Though this is written for women, similar dynamic with men, especially with the male s3xual dynamic, imo...
Quote:
Taken from a post at Womens AidorgUK: Traumatic bonding occurs in abusive relationships because the abuser's behaviour keeps switching between nice and horrible (this Jekyll and Hyde behaviour is a characteristic of people with narcissistic disorder). So in order to get love from her partner, the woman also has to tolerate a huge amount of emotional pain, and she never knows what sort of mood he will be in because his behaviour is so unpredictable (psychologists call this intermittent reinforcement). Traumatic bonding itself is a highly addictive process consisting of 8 separate trauma components: Trauma arousal, trauma shame, trauma blocking, trauma splitting, trauma reaction, trauma pleasure, trauma abstinence and trauma repetition, each of which activates a specific neurochemical pathway in the brain which in turn floods the brain with highly addictive chemicals (which are as addictive as some Class A drugs). The different components of the trauma bond are activated at different stages in the cycle of abuse, for example, during the 'honeymoon period', trauma blocking and trauma pleasure come into play, while the tension building stage and explosion both activate the trauma reaction, trauma splitting and trauma arousal components. The other components such as trauma shame, trauma repetition and trauma abstinence tend to be present throughout the abuse cycle. So throughout the cycle of abuse, a variety of addictive chemicals are flooding through your brain. Repetitive cycles of abuse worsen the addiction and consequently strengthen the trauma bond. Trauma bonds are also strengthened by another process called the Karpman Triangle (named after psychiatrist Stephen Karpman, by whom it was first identified) in which the roles of the victim, persecutor and rescuer switch around due to certain commonalities between all three roles.
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
NLT, what a mess your H got himself into. This is going to be tough for you to watch him trying to sort this. Job and kml are right, stay away from it as much as possible. Is he going back to live in that house of his until it sells? What are his plans after that?
M:50 H:52 S28 (my S from previous marriage) M:17 + 3 BD: 06/12 S: 06/12 - H works in another state
Thanks job. He contacted the leasing co to explain the situation and that he wasn't in possession of the car. I'm sure he didn't think of letting them repo the car but that would end the problem for sure. Can't they come after him for the remainder of the lease or the buyout amount? It's worth the loss and hit to his credit as far as I'm concerned. We're talking about a nut case that threatened to sue him for whatever it was that she thought she had grounds for. The fact that she is gone and not stealing money from him has saved him over $5K already!
I'm in full agreement and his book tells him exactly that. Run, fast and as far as possible and most important NO CONTACT. Block calls, block or delete emails and texts without looking at them and hang up if they call from an unknown number.
kml, I'm so detached now that it doesn't bother me much. I've gotten into a new rhythm without him around. I have had zero expectations for so long that other than wanting her out of both of our lives for safety reasons, I'm not focused on him when he's not around. That's not to say that I don't care what happens to him but as job said and I told him several months ago when I was in a piSSy mood...you got yourself into this, I know you'll figure out how to get out of it. Funny thing, he repeats that to me every now and then too! He is like a sponge right now. He is so desperate to get out of the funk he's in that he'd try anything that was suggested.
I see a little bit of the new man coming out as well. He's become a little more relaxed and less intense even at work. He says that the fog that he's been in for the last few years is starting to lift. He is convinced that it was because the ow kept him in a constant state of confusion with their social calendar and the drama that she created. He's happy to have the peace and quiet of an empty house more than anything right now.
We've had a few dinner dates or maybe more like social interacting dates leaving the recent drama out of the conversations. He indicated on one occasion that it was a new beginning for us. He's no where near ready for a new beginning but it's nice to hear the words. The odd thing is that I have trained myself not to believe much of what he says so it means very little to me at this point.
I have patience and all the time in the world. Whether he joins me for the next 3+ decades isn't important any longer. I have my family, friends and gardens to keep me busy and content.
