Would you object to sharing the texts between you and your wife. It will help me see your communication style.
As a note--You just did it again. The passive/aggressive aggression hidden behind the veil of emotional support:
"She took off and left town. Just got done texting her and let her know I'm glad she had a good time. Old me would have made some drama about it, I did not (one of my 180s). She sent me some pics and I'm glad she got a break. Still I'll ask her at some point to let me know next time before she leaves the state."
You want us to agree your wife was out-of-line for leaving town.
FunDad, she has filed for divorce so technically she doesn't have to give you any information about where she goes or what she does. Providing information is an expectation for people in a relationship. She is dissolving her relationship with you.
Yes, it would be considerate if she kept you abreast of her plans. But her only responsibility is to make provisions for the children. She has zero responsibility to you.
You see...this is what a divorce is. It means, "I am no longer required to provide any information to you about my life."
Yes, you can ask that she let know the next time she leaves but be prepared for her to say "it's none of your business."
I'm sorry. I know it hurts. I know it is frustrating. And I know its not fair.
But, your statement also sends an alarm:
"Old me would have made some drama about it..."
When you say "old you would have made some drama about it..." have you both danced this dance before?
Since you have identified your reaction (and changed your behavior) do you know what triggered her?
If she engaged in this behavior to get a specific reaction from you...changing your behavior won't do any good unless you know what triggered her and here is why:
She will keep escalating until she gets the reaction she wants. Anger is a secondary emotion and usually caused by unmet expectations. If she is trying to create situations where you get angry it is more likely than not she believes she has an unmet expectation and blames you.
You are right about her leaving town is now her prerogative. I have no say in that or input. I think there is an issue however when I bring kids back and she's already gone without telling me or some of the kids. I would not do that to her, and I'd appreciate her not doing that to me.
Your advice about not being judgemental at all about has opened up a window that has allowed me to perform some acts of service for her. She let me come in to her room today and check the foot that she injured on her trip. (Thanks)
Here is our latest text exchange: m:Do you need help getting to urgent care today? W:Hmmm maybe. W:We have no food here and I can't LEAVE TO GO GET ANY... M:I have another lasagna I can bring after church. Y'all need breakfast stuff too? Yes. Apparently. Urgent care doesn't open til 1. I can't put as much weight on it today as yesterday M:I'll see if I can drop by real quick before we go to church. W:So maneuvering through the kitchen is something I haven't done yet M:Dang. Need a wheel chair? Thanks No m:I know where one is. W:I need food. And I need to go hunt down meds. You gonna bring food or not? M:Yes W:Thank you. M:You are welcome. W:Is today your day to visit with kids?
Me:40 W:39 M:Dec 95 Split: Jul 14 W Filed: 9/16/14 Several Children (including adopted)
You are right. The children’s safety can never be at risk. If she leaves and is not home when you bring the children back—this is a serious problem. It is irresponsible and must be addressed.
Okay…let’s discuss the text message conversation.
I don’t read the texts as a positive thing or a negative thing. But the tone and messaging is interesting. You said “Old me would have made some drama about it” and your part of the conversation was a 180. But was her part of the conversation normal for her?
If so, it’s very interesting. Either she escalates immediately or she is very expressive. Which is it?
When I ask if she is “expressive” I mean is do you believe she appreciating the irony of the situation? (i.e.: I can’t walk and we have no food in here…and I can’t leave to get any…and now the children WILL STARVE!!! Okay not really—but ugh! This situation is the pitts! Not only am I trapped in the house with no potato chips—I lack the physical ability to get them! Can life get any worse???)
Or does she escalate immediately? (i.e. What is wrong with you? We have no food in the house and the children and whining! If you have enough common sense to realize I can’t drive to urgent care…why can’t you have enough common sense to realize I can’t go grocery shopping?)
So my first question is: Based on her previous behavior--How did you read the all caps portion “We have no food here and I can't LEAVE TO GO GET ANY...”
Was she beginning to escalate or was she being playful?
If she was being playful…you should have played back. But, if she was escalating, I think you handled it perfectly.
The next thing I noticed was she gave you opportunities to voice a concern about her health but you dodged it both times.
W: I can't put as much weight on it today as yesterday W: So maneuvering through the kitchen is something I haven't done yet
She was reaching out and you should acknowledged her. For example, the conversation could have been:
W: I can't put as much weight on it today as yesterday. You: Thank you for telling me this or I would have assumed you were getting better. What can I do to help you?
W: So maneuvering through the kitchen is something I haven't done yet You: I can understand how maneuvering through the kitchen would be tough. I know this incident has made life difficult for you and I would like to lighten your load. What I can do to make this happen?
By doing the above you have done several things:
(1) You have acknowledged her feelings. (2) You have explained that--if she tells you her feelings--her feelings will be acknowledged in a positive manner. (3) You have offered help. It is in her court whether she accepts. (Now—You are going to say you that you offered help when you offered a wheelchair. Offering a wheelchair is not offering help. It is offering a solution, not help.)
What you said was, “I’ll get you a wheelchair so you can maneuver around the kitchen.” You gave a very specific solution to the wide-open comment of: “maneuvering through the kitchen is something I haven't done yet…”
What she may have been saying was, “It would be nice if you came over and hung out with us.” But you will never know this because you provided a solution that she didn’t ask for. You may have killed an offer to hang out with the family without even knowing it.
I want you to try something the next time you have an exchange with your wife (text, phone, email, etc.):
Start the conversation by expressing concern and then ask about her. Her health, her job, her family…anything related to her. Then pay attention to her response.
Does she ask for something in her response? Does she express gratitude in her response? Does she express anger in her response?
