Wife is giving mixed signals? I think? HELP!

[CORC320]

Hello All,

I hope this letter finds you all in good spirits and your experience with the issue of divorce and reconciliation can help me. I have been an observer of this website and the forums for approximately 2 months and have learned important lessons. To be honest some of what I have learned has really hurt me, because I truly believed I was a good husband. I am currently reading through DB (pg. 132) and that is where my issue comes into to play. My wife has already said she “is done, we will never be happy” and the whole ILYBINILWY thing (hope that’s the correct acronym).

Anyway, here is a brief summary of marital issues I don’t want it to run too long because it gets hard to read all that sadness on other posts. About 2 years ago my wife had an affair with a guy she worked with and it about killed me. We ended up trying to save the marriage and work on things and initially it went well, but I began to get really cold inside. I had all these feelings that I didn’t really understand and whenever I mentioned counseling she would totally refuse. Partially because she was embarrassed by what she had done and because we tried once and the counselor was really judgmental to the point I had to stick up for my wife and we never went back. Well over that year things just got worse and I was the one that decided I wanted out and needed a break I felt that I needed time to heal and forgive. In November 2013 I asked for a separation and she moved out.

Approximately 2 weeks later I wrecked out at a charity race and broke my back, my leg (8 times) and tore a bunch of tendons. During this time and over about two months I realized that I loved her and that I wanted to fix it. So we tried to fix our marriage. We had a couple little “break ups” during this time, but for the most part things were progressively getting better and I had hope. The issues arose in May after I went to Las Vegas with my race team to support the other team members racing the EnduroCross and SuperCross race. The whole time I was in Vegas she text and was super nice and everything was good.

However, on the day I was flying home her grandfather died and things went downhill fast. I should mention that she was extremely close to her grandfather. I tried so hard to be there for her and show her I cared by trying to take her mind off of it and be extra nice and happy. I should mention that all my family members died very young so I never had grandparents or anything that and have never experienced a loss like that. While I was at her grandfathers house trying to be supportive her sister in law didn’t realize I could hear her talking bad about my wife. I told my wife what was said and instead of talk to me she went to her father and her dad freaked out on me. I decided that I was just going to go home, her family has never liked me and I was only there to try and support her, but after that I left.

We didn’t talk for a few days, I was mad she did that and I couldn’t attend the funeral and I am sure she was upset with me. But, I should mention that my wife never talks about her feelings and I don’t know what I am doing right or wrong most the time. Anyways, after a few days (Mothers day 2014) we talked and when she heard my side of the story she said it was silly she got that mad and that her family blew it out of proportion.

So this is where it gets spicy, on 17JUN14 she asked me to bring the girls over and watch a movie after she had dinner with friends. I went over around 8 after leaving a birthday party and she didn’t answer, but her car was there. I figured she fell asleep and I left with the girls. The next morning she came to my house and crawled into bed and gave me this amazing hug/snuggle like I could feel that she loved me. So while talking to her she tells me she got drunk at a guys house and passed out on the floor. It was like it was happening all over again and all I could think was the worst. I would also like to say that my first wife had an affair as well and that this is my second marriage and after her affair this passing out at a dudes house really hurt and angered me.

I have to be honest and admit that I blew up I was so mad, scared and hurt I didn’t know what to do. I said mean things “I don’t even want to effing look at you” stuff like that. I know I was wrong, but it just came out and I am really mad at myself almost 2 months later. About a week and a half later I had my final surgery from my accident and when she came to grab the girls I gave her a hug and said I told her I was sore. She gave me a hug and asked “why are you doing this? Hugging me like nothing is wrong?” I was like I am sorry I got mad, but she was like I’m done we’ll never be happy and you know it’s true. I told her I understand her side, but that it’s not fair to tell me how I feel and that I didn’t want a divorce. However, she wasn’t having it, so I asked again for counseling and that if it didn’t help it could just be divorce counseling with our daughters to help them. She said no to it all.

It has now been almost 2 months and this is where my questions begin. She says she is done and isn’t changing her mind, but she hasn’t filed yet and says it’s because she can’t afford it (that is a lie she has the money). She will ask my mom how I am or questions about my life. She still has wedding pictures up, she removed the one of us and its all of her, also my mom believes the one of us is next to her bed, but my mom isn’t sure. Anyway, there are also several other things she does that I as her husband see and I know something is going on inside her.