Me:57H:62 M:34T:35 2S,2D (grown nlah) BD:09/2012 visits M ow EA/PA?:10/2012 H moves out 06/2013
"Do not let the behavior of others destroy your inner peace." -Dalai Lama
T!!!! It's so nice to hear from you. I've come to the board on and off over the time I was MIA and always looked for your updates. I'm so happy to see that you've given up the lab coat and clipboard for your music!!! Nothing heals our soul faster than good music, imho.
Thanks for the post on Narcissism. I find this subject very fascinating. I haven't tried to go to the Women's Aid forum yet but I plan to check it out. The human mind is so fragile. It's amazing what another human being is capable of doing. The book that I read didn't go very deeply into addiction and the part it plays in the abuse so I am anxious to ready more about this. Thanks for stopping by to post.
Me:57H:62 M:34T:35 2S,2D (grown nlah) BD:09/2012 visits M ow EA/PA?:10/2012 H moves out 06/2013
"Do not let the behavior of others destroy your inner peace." -Dalai Lama
He has to set the pace and work through this on his own. While it's not easy watching someone you have spent over 35 years with suffer, it has to be that way. I'm starting to see why that's so important. It dawned on me that just as with children, we have to let go so they can learn and find their own way. How else can they grow up and learn to deal with the problems and issues of life!
He is back at the other house for the most part. Since the first 2 nights after the crazy woman was incarcerated (I love to say that) he has stayed here only a few other times. He's been traveling for his work quite a bit so he's been out of town a lot lately.
As to whether he'll stay in the house until it sells? I am hoping that he does. I have encouraged him to do so. In my opinion he needs time alone to not only process the mess he got himself into but to heal as well. He calls a lot more often which is okay with me. If I'm busy or just don't want to talk I don't answer and will return his calls when I get time. Like you and many others here, I've gotten use to being alone and most of the time I enjoy it. I don't like my routine disrupted by unexpected knocks at the door! LOL
I gave him a key to the garage several months ago so he can drop things off and pick up tools as he needs without having to bother me or wait until I'm home. Other than that, I've gotten my patience shovel out and am watching behaviors for signs that his sanity has returned. HA!
Me:57H:62 M:34T:35 2S,2D (grown nlah) BD:09/2012 visits M ow EA/PA?:10/2012 H moves out 06/2013
"Do not let the behavior of others destroy your inner peace." -Dalai Lama
He has to set the pace and work through this on his own. While it's not easy watching someone you have spent over 35 years with suffer, it has to be that way. I'm starting to see why that's so important. It dawned on me that just as with children, we have to let go so they can learn and find their own way. How else can they grow up and learn to deal with the problems and issues of life!
Good stuff right there ^^^^
It's good to hear you sound so grounded, seeing and accepting reality as it is...
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
Thanks for stopping by! I apologize for running away without responding to your post. I read and followed the links to other info on the topic of PD and Narcissism. Thank you so much for posting the link.
In your signature you say that your h said that he must see where the ow leads. I wish I could give my h your h's email. He could tell him where it will lead! LOL I heard something very similar from my h 2 years ago. I am sorry that you're dealing with this but from I've read in your posts you are doing very well. I will start from the beginning or your threads and read through.
I feel like I need to stay connected here and I do read occasionally but not as much as I would like. There are so many new names on here in just the past 4 months since I've been away.
I'll post my update here shortly.
Me:57H:62 M:34T:35 2S,2D (grown nlah) BD:09/2012 visits M ow EA/PA?:10/2012 H moves out 06/2013
"Do not let the behavior of others destroy your inner peace." -Dalai Lama
It's been 4 months since I've come here to update. Where to begin..
We had a really nice Christmas with the children and grandchildren. H participated, was socially appropriate (lol) and showed no signs of stress. He stayed the night and didn't leave until they had all departed the next day. He commented on how much fun he had and how great it was to have everyone together.
