Susana (7) - Like a big pizza pie

[susana4]

Hi T, yes I suppose the people-pleasing tendencies don't help, do they?

My H seemed happy leading up to BD, although I do wonder if sometimes because I was very down and depressed about work, if I didn't see he wasn't happy because i was in a fog. But I did genuinely think he was happy, he'd just started his dream job, he seemed very happy in our M, we did lots of fun activities together and he constantly said how he was so happy with his life, so lucky, etc. I really never questioned his happiness. I had a conversation with a friend of his a week or two before the bomb, who drunkenly told me H was the happiest he'd ever seen him, and H was so happy with me, etc. etc. So his friends also seemed to think he was happy with our M. The only 'clue' I can think of is a couple of months before BD H and I were cuddling one day and he said to me "I felt really disconnected from you the last few days, did you feel it too?" And i said yes, and asked why he thought it was, and he said he wasn't sure. I wasn't either. We just felt far apart. But then 3 days later he said "I feel back to normal again, and re-connected, do you?" (And I did.) And we talked about why it had happened but neither of us were sure, and it didn't seem to matter as things felt 'normal' again, and I assumed it was just a normal period of growing apart and together again.

"I think it is a happy combination of feeling compassionate towards your WAS and being more of an 'observer' than participant in their drama." That makes sense. Not feeling much compassion atm though. I know I will be okay either way, because I was very happy in my life before H (I really loved being single), so as long as I re-connect with that I will be happy, maybe even happier. I guess what I'm not so sure about is being happy with someone else. Prior to meeting H I didn't want to be in a relationship at all, I was so happy being single. And now, I know I can enjoy being in a relationship, but I also wonder if it was all a lie - and I find myself questioning how I can be happy in any future one. I think I will just question whether they are really happy - especially if it's a male tendency not to say. But then, I have trust issues, and this whole sitch has just massively reinforced those. (I do think it must be a case of creating what you fear.) I think I will question future Mr. Susana's commitment and happiness, as well as my own ability to tell whether he's happy. I also have a fear that because I got used to living with a people pleaser, any future relationship I have will prove dissatisfactory in comparison, because they won't just go along with everything I want, and I've become accustomed to being with someone who just does whatever I want and living as I want. Logically I know that's not healthy, and I don't want someone to just lie and say they agree with me when they don't - but then I fear I've grown used to that and anyone else I end up with will just seem ornery. If that makes sense.

[susana4]

I just feel so weak and pathetic right now. Every time I try and force myself to stop crying and leave the house and enjoy the sunshine, I start crying again and can't stop. This is so pathetic. I feel like a failure as a DBer and a person. I don't even know what I'm crying about! I'm mourning something that's already gone, that I don't even know if I want (or maybe I'm mourning that I don't know if I want him any more?). My friend cancelled our plans but I still want to go out for a walk, and I was going to go shopping but I can't seem to stop crying and I feel weak even writing this.

[susana4]

I have never been very comfortable with limbo situations (who is?) but I let my anxiety get the better of me in many limbo situations. The last time I applied for a visa (this was before i was with H) I had a huge problem with the anxiety and my IC wasn't very helpful with it. I didn't realise how bad it was until I found myself wandering panic-stricken around unfamiliar areas of the city in the middle of the night because it was the only way I knew how to deal with the anxiety (dangerous as it was). But then I got the visa so I tucked that into the back of my mind.

Then, I had to reapply over this winter and I was in the midst of a major meltdown about my visa and job limbo when H dropped the bomb. BD distracted me from that and now it's coming back into focus and I'm left looking at my life and realising I am in limbo in several areas - my job, my visa and whether I stay in the country, my living situation. What I hate about limbo is feeling like I have no control (yes, back to my desire for control) and no choice. Knowing that I'm not happy with an aspect of my life (like my job) but am unable to change it. Maybe this is the universe's way of forcing me to become more comfortable with limbo, and lack of control. Well played, universe, well played. But not very nice.

I know I have choices, I do. But man, none of them have good consequences.

[Cadet]

So I have no idea whether:
-He was actually in denial to himself and didn't realise he was unhappy until BD (this is what he claims)

If you examine depression, part of it is denial.
So yes he has always been unhappy but has no clue how to
get out of his depression and thinks that it is anyone elses fault other than his own.
You being a possible candidate in that pool.

You didnt break him and can not fix him.

Study more about depression and some of this will make more sense.

[zew]

What I hate about limbo is feeling like I have no control (yes, back to my desire for control) and no choice. Knowing that I'm not happy with an aspect of my life (like my job) but am unable to change it. Maybe this is the universe's way of forcing me to become more comfortable with limbo, and lack of control. Well played, universe, well played. But not very nice. wink

I know I have choices, I do. But man, none of them have good consequences.

I don't buy any of this.
You do have control. You have complete control over what you do next.

If you don't like your job, start looking for a new one. If that takes a skills upgrade, then get on it. You want control? Then start controlling how you feel about yourself. Nobody is forcing you to stay in limbo. You are only in limbo so long as you let others, or yourself, hold you back.

I urge you, do not wander into the "woe is me, I'm a victim of the universe" territory. I've watched my WAW in there for over a year now and it is no way to look at life.

