M 53 W 44 D25 D20 S22 PA 10/95 BD abt 2k EA BD 9/2004 PA D'd 1/05/05 DB'd 9/2004-08 PA ends 02/2005 XW rehab 03/2005 piecing until OM3 June?/2005 Remarried 12/28/07 BD 12/18/14 Sep living together
Glad your feeling better after a tough couple of days (sorry this is a little late on that front). They happen but they are part of learning to accept all this
The fact you can put anything in a 'detachment report' is really good progress. I thought this wa a really important but mainly because i'm feeling this a lot at the moment
Originally Posted By: Mozza
I told her how unhealthy it was for me to long for someone who left me.
I want to try and figure out what does healthy look like for me and more importantly what does a healthy 'relationship' with my STBXW look like from here on out (assuming no reconciliation)
As for the changes, she might have a lot to do but it can happen, just look at the change some of the LBS' make after BD. I know i have a lot to do but I also know some changes were virtually overnight and 5 months later they seem to be sticking.
Life is all about incentives.
Both mid 30s, 2 young kids BD 7sep14 XW moved on long ago, now living with OM1 D paperwork in progress
Moz, there are probably very few of us DBers that don't, at one point or another in this process, question their attractiveness. I'm doing it right now, myself. But I believe that if we keep DBing, someday, this insecurity will be a thing of the past. Try to become the best Mozza you can be, and you will realize that there are countless people in this world that will cherish who that is.
As far as worrying about a future spouse having issues...don't. To start with, you won't find perfection. And I believe if you are true to yourself, you don't try to put on a fake facade (which MNG's typically do), then whoever you fall in love with will love YOU, not your act.
Karma has some great tips for things to look for in a person. But even so, it's hard to really know how someone is going to react if a R or M breaks down. I think every single one of us is capable of having an A under the right circumstances. More important for you, right now, is to continue to learn more about what healthy and unhealthy R's/M's look like. That way, in the future, you will be able to resolve problems long before the **** hits the fan. In my case, if I could do it all over again, I would definitely marry WAW again. But I would have been alarmed years ago at some of my behavior and our interactions. At the time, I thought it was normal, just the way it is, just a phase, etc. If I was put in the same positions again, I believe I could address them, and in healthy, appropriate ways.
As an example, about 6 months ago, my uncle (who had reecently married my blood-related aunt) was telling some of us about quirks in their new marriage. Everyone else was just laughing at the antics. And before, I would have, too. With my new knowledge, I knew they were serious problems (lots of lying, hiding things from each other, trying to continue pretending to be who they were pretending to be when they were dating the last 2-3 years, etc.). They are already divorced. Before, I would have laughed at the stories then been shocked at the final result. Now, I was deeply concerned by what I heard, then not surprised at all to learn of their split.
Bottom line: Keep DBing, and you will tackle or avoid many of the things that have you anxious right now.
Okay Moz, promise me something - at some point, when you feel an opportunity to flirt with a girl, especially somewhere like a train where you aren't going to see the same people every day, DO IT. And don't just friend-zone flirt. Make some casual conversation, but eventually be direct and ask for an e-mail address, name, phone number, twitter handle, whatever. Just be bold! What's the worst thing that will happen? She won't give it to you? Who cares??
***cheesy quote alert***
You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. -Gretzky
And if you miss a shot, forget it, you didn't want that shot anyway. -Card29
Me 38, WAW 30 D11 (former marriage) S2 T 8 years M 3 years BD 8/20/23 S 8/20/23
The external glamour of the body will not match the joy that shines from the internal strength of a loving heart.
I believe that the love of self will in the long run cause us to make the body the best it can be for the age we are. How lovely to be like a child revelling in our physicality.
That is attractive.
V
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
Body image | Thanks a lot to all of you for your support. I was not very clear. I don't have body image issues: in fact, I believe I've never looked that good. I've had such comments in real life. Someone who didn't know me even gave me a 8/10 the other day, which is flabbergasting for me who's been giving myself a 5 in a tailored suit. It's more of an issue of being good, but not good enough. Think of Benedict Cumberbatch at the Oscars last night: how does he feel after Eddie Redmayne snatched the Oscar? Certainly not ugly and untalented, but there's something about going to the after-Oscar party as the "loser" of his category. Sure sure, he's talented and offered a remarkable performance but... he lost. I'm sure he'll have some issues to resolve when next appearing on a set, even if he was just told he's among the top 5 in the world. So WAW is the woman I want, but this OM came and stole her. I feel... castrated, I guess. I'm wondering if other LBS feel this too. Maybe it's something for my Freudian IC.
Flirting report | It's my week with the kids, so I'm not really out there. I had two thoughts that gave me confidence. The first is that not everyone has the same taste, so this "breathtakingly gorgeous girl" (aka Toots) that I saw on the metro might look plain to someone else (but not Toots). This means I shouldn't assume that everyone that attracts me can have anyone. Second, beautiful people apparently struggle too because people are intimidated by them. My IC told me of female clients of his who are off the scale of 10 who complain that no one goes to talk to them. I volunteer to take them out of their misery! All of this makes me sound superficial, but it's in part because I'm not really looking for Mrs Right at the moment.
