Mindsin - pt. 5 (back to basics)

[25yearsmlc]

Yes, you are all right on.

Right now, the interaction between my W and I is the best it's been probably since she came back from her 9 day trip in late sept/early oct.

Then why do you insist on sabotaging it? Do you notice that when things are good BUT not drama filled, you seem to want to do something odd to wreck it?

I have to wonder what that's about. I know she's with OM but that's not new. What is new is that it's a lot harder for her to see him, AND things with you are getting better.

For most people here, that's a great thing; for you, not so much.

Remember to act in accordance with your stated goal (= reconciliation) and

NOT how you feel at the moment.

[mindsin]

I don't know where she's going and I automatically ASSUMED that she's buying a plane ticket using family money to fly 2000 miles to see the OM. This was purely based on my W telling me (before the OM moved) that he will be flying back every two weeks. Well, this is only one week. Maybe he's the one who is flying back here again, or maybe they're rendezvousing somewhere in between.

Maybe it was that added reality that hit me hard today. I don't know. But like you said, she's still in a R with the OM. That's not new.

And she just came home a few minutes ago. What did she bring back with her? Three more shirts for me. I'm living in bizarro world.

[25yearsmlc]

I don't know where she's going and I automatically ASSUMED THE REST OF THIS PARAGRAPH


that she's buying a plane ticket using family money to fly 2000 miles to see the OM. This was purely based on my W telling me (before the OM moved) that he will be flying back every two weeks. Well, this is only one week. Maybe he's the one who is flying back here again, or maybe they're rendezvousing somewhere in between.

Maybe it was that added reality that hit me hard today. I don't know.

But like you said, she's still in a R with the OM. That's not new.

And she just came home a few minutes ago. What did she bring back with her? Three more shirts for me.

to ANY OTHER MAN HERE, that ^^^ would be SUCH HAPPY news!!

For YOU, however, she's "Strange" and you live in a "bizzaro world".
.
I'm living in bizarro world.

Try an attitude of gratitude. It surely cannot hurt. It'd be a 180 I suspect as well.

[mindsin]

Try an attitude of gratitude. It surely cannot hurt. It'd be a 180 I suspect as well.

I definitely show gratitude whenever she does things like this for me.

[mindsin]

Change of heart?

One of my biggest worries was my W's desire to relocate to Nashville, TN (the same place where the OM lives currently). She has indicated this to me very early on, and even suggested at one point to fly down there with me so we could check out the city and neighborhood. At that time, she also indicated that she wants our son to finish 2nd grade here, so the plan to relocate would be a gradual one (about 1 year). She also said she planned to sell our house in the spring of 2015. She also told her parents about these plans, and she and the OM even offered to buy a house with a detached suite so they can live together, help out with the kids, etc.

My FIL and my W were driving together yesterday to meet a realtor (some paperwork for his rental apartment) and my FIL commented to her that if she doesn't move to Nashville, that he wants to keep his apartment. My W replied back, "Who said I'm moving to Nashville? If you want, you can move there. I'm not moving there."

[25yearsmlc]

Whatever you do, do NOT remind her of her previous comments.

Don't force her to "renounce" anything or you might end up forcing her to cement those decisions!

Meanwhile, I'm crossing my fingers for you!

[mindsin]

Sent her an e-mail today

"Thank you again for the shirts. I appreciate it. Wherever you're going this weekend, please be safe. I will make sure the kids have an enjoyable weekend."

Her reply:

"You are welcome. Send me pictures of them."

[mindsin]

This afternoon, I also passed an exam to earn one of my industry-related certifications. I sent my W a text to let her know.

Me: I just passed my first certification exam!

W: That's amazing!!!
W: We can go celebrate as a family next weekend.

[25yearsmlc]

I Hope you are happy about that - b/c I sure am!

Congrats and yes, it's a huge positive that SHE said what she said. Savor this Mindsinks, and for goodness sake, stop the obsessive mind reading about OM.

If I were you, I would not have mentioned "wherever she is going to be safe" b/c to me (and I believe to her as well), it comes off as yet another remark you are making to show that you suspect/"know" she is with him and regardless you are SO NOBLE that hey, she should feel guilty...and face it, that IS the result and outcome you want.

Which means you are still manipulating her to control the outcome.

You are usually and mostly on the right track lately, but if you could truly STFU about OM and recognize when you are pretending to be quiet but not, it would help you finesse this completely.

You need NOT tell your wife how YOU will "make sure the kids are happy" (as if 'someone has to')

NOR how you HOPE she is safe....I cannot believe you don't recognize your own motives when they are transparent. I'm convinced you are resenting her, and it SHOWS...

You do this more than you care to admit, but what concerns me is that you deny what seems obvious . Yes, I am saying you said it b/c you are annoyed. But I'm betting you want to deny that to me.

You want to say NO, it's "ALL b/c I hope she is safe and NOT b/c I hope she feels torn and guilt ridden"...but to that, I'd say "I don't think so."

