barely holding on - 3

[u-turn]

Sandi-Thanks
I do realize that even if the affair ends she may not want to return to the M. That will have to be seen. But I don't want to screw anything up or make matters worse.
....
The last conversation we had about the affair, which was several weeks ago, she indicated that there is no affair (because he won't leave his family) - I did not call her out at that time that it was a lie. She avoids lying to me by being very vague with her statements or not telling me anything.

So without bringing it up again or start another conversation about it, she is technically not lying (in her mind). So all of my mistakes made pre-db are still biting me and the lost respect is still there.

It's funny that she will talk to our kids about lying (it's the lying by omission that we both teach our kids about)and respect, but doesn't follow her own lessons.

She must realize that this is happening - right?

[MrBond]

"It's funny that she will talk to our kids about lying (it's the lying by omission that we both teach our kids about)and respect, but doesn't follow her own lessons. "

Because in her mind she's not lying. She's justified everything that she has done. You need to stop thinking that she is thinking a certain way. That's more of your control.

[Eatsma]

MrBond - thank you very much for pointing that out, actually.

My H also has a hard time understanding the deceit that is felt by his behavior.

Out of curiosity, in your experience, do they ever come to grips that the behavior actually WAS deceitful? I understand one can't control the affair in any way, and this is why one must detach and get a life....but tell me more about the turning point of the WAS, if there is one.

[MrBond]

"Out of curiosity, in your experience, do they ever come to grips that the behavior actually WAS deceitful?"

It depends on the individual. Some continue to think that they were "meant" to be with the AP and if it didn't work out, they move on to the next one. They keep moving from person to person never thinking that MAYBE the reason why they are never happy with another person is because THEY aren't happy inside.

They don't see having an A as being "wrong" or lying. They feel that the "lie" is the way they have been living in a relationship that doesn't make them happy.

Of course, they don't actually consider trying to work on things because it's everyone else's fault and not theirs.

"I understand one can't control the affair in any way, and this is why one must detach and get a life....but tell me more about the turning point of the WAS, if there is one."

There are many WAS's who have turned around. Usually it's those who have hit rock bottom and see their LBS thriving while their life is messed up. But sadly, there are those WAS's who never go into self reflection and continue their destructive ways. They feel that there pain is so bad that they will do anything to get out of it.

This is the main reason why the WAS will often "change" into the monster and turn on the LBS. My own W who was the kindest person I had ever known, threatened to call the cops on me when I told her that I didn't want to move my daughter out of bed in our home (W was living away at the time just 10 minutes away) because she was really sick. I just looked at her, told her to go ahead and I would be more than happy to talk to the officers when they arrived. She backed down and became extremely humble and helpful after that.

You just can't let the crazy antics of the WAS make you crazy. The more grounded you are, the stronger your position.

Here is a little saying that someone posted a long time ago but I always kept it with me. It has religious undertones to it, but the idea is basically that you need to be the sane one while your WAS is acting insane.

Here is the quote:

Be the Lighthouse.

Your spouse is in huge conflict....

The good news is and the truth is that they are totally incapable of a healthy relationship with anyone right now...

The competition we believe that exists with the OP is a shallow, empty reflection of God's light in this world....

It is empty and lonely no matter how good the rush.

Their actions are actions that they themselves do not like in themselves right now....though the need to go back again and again and attempt to prove themselves wrong or right is strong....they do not like what they are doing....

Their actions towards you, the children, the OP and themselves keep them from engaging in any type of real interactions with real dept and truth.

All they offer are misguided attempts to fill the void that has appeared in their life....yet the filling is way to fleeting to sustain them and the truth is with them each night he or she lays down, regardless of whom is next to them....

They are the living cliche of...no matter where you go to hide, there YOU are.

He or she is lost to themselves.

And you stand at that point of being the lighthouse home. Even though they create the waves that block their vision from seeing that.

You become the lighthouse. You fill your home with light, calmness and sanctuary.

Just visualize yourself as a lighthouse.

You offer them glimpses into that sanctuary at every chance you get. You invite them towards it, let them know it is there as much as you can in a most subtle way.

They are untrustable right now, but you know that. So they can't hurt you right now. They will spend great energy to convince others differently, but you know better.

You show them the path by also protecting the children from their painful actions. Set clear boundaries that the OP is not part of your childrens lives, without love busting.

Offer alternatives that let them see the children, but be clear that the OP is to have no access to them. You fill the childrens lives with stability. They deserve it and need it more than anything else.

Do not discuss or power struggle with them on irrational movements. Seek out and validate the rational ones with lots of praise for when he or she chooses correctly.

Your spouse is very lonely and sad right now, but that is OK. No one can stay very long in that chaos..it is wearisome to the soul..

And remove yourself from any aspect of participating or adding to the chaos and eventually they will see that you are the only one who stood with clarity and reason when they needed it most.

Be the lighthouse...

[paul19510]

Very nice mr bond

[u-turn]

Thanks MrBond for that.
I feel like sometimes I am doing alright when I read things like that - at times I actually feel that way (lighthouse).

You offer them glimpses into that sanctuary at every chance you get. You invite them towards it, let them know it is there as much as you can in a most subtle way.

I feel like this is the best that I can do right now. It makes no sense to my kids or anyone that has knowledge of our situation, but it's the best I can do.

I know not to actually verbally invite them to the light (or back into our lives - that has backfired in the past). I think she felt it was manipulative and judgmental. I try to be subtle.

Thanks again - This is a keeper to read on my low times

[u-turn]

even with the level of detaching that I am doing, I can look at things a little differently. It's almost like I can look at our current life as an outsider - like I'm watching a bad tv show.

This morning she said that she still loves me - I tried to just validate her - we haven't said that to each other in a long time.

I told her that "I still feel love for you too" - probably shouldn't have said it. Probably shouldn't believe it from her. She said she really does. (like she was forcing the point). I said "I know you do".

At that moment I didn't feel detached, so I said good bye for the day and left for work. Not much to report there, but it was a change in her. I try not to keep looking for signs, but that is difficult.

I will be spending the entire day with her on saturday to travel to a funeral for my aunt. (8 hours of driving)

[Dpthght]

What a great post Mr Bond

[dawgy]

Turn , she said she still loves you ? That is very good . Things are starting to add up , the FB post about getting a second chance , saying she loves you . Keep playing it cool. Im not sure about your response to her love you statement but i think you handled it right . She was likely looking for you to say I love you too but saying it the way you did i think will make her want more . good stuff bro

[u-turn]

I would agree - but I am still having a hard time believing her - even about that. I still have a feeling she is just giving me enough to keep me hanging on.

I think it's good - but I am cautious. I've been warned here by the best not to wear my heart on my sleeve. I am trying not to do that.

I know she is still torn between me and OM. Just because she told me that doesn't mean she didn't tell him that too.