For others juggling with the dating question, head over Tarheel's thread to read about his experience of hooking up for the first time 1.5 year after his WAW left him.
Detachment report | Wow, I almost forgot to mention: today would have been our 10-year anniversary (of the relationship). How's that for detachment? I did think about it today and got sad a couple of times, but not in crisis mode. Also, anyone noticed that I don't talk about my WAW's actions and what they mean for R? She's cut down on her own communications in the last 10 days, even for the kids. It helps me a lot. ____________________________
Karma 12 | I like your list of early signs to look out for, specially the friendships. I was always surprised that WAW had so few long term friendships while I probably have 10 close, long term friends. At 29, when I met my WAW, I thought I was much more mature about what I was looking for, but I was still a fool. I ignored plenty of red flags, including very obvious ones about her flight reflex and romantic expectations. I probably am still a fool. It seems like a lifetime is not enough to learn to be good at relationships.
Toots | ROFL. Well now you have to tell me: would you have given me your phone number??
Card29 | I'm impressed that you know you would marry your WAW again. Right now, I highly doubt that I would do the same thing. I see my faults, but I doubt that a better me would have been able to live up to WAW's expectations. She has issues of her own that are not related to me. I really like your uncle and aunt's story. Much like you, I have a completely new outlook on relationships and take red flags much more seriously because I now know that D can happen.
Thanks for the push to talk to women! You're right about gathering the courage in settings where I'll never meet the same people again. I have (another) hangup about being seen flirting, probably because it is an acknowledgement of my needs. It feels very humiliating to me, like people now know what I want and will tease me about it or just revel in my failure. So in the metro, I remember looking around at the people and wondering what they'd think if I walked up to that girl. I had ready made thoughts for some of them and they were all judgmental or mocking. Come to think of it, they could also have been impressed to see a guy with the balls to do this. I would have been very jealous to see another guy do it and would probably have assumed that he's confident and successful with women.
MCS | Yes, this is just where I am right now. It's even mostly where my head is, but my heart still wants WAW over anyone else. But I've convinced myself that we can never know the future, so of course my feelings might change at any point. As for handing my sitch over to God, you are right that I'm not a religious person. I believe that time will tell and I've gotten much better at handling uncertainty. There's no need to know or act today. Everything is going according to plan and I'm better today than I was yesterday, so all will be well in the end.
jim0987 | You're right, changes can happen. You caught me thinking of the future, thinking of WAW. Much like you, I would say, I tend to wonder if there's any point in considering WAW as an option for the future. I would do better to let it rest and focus on me. And by the way, I completely agree with "life is all about incentives". And when our WAW will want something, their actions will align. Let's be our best selves et cetera, et cetera...
Vanilla | Absolutely. I feel like all this work that I'm doing on my body is for me. In fact, I rarely (but not never) think of what WAW would think about it.
M39 D6 D3 (at S) S 2014-09 D 2016-09
"You can't start a fire sitting around, crying over a broken heart" - Bruce Springsteen.
Some of the most beautiful talented women of my generation have WAH who left them for OWs who are even more beautiful or even not. Fiona Fullerton, Jane Seymour, Nicole Kidman, Jennifer Aniston and Princess Diana. They are not losers, far from it, these losers have surpassed any commercial success of their H.
I doubt Cumberbatch thinks of himself as a loser either, he will win next time. It is only opinion. Beside Speilbergs films never won, the most commercially successful films of all time. It is only one measure, as superficial as a Facebook like.
There will always be someone more beautiful, handsome, richer, more talented and winning more accolades. This little ugly fat woman who is V, laid low by illness and steroids, is finding it hard to turn it around. It takes great effort, time and in V case a great trainer. Despondent, second best? Everything I read in all the books says if you want to be back with your SO, be the best you can be, be beautiful, handsome, fit and above all be thin. Be the winner, work hard, be sexy. In truth be all you can be. For most of us with ordinary flaws, with the usual set of problems it is enough just to get through each day. Each day as one day at a time. Mza, you are extraordinary, just as you are, the man you are becoming inside.
You may feel a loser but you are a winner.
V
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
Mozza I agree with V. My ex was intimidated by me in some ways. He used to say things like " everyone loves you". For someone with a lower sense of self they may initially be attracted to a strong attractive person but then feel threatened. I was a wife he should have been proud of and instead he resented my friendships and relationships with family. Not to sound vain but I know I was prettier than his AP. It has more to do with their low sense of self than anything to do with you.
Me 52 H 44 T9 M 5 BD 12/11 H split 8/12 OW moved in 12/12 OW gone for good 6/14 We get closer again 9/14 SD 13 Me 4 Grown
Accept what is...let go of what was and have faith in what will be.
-Card29