Train, I *think* ultimately what me, you and Wonka are going around about is timing. I can't imagine that either of you disagree that H ultimately should come home and be fully transparent and I shouldn't compromise. But when do I say "ok H, time to get serious, fully commit to M, come home and agree to full transparency. If not, then I will need to step away because I can't continue on like this indefinitely." I mean you have to remember, we've been on/off the piecing path pretty much from day of BD --- 6 months ago. Sh*t or get off the pot already! (I do appreciate that many others have much more patience than me, I just can only do this for so long and feel like I'm quickly approaching my limit, I see no good reason why he can't/won't firmly COMMIT. Things obviously won't be perfect but he can commit to the M and the work, right?).
I feel like a real direct conversation needs to happen at some point. I think the question is when? At this point, I'm pretty much planning on it coming up organically in MC. Honestly, my gut is that H will respond well (although I probably shouldn't assume that..). As long as the conversation is handled correctly. Not an ultimatum but a "this is what I need at this point and if you can't give me that that's OK, that's your choice but this is what I'm going to have to do to protect my heart because not having a firm commitment to the M is really hurting me".
I just feel like it's getting time that I need and deserve more and if I don't start requesting it, I'm going to start losing some self respect.
M: 42 H: 43 M: 8 years S7 and D4 H has D19 and S25 from previous M Bomb: 3/6/14 OW discovered, EA & PA 1st separation, 10 days, decided to reconcile & moved back in. Fail 2nd separation: 5/1/14
Tomorrow H has outing with OW. I am determined NOT to lose my cool. H stated he would send me updates. We'll see how that goes and assuming it goes well I will be sure to give lots of praise and thanks. If it doesn't go well I'll be sure to post here before I do/say anything I will do everything I can to use this opportunity to show him I *can* handle this.
Thursday we are headed to an overnight event through his work. This should be a great opportunity to connect. I will be sure to keep it all positive and rock his world
Over the weekend we will both be at kids soccer games. This is typically another great opportunity for connection, we just really bond over the kids. H said the other day that he loves parenting together.
Ok...so you can see what I'm doing thus far...keeping it positive, positive, positive and NO major R talks (unless he brings it up)
Then, hopefully we will get MC appointment sometime next week. Based on that, I'll gauge when to do the 'sh*t or get off the pot' talk. I'm doubtful that the very first MC appointment would offer the right opportunity but you never know.
So, that's my plan. I know Wonka is going to swoop in and say I'm trying too hard to control things. Perhaps But plans do help keep me on track, especially when I specifically plan NOT to discuss the A or go psycho. Also, I really am assuming that a lot of what I'm struggling with will come up naturally in MCing...
M: 42 H: 43 M: 8 years S7 and D4 H has D19 and S25 from previous M Bomb: 3/6/14 OW discovered, EA & PA 1st separation, 10 days, decided to reconcile & moved back in. Fail 2nd separation: 5/1/14
but at some point I truly feel I deserve more from him
Keep the deserve stuff in check, mdu. "I deserve" leads to expectations, entitlement and disappointing victimhood when things don't go as planned. Bit by bit, he's giving you more, and you have to decide whether that's enough, but leave deserve out of it.
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We'll see how that goes and assuming it goes well I will be sure to give lots of praise and thanks.
Don't overdo it. It will come off as patronizing. Don't make him feel like a little boy. A single, simple "I really appreciate your putting my anxiety at rest - thank you." ought to do it. A kiss on top would be dreamy.
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Based on that, I'll gauge when to do the 'sh*t or get off the pot' talk.
You have everything going in the right direction, and you have to realize it's going to be baby steps, baby steps, not great bounds. Everyone keeps saying piecing is the hardest part. Patience is your short suit. Know it. mdu, I hope you can come up with a plan for that and not blow all this positive progress out of the water. You are by no means stalled, so why would you be itchin to do a 'sh*t or get off the pot' talk? This is your new boyfriend who you are trying to entice to take you out on the next date. You can't go at him with "marry me now or step off."
I would be expecting more from my H, too, mdu. And I think some expectations are understandable at this stage. Zew just summarized beautifully what I've had a hard time putting into words here.
I *don't* think, when such amazing progress is being made right in front of your eyes, that a "sh!t or get off the pot" conversation is in order. I think that type of conversation is one you have when they're actively avoiding you and avoiding working on the M. If you have that conversation now that he's moving toward you? Hmmmm. I dunno ...
