Hopeless in NYC

[eclipse]

Another hour-long conversation. I'm getting good at dragging them out of her, except it's very emotionally draining and I feel depressed for days afterward. So she's on a new kick: rather than not being in love now, apparently she's *never* been in love. Okay, so in my introduction, I did say our relationship was more of a friendship than anything. What I didn't know was that it bothers her. Further she continues to point out how we're not right for each other and can't possibly want the same things in life, otherwise I wouldn't have become so depressed in the first place. She thinks a relationship shouldn't be so hard to maintain that one person becomes suicidal in the process. Maybe so, but I'm still here and I still keep coming back for more, don't I? It seems that going to hell and back for the people you care about is not respectable in her view--it should come naturally or not at all. How does one argue with this logic?

At some point she started crying again about why I won't just let her move on. I don't why she is crying if she says she doesn't want to try anymore....especially this many months down the line and with the things she's been saying. None of it makes any sense. After the phone call, when I dropped our daughter off and said I'll be going on a business trip in a few weeks, her face lit up and she was very curious about who I'm going with. She seemed disappointed that it was just coworkers...does she really want me to get a girlfriend that badly? Jeez.

Meanwhile, I've backslid so far that there's probably no chance of coming back now. I just don't feel like I can do this anymore. What do I want to change about myself? I don't know. It's hard when you have no real goals in life. IC isn't helping much...that I can tell. I've started looking for places to move out to, even if it's just renting until I can figure out what to do about our savings. Some change is better than no change at all, I suppose. And perhaps that's the first real change so far.

[Vapo]

Dude, I feel for you, I really do. I've heard it all before, and it does sound like a classic bout of MLC. Don't try to make sense of of all, because there is none to be made, there is no amount of logic to explain it, so don't even try. She is lost to you at this point and NOTHING you say or do will budge her. NOTHING.

It is not about you, it is about her. She's got to get on with her journey of growing up and it is her journey to take. You CANNOT fix her, because you have not broken her. Prepare yourself for the possibility of another man in the picture. There usually is one. Protect yourself and protect your assets ( savings). Your W has became a stranger to you. If you could trust her with your life before, now she will lie and not blink, if she was a stay at home mum, now she will go out partying. She will do $hit that will confuse the hell out of you (but you have probably figured that one out already).

Stay strong and be the best dad you can be. You gave been given the gift of time, use it wisely. WHAT DOES ECLIPSE WANT TO DO IN LIFE? You want to take that trip you always dreamed about? Now is the time. You also have a journey to take. You have to lead by example. Do not focus on your wife and her actions, because it won't make any sense and you trying to make sense of it all will just drive you CRAZY. You have to detach for your own sanity. TRUST ME, I DO KNOW WHAT I AM SAYING. IT will get better, but honestly for a bit more it will get worse. Your D needs the best dad in the world and you owe it to her to became one.

I am glad you found this board. You are among friends here and we understand you (you have figured out by now that your friends and family do not understand). Come here and rant, come here and vent, don't bottle it up inside. Also GAL (get a life), find stuff to do with your spare time, and stay away from booze or other quick fixes.

[eclipse]

Dude, I feel for you, I really do. I've heard it all before, and it does sound like a classic bout of MLC.

Women get MLC? And at 29?? Sorry, I don't know much about the human condition because I have a natural tendency to self-isolate and have lived a very sheltered life since I met my W at age 16. So is this similar to how I started to question my life and flipped out right before I turned 30 back in September? Is it her turn now?

It is not about you, it is about her. She's got to get on with her journey of growing up and it is her journey to take. You CANNOT fix her, because you have not broken her. Prepare yourself for the possibility of another man in the picture. There usually is one.

It is confusing. She hated me for giving so much of myself to my job and now she is working herself to death in a graveyard shift which takes a heavy toll on her mentally (one of the key reasons I was supportive of her switching jobs before). She is so pleased with herself for getting by without me...I wonder if she thinks it's the same as what I had to go through while supporting our family. Yeah, she keeps talking about finding another man and having a child with him because she wants another one and can't fathom the thought of doing that with me again.

Protect yourself and protect your assets ( savings).

Kinda hard to do because she keeps changing her mind. First she wanted to give me most, then split 50/50, now back to most just so I would let her go already. She asks me how much child support I would like to pay but then asks if I even want to pay child support at all. How can I plan around this? I don't know...take when she's offering and shove it into some account for the kid that she can't touch? I've never had financial aspirations...as long as I have enough for food and shelter, I just don't care. It bothers her because she doesn't have that as leverage--I'm willing to burn our savings to the ground and spend any extra income to keep her stuck with her parents for the next few years.

WHAT DOES ECLIPSE WANT TO DO IN LIFE? You want to take that trip you always dreamed about? Now is the time. You also have a journey to take. You have to lead by example.

