - together, as a family - was just as acceptable during a hockey game. In fact, now it is our preference. We're still together, we're still talking, but we're where we like to be during meals.

Add on note to #4 - I grew up having breakfast for dinner once a week as well. I loved it. He hated it, so we didn't. When he moved out, I reinstated it, much to the delight of my girls, who still love having omelettes or waffles for dinner. And on very special occasions, we opt for all dessert dinners or all appetizer dinners. He would *never* go for that, Claire. Ever. I can guarantee you that when my D21 gets home from college, one of her first meal requests will be appetizers for dinner. And of course, I will oblige. grin We won't be inviting her dad either.

5. Washing my car whenever I felt like it. Scheduling mani/pedis whenever I felt like it.

In short, I found out that I was far less a rulz girl than I pegged myself to be. I was a rulz girl because he had rulz. And yes, looking back, I think he had a lot of fears that surrounded his self imposed rules. To this day, he doesn't eat dinner in front of the TV. He turns it off and turns on music. I've learned to appreciate that in him. Because if he's at peace, so are we. But at my house? I am a whole lot more "go with the flow" in my 50s, and not so stuck on rules. Rules are good, as long as they are not working against you most of the time.

Once I got the hang out of appreciating what IS, it was a whole lot easier to be grateful for what IS. And living a grateful and abundant life manifests in wonderful, magical ways... not the least which is to teach your kids to live grateful lives early on. What a wonderful gift to give them!

In the same vein of what I said to Maybell and what Mozza said to you, how do you want to be? How do you want your friends and family to see you? What actions can get you to that place where you see yourself in a more positive light? The older I get, the more important it is for me to be authentic, with myself and others. That seems to be the sticky note on my forehead that goes with me wherever I go. Treat others as I want to be treated. How they respond doesn't matter. It matters the most what *I* think of me, and those who love me as well.

Getting back to thinking in a more positive light. Because I tended to focus on the negative, I let that one go first. Then I gave Ms. Positive the chance to chime in. It was always easier to embrace the last word when I let it happen that way. cool

Keep going!
Betsey


"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."

Albert Einstein
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claire7 Offline OP
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Betsey and labug,

I cannot express how grateful I am that you took the time to share this perspective in such a kind way. This way of being-- of seeing the positives, of focusing more on others than myself is not how I was raised. It's not how my parents are and it's not how my grandparents were. So it is something I am learning to be and do every day.

I am grateful for the opportunity I have to show my daughter a different way.

Goal #1: stop having so much d@mn self-pity and being so self-obsessed. Focus on the positives. Expand that.

And send some food to my SIL.

Thank you.


Me 38 H 40
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T 8 M 6
BD 10/2013

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Claire, I think I can speak for both Bets and me, we weren't raised this way either. For me, it's been a long slow slog out of family dysfunction.

The things Betsey listed are things I now have to figure out in my M. We're doing it but it's been a process. More growth! smile We're creating a very different R than we had in, what I like to call, our first M. But it's sometimes very difficult.

You have to get there, to YOUR life, otherwise there's a danger that future R will resemble your old M.

I recently listened to an interview with Ellen Burstyn. The whole interview was full of wisdom but a few quotes stood out for me. One: "I think that we have a natural impulse to serve. We like to serve a man dinner. We like to get up and give him a cup of coffee. But that leads us down a path where it gets taken for granted. As though we are supposed to, as opposed to, we want to. One has to learn that. It’s not an obligation. It’s a gift. That we want to give. But if it’s not received as a gift, but as a duty, one starts to get their hackles up after a while."
We have to be able to recognize when our "gift" becomes a supposed to rather than a want to.

Bets, I think you would love this interview-Ellen Burstyn WNYC
Google is our friend. Do you remember "Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore"?



Last edited by labug; 03/27/15 04:21 PM.

Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
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