An example of the conversation would be:
“I’ve been worried about you all day. I wanted to send a text to see how you are feeling.”
If she says:
“Thanks for checking. I’m doing better.” This is a gratitude response. It allows for non-threatening conversation. The correct reply would be, “Great to hear. I worry about you.”
If she says, “I feel worse now than I did this morning. It’s getting really rough.” This is a request response. She needs something from you. The correct reply is, “I’m glad I checked. What can I do for you?” You want to ask “what” you can do not “if” you can do.
If she says, “Why do you suddenly care now?” This is an anger response. This says you mishandled the situation and need damage control. The correct response is, “My concern isn’t sudden. I am always concerned about you. I truly apologize that I made you feel as if I haven’t cared. Nothing could be further from the truth.”
ME: 38 BF: 40 T: 10y, no kids, no M (by choice) BD: 7/14/14, BF admits to PA, wants out, lies about new R. 10/1/14: I move out, BF lies about move in with OW 12/4/14: OW confronted, reveals all the lies
Wow, more great feedback. Thank you! Today has been interesting. She sprang her foot. I dropped a drink by the clinic for her while she waiting at the Dr. My son drove her so she would not have to. She was appreciative of the drink (I know her favorites).
I see your point on the wheelchair solution. I've always got the fix-it hat close by, unfortunately. However, in the past when she broke her ankle, we used a wheel chair to get her around the house.
Apparently her foodstamp card quit working and she has not enough money for food. She went to the store, and had to leave the cart. I saw the food situation earlier today and they have food. I did offer to take some groceries over for her. No response on that, so I will take some basics for her.
I offered to help get kids to bed to which she said: "No. Thanks." (Actually this would be a new practice, I normally pray with them when I'm there at night but I don't normally help with getting them to bed).
Escalation vs. Expression - It's Escalation. This is normal for us. Rarely are expressive (unless I'm missing it).
Eliminating Drama - I considered asking MIL where she went, and express my concearn about the situation. This only would have made things worse. Instead, MIL contacted me, and expressed her concearn. I actually helped calm the situation by reassuring her kids were ok and in good hands, reducing Drama.
So I just tried your suggestion (at the end):
W: S10 is being a brat as is D12. I'm injured and pissed off that I had to ducking come get them.
m: Hmm...How can I help with that?
W: No idea I need to go to freaking bed and you got kids so late... I need to get several into showers.
m: I can have D7 & D8 back about 7:30. S14 wants to stay with me till morning. Would it help for me to Hang out and help w/bedtime?
W: No. Thanks.
M: Well, I'm worried about that foot. <waiting for response>
P.S. Clarification: She lined up a baby sitter for kids when I dropped them off. It was someone I don't know, but the kids know her. She actually did a great job during the week and her and I got along just fine. My wife did leave my number for her.
Me:40 W:39 M:Dec 95 Split: Jul 14 W Filed: 9/16/14 Several Children (including adopted)
At first you dropped the ball because you asked “How can I help” instead of recognizing she was already asking for help. When you said, “How can I help” it sounded sarcastic.
But then you did a great job of recognizing the anger response and offering solutions and empathy. As a note, always provide empathy first.
“I’m worried about that foot. Tell you what, I can have D7 & D8 back about 7:30. S14 wants to stay with me till morning. Would it help for me to hang out and help with bedtime?”
Ok. Today has been a good day, I needed that. Answer to many prayers, that's for sure. Thanks Hope
text conv continued:
me: I'm headed over.
w: Ok. Just drop them off. I'll deal.
w: But maybe you could pick up kids in the morning?
I arrived at her house with groceries and prayed with kids. There was no hostility from her, and she even mentioned some trains she saw on her trip - this came up because the kids and I played with mine today, on the kitchen table (bachelor mode, lol). Anyway, we talked about how the setup she saw could work in our house, so pleasant conversation.
We then discussed the next day and she said it would help her if I took kids to school, so I will. We have a normal schedule but this one is an extra.
Our D process is about to enter mediation. I was able to request more time to gather information, which was needed, but it does give it more time. All it will take is for her to withdraw her original petition for divorce for us to start back tracking. How do I make that easy for her?
Me:40 W:39 M:Dec 95 Split: Jul 14 W Filed: 9/16/14 Several Children (including adopted)
Me 47 - W 35 M 9 - T 10 2 Daughters - 7 & 9 Discovery of EA- 8/4/14 S - 8/5/15 D mentioned - 9/11/14 R & Piecing - 3/17/15 Regard one another as more important than yourselves. - Philippians 2:3
FundDad, what is the time frame for divorce in your state? By that I mean when does the divorce petition become final?
Don’t discuss the divorce petition. Let her question her decision about filing the divorce. If you “take care” of the situation she doesn’t have ownership into the solution. She started the process so she has to take ownership into the solution. She knows this.
Here is what I want you to do for tomorrow:
She said it would help if you took the kids to school. Good. She is reaching out. So you are going to take this one step further.
What else needs to be done that she hasn’t asked you to do?
You said that you feel you became a “big child in her eyes to manage.” Okay. Now is your chance to show you have grown up. And a grown up recognizes problems and finds solutions without being told.
What will she need tomorrow? And how can you proactively take care of it in a seamless manner? Remember, she takes care of things every day without you noticing. Start noticing.
For example, from this day forward you should be aware that when you bring the children home late she has to get them showers and to bed. It is difficult to manage this if she has to go to bed early. Offer a solution the next time you pick them up so she is aware that you are aware of the stress placed on her.
The goal is to get her off the anger train. Based on the last couple of text messages you set her off pretty easily.
I think she feels you are obtuse. So we need to change her opinion of you. I think once you start showing you pay attention and effectively problem solve she will allow herself to relax.