If all of this misery we experience can teach us anything, it is this: We are each responsible for ourselves - our happiness, our comfort, our morals, our ability to be at peace with ourselves. We each own and control that. If you want something, go for it, in a way that you can live with. Don't wait for someone else to ask if you need something. If you're heading in the wrong direction, change course.

The decision to be in limbo is completely yours. Figure out where you want to be and take the first step. You will quickly find that any progress in the right direction can be very inspiring.

[susana4]

W

So I have no idea whether:
-He was actually in denial to himself and didn't realise he was unhappy until BD (this is what he claims)

If you examine depression, part of it is denial.
So yes he has always been unhappy but has no clue how to
get out of his depression and thinks that it is anyone elses fault other than his own.
You being a possible candidate in that pool.

You didnt break him and can not fix him.

Study more about depression and some of this will make more sense.

Thanks Cadet. I will do some reading. I wondered about depression but didn't think he had the symptoms.. At least not symptpms I've seen. But I've just done some preliminary readings and it seems men experience different symptoms than women (so his experience would be different to mine). I will do some more reading. I have to admit to skimming the depression section in DR as well because I didn't think it applied.

[susana4]

Zew - well said. I don't want to live in that state any more, I have to admit that I lived in it far too long before BD. But nor do I want to pin my happiness on some future event. I have a tendency to do this, as do many people. H too and it always annoyed me when he did. "Well once I get X, I will be happy."
I struggle with the dichotomy of working to improve our lives and being happy without current circumstances.

I have a new job lined up (after I spent the first half
Of last year in a woe is me stage). I've had it lined up since October but am still waiting on the visa. I suppose impatience might be te better term for what I'm feeling right now.

I know I do still have choices though. I could throw in the towel on waiting for the visa/new job and leave the country. But that would mean giving up the life I've built here and all my friends (this is what I meant by I know I have choices but the consequences aren't good). Still, I can choose.

[Cadet]

Depression, Marriage, and Divorce

Many studies have found that being divorced, separated, or widowed is closely linked to depression. The loss of a marriage may lead to depression, or depression may lead to loss of a marriage. A 2000/2001 study published in the journal Depression and Anxiety that analyzed depression statistics from the Canadian National Population Health Survey found that major depression doubled a person's chance of becoming divorced or separated.

Depression can come in many forms.
Overt - Obvious depression
Covert - Hidden or masked depression. (usually undiagnosed)

By your own admission your husband is UNHAPPY!

Why do you think that is?

My guess is something inside of him,
not something you have done or can control.

Unfortunately it is not something that can easily be fixed.
Certainly not by us.

[susana4]

I've done a little reading on covert depression, thanks for te tip Cadet. Some of it does seem to fit with H. I thought before he seemed like he could be going through MLC but he's too young. When I get home I will re read depression chapter in DR (I only skimmed if before because i didn't think H fit symptoms of depression).

H doesn't have the anger that's talked about my covert depression but his brother definitely does. He's always starting fights, has been banned from bars and been arrested. H and I have spoken before about whether his brother is depressed. All f H's brothers self medicate with alcohol as far as I can tell. H supresses his anger in a way I've always thought was unhealthy (not sure if this fits into covert depression or not).

He seemed to have been self medicating with alcohol in January but this seems to have stopped in feb, but now he has substituted with a tv show. Before BD, h was incredibly focused on work (another addiction to avoid facing it?) and gave up a lot f hobbies and friendships to pursue work. He was incapable of making major decisions (another symptom of covert depression they say). We were trying to decide whether to move abroad and he couldn't decide, at the time I thought it was immaturity. Then he got the new job he was working for and seemed aimless after that. At BD he blamed me for giving up hobbies like biking, and got not seeing his friends more. I thought this was ridiculous and chalked it up to "believe none of what they say" but covert depression does make sense.

At any rate it isn't something I can fix, like you say. He needs to fix it but who knows if he will. He has actually said before he thought he could use therapy but refused to see an IC on grounds of expense (money is a huge stressor for him and maybe linked to depression for him).

Another interesting thing I read in an article on covert depression is often the Ws of covert depressed H's end up having overt depression (I did).

I will stay my path. Nothing I can do for H if he is depressed apart from validation of he ever does realise and broach the subject.

Reading about it has made me feel more empathy for him (and less hatred), so that is good. That and sitting in the park in the sunshine and taking myself for dinner (and a movie in a little bit) has made me feel a bit better.

[Sotto]

Hi Susana

Sounds as though your day improved anyway....

Interesting on the reading there, and useful to look at things in a more compassionate way. I think it you feel really angry, it's pretty hard for that not to become evident to your S in some way. If you can genuinely get to a place of feeling some compassion, it's so much better - for you if nothing else!

I found reading stuff about MLC useful for kindness. The descriptions of the MLC stages on the Hearts blessings website were useful for me. and I certainly feel there is an element of MLC in our sitch.

The other thing to remember is - whatever is causing your sitch - your H isn't in a good place atm. Being a WAS is not a great place to be. We hear that from WAS's kind enough to post honestly about their experiences on the forum. Like Sandi...