A few days later he suggested that we spend an afternoon looking at new cars. I had been looking at a more economical car for myself but thought I'd wait until mid 2015 to buy. He decided he liked the model that I was looking at and ends up buying not 1 but 2 of them. One for each of us.
A week or so later he decides that we should take a vacation in January. 12 days in a warm climate!! Ahh, yes. What we both need, warmth and sunshine. He makes the reservations and we're set to go. He's very excited and I am cautiously optimistic. It feels to me as if he's looking for something to ease the pain and spending money was the way to do it.
He's up and down with what he wants to do. He asks me what I think about selling MY house and moving to xxx. I let him know that I am happy living here, might consider it but remind him that D2 is settled in her job and apartment here and that would be a major upset for her. As I said that I was thinking that there's no way I'm moving away from my comfortable and peaceful life with an MLCer!!!! He starts to look for houses in that town. He shows me a few and asks what I think. I politely tell him that I like them but ask him a few questions that might make him think about what it would be like to live there! This town is one that he and I looked at 8 years ago when we were looking for land to build our new home. We decided against it because of the distance to the city and our family. I asked him if he considered renting there to see how he would like it. He thought that was a great idea and wondered why he didn't think of it.
I believe he had contact with Twinkle Twat and that it didn't go well. He went into a funk again and used work as an excuse to cancel out trip. I should have just gone without him! He sunk pretty low and I asked him if he was still doing his group therapy. Nope. Asked him if he has considered IC. Nope, but a few days later he told me that he had been thinking about what I said and was looking into a Therapist. He asked if I could help him find one that would be covered by his insurance. I found 2 men and 2 women Psychologist/Psychiatrists. He wanted me to decide whether he should see a man or woman. No help from me! He did a phone interview with two of them and decided to see one of the women. His first appointment was in early February. After a few weeks he shared some of what they talk about. He said that he's hearing a lot of the same things from her that he heard from me. Not sure what he's talking about but I guess that is good because he thanks me all the time for "hanging in there with him".
He was so vulnerable. I found that listening was about the only thing that I could do. I had a difficult time not voicing my opinions so I said very little. Asking a few questions that I know would get him thinking is seemed to work at that point.
During one of the talks that we had during that time he tearfully told me that he met the ow at a vulnerable time. He even pin-pointed when his "transition" began. Just as I mentioned in one of my first threads. It began in 2010-11 while he was reading "The Artist's Way". He said that he wished he could go back and change it all and that he had never met "that woman". He knew that it would change his life forever and not it in a good way. Also that he felt weak and couldn't say no. He didn't use the word confused but indicated that it was like he wasn't in control of his own mind. (Those darn Aliens!)
Although he's feeling better and stronger about the "loss" of the ow, he's no where near the end of his journey. We went from his statement that "we have a chance for a new beginning" to the real possibility of D! Here's a peek into my experience with what the MLC thinks and feels as he/she is trying to find their way out of the tunnel.
Several weeks after starting therapy....
"I'll never be the same. This has changed my life forever."
"I need to move away. There are too many bad memories here." Then a few days later says how comfortable he is in my house and how he has such fond memories, how much fun we have, that I really understand him, blah, blah.
"I want you to move on with your life. You can spend your time taking care of D1 and D2 ."
(D1 is a fully functioning adult, D2 is disabled. He never mentioned the 2 boys.)
" I'm not good for anyone. I've done too much damage (think he was referring to our R).
"You should let go of me". To which I responded...I have a life without you now and while I miss what we had, I had to let go for my own sake. He responded, I know you did. ?????
"I can't believe that you're even talking to me after what I did."
More recently he's been in a better mood and has a "plan"...
"I'm going to move to xxx, I'll rent or buy a small house. You will always have a key to wherever I live and are welcome to visit anytime."
"You've been so great about everything.
"I'm finished with work. It's not about work any longer, it's about my life AFTER I leave work."
And then there are his thoughts yesterday (Sunday)....
