Avuncular? Dissonance? It's a weekend, Raliced! I'm at a disadvantage because I live with a nonverbal kiddo who doesn't stimulate my vocabulary. Well, unless you count all the cool medical lingo I've picked up through the years? No? Ok. I'm going to lose to you. :-)
My only hope for banter is with my now D21 (today is our birthday😄), but she's hungover and could barely talk to me today. I'm pathetic!
On a note to,get back to your dissonance post, don't you think that people are complex, difficult to label and our box-y categorization a little biased and from a single POV? I have to admit, it took me a long time to feel in my heart that my XH had his own set of accurate gripes about me. Perish the thought! But... Like RPP, my XH turned out to be a better dad and friend than husband. I reconciled that.
As the kid of a cop, I can tell you it's not easy to be married to one. My folks are the only ones in their circle of friends still married. And even then, my mom came close to kicking Dad out when I was 17. It's a tough dynamic. I think we kids had it easier because we just believed he'd be ok. My mom struggled with it. My dad had a few friends who were cheaters. Serial cheaters. And I loved them. But they were adrenaline junkies and addicted to living on the edge. I'd like to think these men have/had regrets, but what do I know?
Hugs for being that person. Your kids are fortunate that you're their mom.
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
Welcome to the thread. Medical lingo totally counts - I'm a healtchcare analyst IRL - so I talk to doctors all day long about fun topics like "co-morbidities".
Originally Posted By: Underdog
As the kid of a cop, I can tell you it's not easy to be married to one. My folks are the only ones in their circle of friends still married. And even then, my mom came close to kicking Dad out when I was 17. It's a tough dynamic. I think we kids had it easier because we just believed he'd be ok. My mom struggled with it. My dad had a few friends who were cheaters. Serial cheaters. And I loved them. But they were adrenaline junkies and addicted to living on the edge. I'd like to think these men have/had regrets, but what do I know?
Well - I hate to say it - but I think one issue STBX had was that I might have been a little too nonchalant about his profession. Since I find comfort in numbers and statistics, I always found the studies that most cops never have to discharge their service weapons very reassuring. And, after all, its still a lot more dangerous just to be a woman than to be in law enforcement. I always slept perfectly well when he was working. I think he he craved the respect that his profession frequently engenders and didn't necessarily feel he got it from me, or at least not is the dosage he needed.
And, while it's in that same line of speculative thinking I'm trying to shake - I think you're on to something about the adrenaline junkies - definitely a possiblity in STBX's case. He certainly came home pretty jazzed up if he had to run a suspect down at work.
There's still a lot of mystery about everything he's been up to. The weird motorcycle accident that seemed to kick this whole thing off... and I wouldn't be remotely surprised if there were some one night stands sprinkled in or if the first OW came out here to visit while he was at a "training". Lately I fantasize that some day, 20 years from now, we'll be at a place where he can spill about everything- although I doubt he would even remember at that point. Honestly - I still have a bit of a tough time with the idea that I will probably never know.
Yikes, let me clear up the birthday thing. My birthday is in April. But since I birthed this child, I figure it's a day we both celebrate? Sorry for the lack of clarity. I was bent over most of the day, painting furniture (I'm sore today for that feat). Maybe the blood rushed to my head and I'm oxygen deprived today?
Co-morbities? That's a yucky phrase. Notice my preschool adjective? I'm regressing. It must be because I've been homebound from a weekend of solid snow?!?!
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Well - I hate to say it - but I think one issue STBX had was that I might have been a little too nonchalant about his profession.
That is incredibly interesting, Raliced. My dad lost 6 friends during his time on the force, the last one being his best friend. He was a DC cop, not in Mayberry. He never brought work home, but he went to bars after his shift ended with his officers and drank his stress away. I didn't know better. All I knew was that he'd come home drunk and my mom would be pissed. For days.
Were/are you in denial or what's the deal here?
Now I have 3 really good friends who are cops (I'm discounting all my family members, because they don't count). They tell me stories, and I'm acutely aware of how dangerous their jobs are. Statistically speaking, being shot isn't the only way they are compromised. One of my buds (who is in fabulous shape, BTW) was extremely close to being knifed by a big ass Samoan on meth - at 6 am in the Walmart parking lot. I think that scared him a whole lot. And I probably don't need to illustrate how unpredictable domestic calls are? My dad's BFF was killed in one of those situations when I was 14. Two were killed on their service bikes, which is why my mom never allowed him to go into that area of service.
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Lately I fantasize that some day, 20 years from now, we'll be at a place where he can spill about everything- although I doubt he would even remember at that point.