The problem is that I never wanted anything out of life except female companionship. Sad, I know...but I pretty much have everything else one needs to get by. I think I read in Sandi's rules I'm not supposed to be having *that* kind of fun at this stage. To complicate matters, there is the interesting caveat in my marriage, that my W and I are each others first and only. I think I made it an unwinnable scenario because I did express interest in sexual encounters with other women at some points in the R. This was especially the case at the height of my pre-30 insanity, and at some point I actually started verbalizing low confidence in carrying through on such curiosities (yes, I know it's insane). So now she uses this as ammunition and calls me an "eligible bachelor," saying that as a good looking guy with a great job I shouldn't have any trouble finding someone. And yes, for the first time in my life, I've actually started noticing that women other than my wife do actually check me out, and that apparently some really good-looking ones who stalk me on Facebook would like meet me (thanks, sis). And it's flattering, it really is...but I just don't care. The grass isn't greener on the other side, and I am hotter for W than ever.

From the bird-eye view: if I don't meet anyone else, she doesn't feel like I chose her and that I'm still just in desperation mode. If I do meet someone else, it proves I'm not serious about family life and she was right to suspect it would become a problem eventually. Checkmate!

stay away from booze or other quick fixes.

Crap, I just finished up a spare grigio!

[eclipse]

I should add that during that last phone convo, W said that she's not in any rush to get the paperwork at the moment. First time I've heard that so far!

[help67]

Hey,
My nyc buddy, I am from Brooklyn , lived there my first 35 years. I had a few of those hour long conversations myself, and I think they did me no good, the last one being when my wife brought up the seperation agreement 7 weeks ago. She said she was anxious about it not getting done and was going to work on a draft and send it to me, and while I did get emotional, I didn't try to talk her out of it. She hasn't brought it up since, I won't bring it up. The hour long conversations prior to that one, I begged, reasoned, etc., all the things not to do.
These last 7 weeks I have pulled back more and more, all the while loving her and treating her with respect, and things have improved.

Anyway, what is the longest you have not been in contact with her, maybe you need to pull back.

I can feel your pain from reading your posts, my seperation is tearing me apart, but I think as everyone is telling us, keep working on ourselves, and it will get better.

[Vapo]

Dude, you have some serious soul searching to do...

[EyeTie]

One thing I would suggest too is an anger management course. There are a few things you have said that make me think she may be fearful of her safety, the broken tea kettle, her flinching when you reached for her, the way she talks to you on the phone (strongly) then in person (passively). I think she is scared of you.

[eclipse]

Hey,
My nyc buddy, I am from Brooklyn , lived there my first 35 years. I had a few of those hour long conversations myself, and I think they did me no good, the last one being when my wife brought up the seperation agreement 7 weeks ago. She said she was anxious about it not getting done and was going to work on a draft and send it to me, and while I did get emotional, I didn't try to talk her out of it. She hasn't brought it up since, I won't bring it up. The hour long conversations prior to that one, I begged, reasoned, etc., all the things not to do.
These last 7 weeks I have pulled back more and more, all the while loving her and treating her with respect, and things have improved.

Anyway, what is the longest you have not been in contact with her, maybe you need to pull back.

I can feel your pain from reading your posts, my seperation is tearing me apart, but I think as everyone is telling us, keep working on ourselves, and it will get better.

I tried to pull back, but that doesn't really help. Reason is that I've "pulled back" in the past and that's one of the contributing factors to the decline of the relationship. Also, even though I've given the W all the space she wanted, it hasn't stopped the clock from ticking in her mind and she's growing impatient. Avoid the issue doesn't work...another vice from the past. So I can't confront, but I can't stall either. Checkmate.

Dude, you have some serious soul searching to do...

Care to elaborate? Anything would help at this point.

One thing I would suggest too is an anger management course. There are a few things you have said that make me think she may be fearful of her safety, the broken tea kettle, her flinching when you reached for her, the way she talks to you on the phone (strongly) then in person (passively). I think she is scared of you.

Funny you mention that. First off, when she asked for a lift on 2/22 (http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2541253#Post2541253), she expressed hesitation because I'm probably angry and that I'll drive like a maniac as I usually do when in that state (in my studies, I've learned how in some cases, this is a form of emotional abuse, apparently). Then today, when I stopped by in the morning to drive D to school, I happened to stop the car right in front a giant slush puddle. When I stepped out to help D into the car, both my feet slid ankle deep into the slush. As I stood there in utter disbelief, my W looked at me and said something along the lines of "quick, use those anger management techniques!" (obviously referring to my IC). I just laughed it off, but you're right--in the past, I would blow up when something like that would happen, and it always freaked her out. It feels good to have it under control.

[eclipse]

At first it put me on edge, but now I'm really enjoying how the W is questioning every little thing I'm doing differently.

[mahhhty]

Eclipse - It sounds like things are going well. What are you implementing that supports her behavior? Do you think you are doing all you can?