The dynamic of your xh and how he has somebody to feed the anger, but not help him release it. I know that dynamic well, Mighty. And it just seems to prolong things from where I sit.
AJ makes a really good point. It's so much easier to get honest with yourself when you don't have someone else invested in maintaining and feeding the anger.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
The dynamic of your xh and how he has somebody to feed the anger, but not help him release it. I know that dynamic well, Mighty. And it just seems to prolong things from where I sit.
AJ makes a really good point. It's so much easier to get honest with yourself when you don't have someone else invested in maintaining and feeding the anger.
OK, AJ and Heather. I need help with this one. I am not sure I totally follow. Can you explain? Sometimes my blonde hair gets in the way of my brain waves. What do you mean "somebody to feed the anger"? Do you mean hww in his ear?
He has someone to feed the fire when it begins to die down. So does Smokey...in those moments when our spouses may have some clarity...they are with individuals who have a serious investment in their remaining angry.
That's not to say that our spouses aren't responsible...they are still the ones choosing to remain stuck in the muck.
But, I think what AJ is pointing out, when there's an OW or OM in the scenario, it makes things all the more trickier and full of snares.
In my case, add a big dose of drugs and the quagmire gets really thick and muddy.
Bottom Line: They are wading in molasses. And, they have someone who pours more into the vat when it runs low.
Last edited by LoisB; 11/03/1412:00 AM.
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Thanks so much. I am feeling like I am on the right path. This list consists of things I know xh is aware of. There are others he doesn't know about, but this list pertains specifically to what xh sees or knows about. The rest is all up to his imagination. Whether he is thinking about me or not.
Speaking of... his name came up tonight. I get a little agitated, but I am getting better. But here is what I was thinking as I realized it was bothering me. I am pretty much fine as long as I am not "dealing" with him. It is when there is contact or communication with me or the kids that really makes me feel the anxiety. I can feel myself moving on, otherwise.
So I was thinking, why does he want to continue to keep contact with me? Either he does not care at all (so why does he bother?) or if he does care at all, why does he contact me? Isn't it easier for him to not communicate with me so he can focus on his new life? I find it easier to move on with no contact. I just don't get why he wants to communicate with me, even if it is negative.
Here is the AMAZING news (maybe not amazing for anyone... but for me!) When I read the posts from AJ, uR and Heather today, it was a whole new experience for me. I felt like a big kid! Like I'm growing up! I don't know if you are posting to me differently or if I perceive things differently.
I will try to explain.
Before when I would read posts, I felt like I was an inch tall. Like a little kid who didn't know anything. I was so inexperienced in this, confused, lost, hurt. I felt so clueless. Everything seemed overwhelming, and I just felt so small.
Today when I read the posts, I felt more grown up. Like being talked to like friend and not a little clueless girl. I feel like I have understood the advice all along, but now I feel it. I am not saying you treated me like a clueless little girl, I just mean, I felt like one. It's like I've graduated or something and now entering higher education.
Maybe I'm just a weird-o.
Thanks guys... NY was great. Chilly?! Huh! I'm from Buffalo.
Oh, so s17 got to my brothers (20 miles from my house) around 4 this morning. He wanted to go home, but didn't have a ride. He called xh for a ride. I can't believe he called him(I wasn't upset or anything, just surprised since s17 hasn't talked to him an a couple weeks), but he did.
s17 said xh asked him if he read the email. S17 said no. Xh asked him if he was going to, s17 said, "Probably not."
Apparently xh didn't even mention the surgery or anything, just asked about the email. Of course, it does not surprise me. He has yet the b@lls to talk about anything to anyone's face.
(I am so glad I didn't waste energy on that email. He is crazy. He is looking for anything to put blame on me. ANYTHING! I am so glad I have stepped out of Crazyland. It is such a different view from the outside. A much better view!)
Then s17 went to sleep in the car. Xh had to drop off s17's friend first. After they dropped off the friend, xh said angrily to s17, "So did you forget about my birthday or chose to ignore it?" S17 told me he actually did forget and mumbled something to xh and told him he was too tired to talk about it.
It's kind of odd, Mighty. When your ex puts the lens on you, you feel the pressure. I know I did for way too long. But..
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Speaking of... his name came up tonight. I get a little agitated, but I am getting better. But here is what I was thinking as I realized it was bothering me. I am pretty much fine as long as I am not "dealing" with him. It is when there is contact or communication with me or the kids that really makes me feel the anxiety. I can feel myself moving on, otherwise.