I dunno, Raliced. He might. My godfather was a cop, and his XW was a friend of my mom's from MN. They divorced when I was 12, and left 2 kids my age behind. We always considered them our cousins, because we lived next door to each other and were basically raised together. Ironically, I modeled my D on a complete 180 of my aunt and uncle's--which was the most angry divorce I have ever witnessed. (LOL, and yes, the youngest is a cop who works on the bomb squad; my brother chose a career on the other side of the law, though.) When the oldest (who is 6 months younger than I) got married in 1996, my godparents BLEW.US.AWAY by dancing together on and off all night long. I had already heard my aunt's side of the story, when my uncle joined us at the table and told us his regrets and that he knew the catalyst was a fellow cop who called my aunt to tell her he was cheating on her. He looked us all in the eyes and said, "That guy had a massive crush on you, Judy. And he wanted you bad enough to try to get me out of the picture. I was not cheating on you. But no matter what I said, you weren't going to believe me, and he was going to go out of his way to create trouble. I should have fought for you. If I knew then what I know now, I would have. I'm sorry."
I'm pretty sure that hell froze over at that moment, Raliced. Sad to say, my aunt passed away 5 years ago, and my uncle has Alzheimers so bad now that he doesn't even recognize his daughter (but he always remembers my dad). When she visits him, he gets irritated and says, "When the hell is Judy coming to see me?" We literally laugh our asses off, Raliced. We used to sit in our bean bag chairs, read, listen to music and talk about how dysfunctional her parents' D was. It seems amusing now that we're both 52.
So let me ask another question. If your H was in the armed services, would you feel differently? Or a fireman? What if he was an office manager? Why do you think you didn't give him the respect or at least the admiration he was seeking? Or was this not about his profession at all? Not a slam, sweets. I'm not saying you should have had him on a pedestal or anything. But I'd NEVER, EVER date one. NEVER. That adrenaline thing is real, and I have yet to meet a cop who didn't have an addiction; most are very poor at recognizing it. But they make great friends and I *adore* all my cop friends. There is nothing I wouldn't do for them. Well, except give them a reason to use their tasers or service weapons on me...
So statistically speaking, I might have to go get some stats to challenge you on your sleeping like a baby night. Unless he actually works in Mayberry? Or he's actually Barney Fife? Then you *should* worry that he'll shoot his own foot clean off?!?!
BTW, I have a HUGE soft spot for cops. I used to host what I call "cop breakfast" - I'd invite my aforementioned pal and tell him to grab some friends and come on by at 6 am at the end of the midnight shift. I don't do it now because I drop my D17 off at high school at 7 am and I don't have the time in the morning. But I might start doing "cop dinner" for the swing shifts on weekends... Hmmm.
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
He certainly came home pretty jazzed up if he had to run a suspect down at work.
LOL, I'll address this one separately because it clearly illustrates the adrenaline thing. My dad retired in 1980, so he's so far removed from this, but I asked him to explain. He said, "Desk jobs are just so damn boring. We didn't take on this job to sit around and joke. That was part of it. But we couldn't do it for more than a few minutes."
Last year, my former boss/mentor/father figure and D21's godfather passed away on Valentine's Day. My cop friends and I were well versed in his medical episodes (he had liver cancer). So we were all huddled around him as he was dying and said cops started talking about a multi-county car theft chase that involved their 3 jurisdictions. Cop 4 joined us and it was like a bunch of women reliving their first Bon Jovi concert. I didn't want to look down and see if there was any excitement, if you get my drift.
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
Ok - going to take a quick mental break from the fascinating world of comorbidities (which are not as awful as they sound) to respond to here.
Regarding the danger level of STBX's job- I want to be clear that I worried plenty about all kinds of things, just not that he would be killed on the job. And as long as I felt he would come home at the end of his shift, I could sleep. He began his policing career in the small Iowa town we lived in that had a force of 10. Sort of Mayberry, but like most Midwestern Mayberrys these days - it had a significant meth problem. During the 5 years there - the worst that happened was that one of the officers had to go on medical leave for carpal tunnel syndrome. so that probably fed into my sense of security. The county that he works in now is rural - and according to him, pretty boring because they won't let him "do anything".
I did worry a lot however about the toll the shift work seemed to take on his health. During that stretch in Iowa he would work graveyard one month and then switch to swing the next. Awful. I told him many times I could never do that in a million years. I have a picture of him the day he graduated from the police academy holding the then infant D6, and one taken three years later holding D3 at the same age. He looks at least 10 years older- maybe closer to 15.
I worried about his mental health too. I am going to give STBX full and well deserved props here. He volunteered to be trained to do the very difficult work of catching child pornographers. Only a handful of people will do this very, very critical and very, very disturbing work. Of course, this had to cause him issues, but he wouldn't or couldn't talk about it and wouldn't see any kind of counselor either. The academy gave me a book when he graduated about how to be supportive and I did my best to follow its advice (which was to be patient and understanding about his moodiness). I don't even know how much of this work he actually ended up doing- given his understandable reticence on the topic.