I guess my question’s are how long does this stuff take? What signs will they give? But most importantly how do I utilize the stuff in DB to a wife that has already left? Does that make sense? Like in the book it seems to be about couples that still talk and that’s an issue she doesn’t really talk to me.

I have been doing the normal stuff GAL, I go to a divorce groups at my church, I am doing a lot of extra stuff at work to keep me busy. You have to remember I have a broken back so it’s hard to do all the stuff we loved doing. Guys and Gals I really don’t want to lose my wife or my family and any advice is greatly appreciated.

Warmest Regards,
Adam

[Ss06]

Hi and welcome. Sorry you find yourself here. Find the part in DB called The Last Resort Technique. Start doing that. Breathe. This is a long road. Longer than you could ever imagine but there's hope in the crevices. Get to work.

[CORC320]

Thank you for the advice!

[Mike559]

I will say this, I have been given mixed signals at many times during my separation as well. So much to the point, it was driving me crazy. It was like a game of she loves me, she loves me not.

I will say that the LRT seems to be the best thing that has been helping me DETACH from this situation and enjoy life. In just a week of doing it, I have seen a difference in my limited interactions with my WAW(child pickup/dropoff), but mostly in my own sanity.

The way I had it explained to me was that the WAW decides to leave, they are going to decide to return. I am in the same boat, and have been for 3 months now. All I did after the first month was pressure her, plead with her, and borderline beg her to return. Flip the script. No one wants to chase someone that refuses to be caught. So in turn, make her chase you by moving on. If anything, you will begin to build the tools needed to live a life independent of her, and if you are brought back together, you will be much more appealing.

Best of luck, and stay patient!

[sandi2]

So basically the two of you never received any help to work through your issues? She had one A that you know about, and several breakups afterwards.

Then You find out she gets drunk at a guy's house and passes out. I assume it was just the two of them, or did you ever get details? But then you apologize for getting mad?

What are your ages and how long have you been M?

Why do you want to stay with her? Besides saying you love her?

[CORC320]

I'm sorry I have been posting wierd I am not good at this stuff.

@ Sandi, I received limited info on the night she did that she stated that she went with friends and didn't want to drive home, but it seemed preplaned since she didn't take her vehicle. I believe it has been only one affair and I truly hope I am right I don't know if I could forgive another. To answer your question yes I love my wife and I want to save my family, but as before I don't know how? I always wanted to be a perfect husband, but I just wasn't. It seemed like I always put in the work and she just expected it to be all roses all the time.

[CORC320]

Thanks Mike this stuff totally [censored] and I am sorry there are so many people going through it.

[CORC320]

From another thing I started sorry everyone I do this on my phone in my cop car during my lunch break.
I hope you guys can help with this situation. My wife said she wanted out about 2 1/2 months ago and to be honest we haven't talked much. I am trying to give her space, detach etc. But there are a couple things she has done that make me question if she really wants out. First of all she hasn't filed or even started the divorce paperwork I don't know if this is common, but my wife is not the procrastinating type. Second she has kept me on insurance and she doesn't have to July is open enrollment and I have my own insurance, so basically she is paying 300 a month for me and was happy and chipper when she told me. Another thing is when she drops the girls off at my parents it is very quick, but if I am around she lingers and like looks at me and stuff. I am doing what DB says to and just being mellow and happy, but I don't know what to look for or what signs are good signs etc. Is there a place in the book that I missed? Please help me I love my family and don't want to lose them, but I am very emotionally sensitive and it makes it hard to think objectively.

[Zues126]

I feel you. You can drive yourself insane trying to interpret and recalculate your chances hour by hour. It doesn't help, and only does harm. Arm yourself with mantras like "how would knowing my chances impact what I'm doing today?" It shouldn't if the growth is for you. There are other mantras, that was just an example. I also use 'why do i feel so insecure i Feel i need someone elses love to be on?' In a healthy R it's ok to love and desire, but I'm learning NEED equates to distinction which is why so many of us LBSs sing from the same hymnal.