Yep. He feels it too. He feels you moving on as well. Your actions change. Your responses change. If it's one thing I learned from the experience? You can't hide intent and emotions from your ex. They are soooooo tuned into the emotions and what you're doing they are able to see right through. And if they don't, they'll think the worst anyway and make something up One of the reasons it took me longer was the approach I took. I was the last in line to deal with my emotions. I got a later start so to speak. I had others to worry about and a lot of other things going on that I prioritized higher. It didn't help that my ex and her husband kept harassing me (still). Eventually, I realized I needed to do it for me. The rest will have to sink or swim (they swim). As that realization grew, I kept asking the same questions you did below. Know what? I figured out it doesn't matter. Why? Because even though my ex left, blamed me yada yada, I needed to be the one to "leave" her. For my own sanity and well being. Literally. As I started taking actions to do that, she tried even harder to put me under the microscope and apply pressure. Ever seen a seriously rage-bent person try to be happy and vent their rage on a person they cast aside? It's kind of funny really. The more I ignored the rages and accusations, the harder she tried.
And the better I got. The more I could regain my perspective on things. I could look back and see the oddities, the strangeness, the lies, the anger, the...yada.
The point is, you need that distance. You need to regain your perspective. You need to re-learn some things because they were damaged in the BD. One step after another, you put things back in their place.
Eventually you'll stop competing with him for parent of the year. You'll stop trying to prove you were "right" or that you were the victim or that...well, any of it. You'll live your life without the specter of him in it. He'll take his rightful place in your past. Your emotions that are taking so long to process right now will begin to be processed faster and faster. Emotions you thought you put to bed, will come back for one last time before they are put down permanently. It's just how it seems to work. But it will not be a sad thing per se. It'll be you moving on your journey.
While you have further to go yet, you are much further than you were. You seemed to have noticed. That's a good thing, because goodness knows you've been working hard. Don't let up on gaining the perspective. It'll come.
I strongly suggest UR's advice to determine how you're going to deal with whatever comes at you. So far you've reacted mostly. What would it look like if you planned how you were going to act, vs react? If you had the perspective that the source of the accusations and strife is a bubble off-center?
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So I was thinking, why does he want to continue to keep contact with me? Either he does not care at all (so why does he bother?) or if he does care at all, why does he contact me? Isn't it easier for him to not communicate with me so he can focus on his new life? I find it easier to move on with no contact. I just don't get why he wants to communicate with me, even if it is negative.
That kind of thinking will lead you down a dark path. Just so you know. Kind of like a healing wound, you'll keep feeling a "twinge" of something every time you need to bring him up in conversation. i.e. old friends, family, etc. Just when you think you have a handle on it, a family member will bring something up about it - in a way that makes one think they are trying to figure it out. I had that happen the other day with an old friend - he was floored by what I had to say, but he let me change the subject quickly. I'm sick and tired of the story. I told him little, but it was way more than I felt like talking about. Literally a few sentences. I felt nothing about it. It was more like a news reporter reporting a story. Family knows to almost never bring it up, even jokingly, although they can. Some of it is kind of funny when you think about it
Why do they hang on and push away at the same time? Maybe somebody smarter will answer that one. From what I've seen it's because of control and anger. But maybe there's more to it that I just can't see right now. <shrug>
Buffalo? Home of the flying buffaloes? Where they get the wings?
Peace, AJ
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK Put the glass down... "Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
Mighty - I didn't realise that you had felt 'small' - sorry about that!
Anyway, here is my take on one of the reasons we get agitated - what we have gone through/are going through still in some cases, is a kind of trauma. The abruptness of the severance, the shocking change in behaviour
(And yes, I know it was apparently a long time coming, but most of us didn't see it). If you were blindsided, like most of us then you are suffering from a form of PTSD
Add in the verbal of abuse from someone who was our closest friend and lover for many many years, and it would be really odd if we could deal 'normally' with them.
I differ from AJ - in that for me, understanding what was going on really helped me to heal. I don't think one way is better, just that people approach things differently.
In any situation we normally try and see the other person's point of view, and try and seek accommodation. MLCers do not tend to respond well to this (We are not at home to Mr Reasonable!) and so it can help to understand their strange mental processes.
We will never 'understand' in the sense that the WHY may always elude us, but the knowing about their confusion, its sources, and the things it may drive them to do can help (some of) us to take it less personally. To see it as a process.
This is not the same thing as obsessing about it, and I do not think you are doing this. Their behaviour is weird by most standards, and as Job has said, a bit of them still thinks we will be there for them. Our moving on is profoundly disturbing.