I'll check in later about the topics of respect and adrenaline. Gotta let those percolate for a bit.
About the adrenaline. I think you're right and I think I didn't have my antenna up for this. STBX has a very domestic side as well. He was very happy to curl up in his sweats and watch football for the weekend, never went to bars, happy playing with his kids etc. I guess I felt that was the "real" him. And, of course, I remember him from before he was a cop and the adrenaline wasn't around, so that's my original frame of reference - but I do think it became a bigger and eventually, more essential, part of his life.
Aaaannnd... about the respect. I hope it doesn't sound like I didn't respect him or his choice of employment. My STBX is a hard worker, has always been liked by his employers, works difficult hours and with challenging subject matter and is clearly good at his job. I told him these things many times. But somehow, I just couldn't ever seem to find the right words or emphasis to satisfy the need he had. We just maybe had fundamentally different viewpoints on this.
Here's the best illustration I can give on the subject. After he started policing, I was commuting to the nearby city, when a job opportunity opened up at the county hospital that happened to be located in our little town. It was a huge and very rare opportunity to work closer to home (it gave me back 2 hours a day with my infant daughter). I wanted it very badly. When I went in to interview, STBX said "Good Luck, I told everyone at the station about it and they're all rooting for you". I responded that I wished he hadn't done that because it would be a little embarrassing if I didn't get it. I wish I could give you an accurate impression of the snotty hauteur with which he replied "They spend their time protecting people and saving lives, I hardly think they will give that much thought to what happens with your job". And that was generally his attitude. My attitude is that while I respect his work,(I really, really do) my own work is interesting, rewarding, and helps people remain healthy. Frankly, it also kept a roof over our head. It's not "less than" what he does. I don't think he feels the same way. And I'm sure my attitude colored my interactions on this topic with him. But I swear, I tried.
I wish I could give you an accurate impression of the snotty hauteur with which he replied "They spend their time protecting people and saving lives, I hardly think they will give that much thought to what happens with your job". And that was generally his attitude.
Actually, I can visualize that. I was married to someone who pulled (and occasionally still does) that crap with me too. I truly believe in the pit of my heart that it's their insecurity that takes the stage and it comes off as pompous as hell and doesn't exactly emit the happy vibes it was supposed to send? My XH is a rocket scientist. LOL, for real. He got his EE degree in 3 years and while he's one of the socializing nerds who has good social skills, he occasionally treats me as though I got a degree in basket weaving from the community college. Hello. I, too, have a BS in biology (premed kind) and a minor in math (not that I could even think about that today); and I've completed half my coursework for an MBA in Accounting. I used to get uber pissed off at this as well, Raliced, and I think it colored my interactions with him as well. Perhaps a bit of self preservation and unwillingness to put myself out there on the chopping block for ridicule? I know it affected my willingness to be vulnerable. But given my history in taking charge and wanting my opinions and values to matter, I'm pretty sure I knocked his masculinity around some.
So maybe it's the chicken and the egg after all?
And to sum it up, it sounds as though he felt insecure for his own reasons and wound up lashing out at you because he felt that way? AND BTW, the cop cheating thing? I know a cheater is a cheater, but I can call this brand of cheating a prop. They like the thrill of the chase. It's not the person. It's the speed in their car. Once the bimbos aren't perps, they're gone. Just my observation...
Keep up the good work. You really are doing a fabulous job of pushing forward. You have a life that matters and kids that think you rock. Some days, that's more than enough!
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
After my mom put the kibbosh on motorcycle patrol, my dad worked vice for a few years. I'm pretty sure my mom had the hots for him in his uniform but not this duty. (Poetic justice???) He dressed like a skank, smelled like one and looked like he was a homeless drug user. This was in the 70s, LOL. He worked a side job as a house painter for extra money, so after he got off work, he'd go get covered with paint, and then just wear the same clothes the next day. One day, I heard my mom bitching about it, until he reminded her that his first choice was the Harley. Periodically, he still reminds her she deprived him of the one job he wanted. She did stats for the DOE and decided she wanted him to be there to be a dad. The things you do for love...
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
AND BTW, the cop cheating thing? I know a cheater is a cheater, but I can call this brand of cheating a prop. They like the thrill of the chase. It's not the person. It's the speed in their car. Once the bimbos aren't perps, they're gone. Just my observation...
Time will tell. Both known OWs are parole officers - so possible adrenaline issues on their sides as well, or they *get* each other. He seems pretty committed at the moment anyway.
Last night D6 and I were looking at pictures of the Oscar dresses and when we came to Laura Dern, she piped up - "Hey - that's Lisa! (OW)".
Then you *should* worry that he'll shoot his own foot clean off?!?!