I've been thinking a lot about this in my own sitch and while reading others' stories: as I wrote about yesterday, once our WASs bite the hook, we really start allowing ourselves to feel what has happened. We also, I think, start getting a little ballsy. (It's easier to be ballsy when they're clearly on the line.) But in doing that, how quickly we abandon the DB principles and the methods we chose to re-attract them!
Judging only from my own experience, the best place to start is with an open mind and open heart, ready to work together as a team. It's quite selfless on the part of the LBS. The "release" of your feelings will have a time and place, in MC and/or when your H is re-committed to your M.
But, for whatever reason and fwiw, I don't think *now* is the time to get ballsy. That time has passed, and you chose to go a softer route. You found, in the process, that is what attracted your H back. To switch gears when things are working just makes me nervous. But that's just ME, and I'm not you or in your M. You know your H better than I do.
But all that stuff up there that zew is talking about? The patience factor, especially considering what's ahead? Yeah. Good stuff. That's what I was trying to get at yesterday.
If you're going to throw out ultimatums and/or boundaries NOW, just be sure you are TRULY prepared to deal with the consequences if H isn't ready to "sh!t or get off the pot."
I could be completely misunderstanding you, too, mdu. Zew's post just made me feel like maybe I *am* understanding ... or at least that someone else is reading what I am and seeing the same things.
M: 40 H: 44 Married 14 years S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M 2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart Piecing: April 2014
But, for whatever reason and fwiw, I don't think *now* is the time to get ballsy. That time has passed, and you chose to go a softer route. You found, in the process, that is what attracted your H back. To switch gears when things are working just makes me nervous.
BINGO. mdu, you came to that fork in the road a looong ways back. And, as you know, I happened to believe in taking the other (firmer) fork, and I said so. But you didn't, and I think you need to stay this course.
I keep throwing the *asterisk* over everything though of "only you know will know when this is enough for you." Maybe you'd feel better with some sort of internal (NOT communicated to your husband, but hidden-in-your-heart) timeframe deadline on this? Like 1st of the year or something?
Again??!! When are you going to learn to develop patience??! If you cannot be patient for one month, think about being patient for the next 40 years of your marriage because there will be times when your kids and H will test your patience in various ways.
Why don't you learn how to be patient now and for the next few months for it will pay huge dividends down the road for YOU and the family?
You want to use TNT on a skittish squirrel NOW. I am sure you know how that'll play out. Not pretty at all for sure!
You are Wily E. Coyote to your H's roadrunner. I can picture you in my mind out in the desert trying out various Acme "tools" to 'trap' H.
When are you going to learn to develop patience??! If you cannot be patient for one month, think about being patient for the next 40 years of your marriage ... Why don't you learn how to be patient now and for the next few months for it will pay huge dividends down the road for YOU and the family?
Exactly. And more timely and pressing: how will you be patient during the months/years of piecing??
That actually reminds me of something else I meant to bring up earlier. I feel in this thread, ALL we have discussed for months is how to GAL and how to re-attract H. What I haven't seen recently (and that could be due to me simply missing it) is any discussion of what permanent changes you, mdu, are making to YOU to help make sure this breakdown doesn't happen again in your M. Cultivating patience and letting go of some control, I think, are HUGE obstacles for you. And when I see someone who repeats the same behavior (pushing and rushing) even though it has reaped negative results (your H pulling away), I have to think that person either hasn't identified it's something they have an issue with, or s/he either refuses to fix it or hasn't spent enough time with him/herself to adequately work on it.
I'm on "this side" of the A-busting, and I don't know HOW I could possibly be here, almost five months later, if I hadn't let go of some of my nagging, destructive behaviors while H was gone. Its hard work to make sustainable changes in ourselves. And, even if we have made them, it's hard work on this side of the A. You HAVE to be in tip-top emotional shape to get through it, IMO. I can't tell you how important patience, grace, letting go of anger/resentment - and STFU - are in the first few weeks and months at least.
Until your H fully re-commits and asks you what it will take to move back home, use the time to work on developing these things. That's the entire premise of DBing anyway. Re-attracting them is only a small part.
M: 40 H: 44 Married 14 years S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M 2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart Piecing: April 2014
I will do everything I can to use this opportunity to show him I *can* handle this.
But plans do help keep me on track, especially when I specifically plan NOT to discuss the A or go psycho. Also, I really am assuming that a lot of what I'm struggling with will come up naturally in MCing...