Their behaviour is weird by most standards, and as Job has said, a bit of them still thinks we will be there for them. Our moving on is profoundly disturbing.
We very much agree with this ^^^ (and on the rest)
AJ
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK Put the glass down... "Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
I see both your points and really agree with both. I no longer try to get hung up on everything. I'm detached. I don't worry about the little things. However, like you said bea, sometimes it just helps to understand some of the mlc behaviors. Things that I've read about typical mlc behaviors and the reasons for them seem to help me. Not really in the sense that I'm obsessed over them and NEED to know. But, so I can rationalize what he may be going through and move along my path.
I really try not to let his actions affect me, and I am doing much better in that department. When I do react, I am reflecting and trying to not make the same mistake. I have thought about what and how I will make changes in my behavior as to not react.
AJ, I'm sorry that you still have to endure the projections and blame. That stinks. I guess it does become easier to let it bounce off, but it still isn't something that one should have to deal with. From the time you have spent helping me, I can tell that you are a grounded, sincere, caring, wonderful person. You don't deserve that. I'm know you have learned a lot along the way... too bad these mlcers don't always do the same. So sad.
I am acknowledging that I'm not really worried about the parenting thing anymore. I can't worry about his position as a parent. He also has no grounds to judge me. I am doing my best. I was a mess for a little bit, but I still put my kids first. Now, I feel so much stronger and I am on it with my kids. I'm not worried about what he says. What does it matter?
bea, yeah, I was blindsided. Twice. I think that's where my extreme panic and anxiety come from when I come across him unexpectedly. I think that has been my fear of seeing her unexpectedly, too. Because I know the intensity of my emotions and how I had felt I didn't know how to control them. Thanks for making that connection for me. Now, I am getting a plan. Hopefully this will help keep my emotions in check.
Just a quick question about the posts above. I feel that xh really does not care about me moving on or not. I feel like his focus has been mostly on his r with the kids. Am I missing something or is it just something he would never admit to?
Rough draft of my plan:
1. He will not get me to react. I know he is trying many avenues; not gonna happen.
2. I will not feed into anger. I will remove myself from a situation where this is happening. (Excuse me. I am not engaging in this.)
3. I will ignore unnecessary communication via text or email.
4. I was able to block his work and personal email address from my work email. (I did this after receiving inappropriate email he sent to s17 on Thursday to my work email.)
5. I will not answer phone calls. If caught off guard- I will calmly respond, but not engage in unnecessary communication.
6. In public- I will prepare myself and act calmly with my head high.
7. If caught off guard in public- stay calm. Think before reacting. YOU DID NOTHING WRONG! Keep mouth shut. Slow down movements. Be calm, confident. Don't even look.
8. Opportunity for co-parent- can't happen right now. Not unless absolutely necessary. I will not have my communication twisted to be used against me (as was done in email).
9. Regarding surgery- if attacked or blamed, "It's fine that you think that."
10. If my character is attacked- ignore or "I'm sorry you feel that way about me." Then deploy.
11. If I run into her- STFU! Stay calm! Head high. If I say something... "You have no idea the damage you've done to a family and yourself. You need to pray God forgives you." But, I am sure I won't. (I am just trying to think of something that, just in case, I start to lose it, I have control over what comes out. Because Lord knows, I've imagined many, many other things coming out. I don't want that to happen. Maybe that's where her prayers have been- if she's smart.)
12. Focus on being the best mother I can be. Supportive, strong, loving, funny.
13. Work hard at my job. Stay focused and do best by my kiddos. Give them what they deserve.
14. Get my house together.
15. Have fun.
16. Meet new people.
17. Enjoy and appreciate the small (but most important) things.
19. I will not badmouth xh or hww. Their actions speak of their character. I need to focus on me- Not them. ( I will, of course, vent here!!!! I don't think there is a way around that. Sorry)
20. If, for some reason, I do have to speak with xh. I will be cordial. I will be neutral. I will remain zero. Even if I have to make a point, it will be zero. I will not show emotion.
Today, upon realization that it is, in fact, November, I could feel a twinge of nervousness (or something). Who knows when this baby is coming. It will be sooner than later.
I am realizing, as it approaches, what this really means. We are so done. He will be so intertwined in a different family. His total commitment and devotion will be there. I will no longer be considered his family. Hww will see him as her family. His devotion to her and her kids. Wow. Unreal.
BUT! I'm OK. Just passing thoughts of reality. I am happy being alone. I don't want him here. But, the thoughts are still not entirely easy. They don't linger too long, luckily. I must make a plan for Wednesday. If that baby comes Wednesday... wouldn't that be something.