"When I file (know he meant S and ultimately D), will you come and visit me?"
He laughs after he says that. I must have given him a look that he read well! I jokingly said probably not and left it there. That started a whole other conversation that was light and with some humor thrown in but I knew he was looking to see how I felt about D as well as where he would stand with me after. I gave him little to no indication about what or how his life would be after he moved nearly 2 hours away.
At one point I did tell him that I thought that we had come up with a good Post Nuptial agreement that would work for me. He thought for a few seconds and didn't say that it wouldn't work for him but said that he needs to take care of any legal matters before he leaves work. (He has an excellent legal plan at his disposal while he's employed.) I didn't agree or disagree but stuck my neck out a little and asked him about making such a big decision because of a deadline. He had shared awhile ago what his therapist told him about taking his time when making major decisions. I think he likes to throw things out to shock me and get me to react. I didn't bite.
The next comment confirmed that he's still out there in MLC-land...
"Who knows, maybe we'll be remarried in a few years".
I changed the subject, we had lunch and he left. About an hour later he called me. I didn't answer. I was busy shopping with my daughter. He texted me asking if I wanted to have coffee. After I dropped her off, I answered his text with a light-hearted comment. We met at a coffee shop. He didn't bring anything up from earlier. We took a drive, something that we use to do every Sunday and kept it light. No R talk. He kept bringing up funny things from our past sort of a walk down memory lane. He seems to be trying to figure something out. He looks at me sometimes like he's trying to read my mind. After coffee and the drive I got into my car to leave. He was standing outside my car and said something that he use to say when I had my old car. I'll save you all from that but it was a real compliment. I'm taking most of what he says as MLC b.s. , a little bit of schmoozing and am watching his actions. They definitely aren't matching his actions.
He's been giving me lots of hugs and some real kisses. He tells me that he loves me occasionally. A few days ago he was listening in on a business call that I was on. After I got off the phone he told me one of the things he's always liked about me is that I'm not afraid to stand up to anyone and that he respects me for that. I have ZERO expectations. For his sake, I hope he finds peace in his life. I'm not sure if I agree with him that too much damage has been done but he may be right. I haven't lost respect for him nor have I given up totally that he can heal and come through this a whole person again.
I do need some help/ideas on how to keep him at arms length yet let him know that I haven't given up on us. My gut tells me to go dark so that I don't say or do the wrong thing! LOL! It's extremely difficult for me to listen without commenting. He is on to all of the validation statements. He uses them in his work and on me too! I know it and he knows it. I'm trying to be as selective as I can on which conversations I will engage in. He knows and has called me out on it a lot saying, "I know you're being careful what you say. I want you to tell me how you feel about this." Busted!!!! There are times when I say that I have to think more about this or that I think we should discuss this another time. All I really want to do is be myself and tell him how I really feel! LOL
I'm okay with whatever he decides...Separation, Divorce or just going off to live somewhere else for awhile. I have no need to do initiate any legal proceedings, I don't feel stuck as I'm living my life doing exactly as I want. The only thing missing is someone to share it with.
Me:57H:62 M:34T:35 2S,2D (grown nlah) BD:09/2012 visits M ow EA/PA?:10/2012 H moves out 06/2013
"Do not let the behavior of others destroy your inner peace." -Dalai Lama
WOW! He's still having moments of confusion and clarity. I do think he's starting to move forward a bit, but he's still clinging to that cocoon and doesn't really want to leave the comfort of his fantasy world.
You've been handling your situation quite well. The only change I would make is to not be so readily available to him. How is he going to learn that he misses you when you aren't there? It's okay to meet up w/him periodically, but limit those meet ups just a wee bit.
Continue to listen, don't offer up advice unless he asks for it. After all, he's got to grow up, make his own mistakes and learn from them. He's got to see you as his wife, not his mother.
To change the subject, how are you doing? What are you doing to keep yourself busy? Are you doing fun things? How is D2 doing living on her own?
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