(See how much time we save by mind reading?)

Here are a few questions I wanted to ask you before.

Can you recall ever feeling guilt ridden or ashamed of yourself when you hired the prostitutes? How did you rationalize doing it again and again?

Did your wife's tears or anger ever affect you -- and if so, how?

Was it her threat to divorce you that finally got you to stop? What was it?

what was Your parent's marriage like and,

how was Forgiveness modeled in your childhood?

Thanks and again, congrats! I know how hard it can be to focus and achieve in times or turmoil so your powers of concentration are commendable!

[mindsin]

I Hope you are happy about that - b/c I sure am!

Congrats and yes, it's a huge positive that SHE said what she said. Savor this Mindsinks, and for goodness sake, stop the obsessive mind reading about OM.

If I were you, I would not have mentioned "wherever she is going to be safe" b/c to me (and I believe to her as well), it comes off as yet another remark you are making to show that you suspect/"know" she is with him and regardless you are SO NOBLE that hey, she should feel guilty...and face it, that IS the result and outcome you want.

Which means you are still manipulating her to control the outcome.

You are usually and mostly on the right track lately, but if you could truly STFU about OM and recognize when you are pretending to be quiet but not, it would help you finesse this completely.

You need NOT tell your wife how YOU will "make sure the kids are happy" (as if 'someone has to')

NOR how you HOPE she is safe....I cannot believe you don't recognize your own motives when they are transparent. I'm convinced you are resenting her, and it SHOWS...

You do this more than you care to admit, but what concerns me is that you deny what seems obvious . Yes, I am saying you said it b/c you are annoyed. But I'm betting you want to deny that to me.

You want to say NO, it's "ALL b/c I hope she is safe and NOT b/c I hope she feels torn and guilt ridden"...but to that, I'd say "I don't think so."

(See how much time we save by mind reading?)

I absolutely am resenting her, but I'm holding strong because there is a respository of self-blame that I use to fuel the internal justification of everything my W has been doing for the past 4+ months. That respository is slowly but surely being emptied. I understand that a lot can get lost in translation with written vs spoken language, and I can certainly understand your interpretation of how my words may have been perceived by my W. Here is where my head was at with regard to the above.

1. I did not want to simply ignore the e-mail. If my W tells me she's going away for a weekend, then I feel that I should at least acknowledge it. I didn't want to come off as "giving her the cold shoulder". The question then becomes, "HOW do I acknowledge it"? I felt that the part about wishing her a safe trip (wherever she is going) was a way for me to express to her that, "Hey, I still care for your well-being, and I do worry about you when you are away; but at the same time, I recognize that you don't want to tell me where you're going or who you will be with, so I will respect that. If these words are interpreted the way you say they were, then it's just that -- an interpretation. If my W and I weren't in this situation, then my words would have appeared perfectly "innocent", and that's exactly how I wrote it.

2. By telling her that I will make sure the kids have an enjoyable weekend, that was my way of telling her that I will always step up as a parent, regardless of what is going on between us. I was letting her know that the two things in this world that are the most precious to her will always be in good hands and safe with me.

That is how my words were intended. Whether or not she those words the way I intended, or took them the way you think she would have, is unknown.

Here are a few questions I wanted to ask you before.

Can you recall ever feeling guilt ridden or ashamed of yourself when you hired the prostitutes? How did you rationalize doing it again and again?

A little bit, but I never beat myself over it until 2011. I rationalized it in different ways. "What she doesn't know won't hurt her". "Men are simply wired this way". "I always come home to my W". "I don't want to go to my grave not having sampled as many different women (sexually) as possible and living out all the fantasies that my W will never be able to fulfil". "My W doesn't like sex, so this is her fault".

Did your wife's tears or anger ever affect you -- and if so, how?

In the beginning, it was simply a feeling of getting caught. It felt no different than when I was a teenager and my mom caught me with a Playboy magazine. It didn't truly hit me until that last time in 2011 when I felt that she was going to leave me, and she wrote me many lengthy e-mails questioning the meaning of the life she has been living with me, the house we live in, even the children we had together.

Was it her threat to divorce you that finally got you to stop? What was it?

That certainly helped. But honestly speaking, I still had urges to continue my ways. It was sheer will power to keep me away from that lifestyle. It wasn't until 2012 when I had my health scare that I made a commitment to change for good.

what was Your parent's marriage like and, how was Forgiveness modeled in your childhood?

I'm not sure. They were always just mom and dad to me. They were very passive to each other (with regard to showing affection, etc). They were both hard workers, owned their own business, and worked long hours. My grandmother (who lived with us since birth) was just as much of a mother figure to my brother and I (if not more so) as my actual mom.

How was forgiveness modeled? Again, I'm not sure how to answer that.

Thanks and again, congrats! I know how hard it can be to focus and achieve in times or turmoil so your powers of concentration are commendable!

Thank you very much!