It's impossible not to go a little crazy at first, but detaching is critical for your chances AND survival so make this a big part of your focus and don't give up because its tough. What are you doing today to become a better person for you?

[CORC320]

Thanks bro! I see what you are saying I guess I am just curious if there is any hope at all. I have been focused on getting back to racing enduro and some desert stuff. I'm also having trouble understanding if the DB'ING is helping or not. Then there is the whole how long does this stuff usually take? Is there a timeline? A roadmap?

[CORC320]

Hey Mike,
What signs have you been given? I wonder if they are the same?

[Mike559]

The signs have been somewhat all over the place. My WAW initially told me she wanted to divorce right before Mother's Day. It was about 2 weeks after she had moved out. I panicked when she initally said it, but she then said she said it out of frustration due to some stuff that came out of marriage counseling.

She has told me several times since then, probably 4 or 5 times that she wants to divorce. It is usually the day after a big fight or nasty conversation. However, she tells a mentor of hers that also talks to me from time to time, that she needs space from me and that she is open to going to marital counseling/workshops down the line. She also tells D8 that she wants things to work out between the two of us.

The rule of not believing what you hear seems to apply here. There isn't OM and she is actually being a homebody since moving out. It seems as I push less, she gets warmer with me. There isn't any tension, nor is there any more Divorce talk.

I failed to validate the times that she said the D word to me and all it does is frustrate her. For example, my D8 had a talk about our family reconciling and it was sweet and innocent. I shared it with WAW and she would say AHHH or that's so sweet. However, as soon as I put a spin on it saying, so and so said for me to be patient or that you would come around, she got frustrated and said I don't take her comment on divorce seriously.

I started the LRT a few days after that conversation.

[MrBond]

Every situation is different, so there is no concrete roadmap. My W took about 4 years to get out of her fog.

[CORC320]

Thanks Mike, there are some similarities but you seem to talk to your W much more than I do. I tried 4 times to just sit down and ask what is going on and each time it was the same. So I haven't really spoke with her in over a month I don't even say hi when we exchange the children. Sometimes I think that is why she lingers so that I will say something. Trust me I want to tell her to stay and talk, but I figure I will just get shut down again so I don't see the point.

Holy cow bond you got some stones! I don't think I could do that I was putting a 90 day cap on my situation. I figured if she didn't know after 90 days she didn't care. But dang 4 years! I hope this doesn't take that long. I don't think I have the strength.

[sandi2]

90 days is barely a drop in the bucket. This is more complicated than just you sitting back until she decides what she wants. I suggest you don't place an end time on your MR (i.e. 90 days). If you reach the point you can't go on, you will know it.

I wouldn't get too hung up over these "signs" you've mentioned. It is not uncommon for the WAW to do all the things you said your W has done (including not filing for a D). It doesn't mean anything. The fact she's paying out $300 a month unnecessarily, shows her state of mind.

Sometimes I think that is why she lingers so that I will say something

But then again, what the LBH thinks his WAW may be thinking......seldom is.

[CORC320]

Oh.... okay, I was hoping those were indications there was hope and she wasn't sure about what she wanted. I guess I'll just take it at face value, she said she was done and that's all I should go off of then. I mean I don't know what else to do? If the signs are normal and mean nothing I'm moving on. I love my wife, but if I'm just sitting around to be her 2nd choice backup forget it. Thanks for the help! I appreciate it.

[Zues126]

It's called getting used to living in Limbo. It's a requirement for any chance at growth, and any chance at reconciliation.

Use this painful time to reflect on the role you've played in the breakdown, where those hurtful/neglectful/dismissive attitudes came from, and start growing beyond those outlooks and becoming a stronger and healthier person.

Here's the catch. You have to do it for you. If you're only doing it to get the R back then it isn't real change and A) won't work and B) wouldn't last if you did trick her to coming back.

So ask yourself...if you KNEW there was no chance at getting back together, would you still want to grow, or would you go meet someone else and self medicate to avoid the pain? If you can't learn to listen to the lessons the pain is telling you and change then you don't have to give her 60 days as a token gesture. Just give up and try to replace her and sorry in advance for the pain you'll continue to feel in your heart (that you didn't fix) and the pain you'll suffer when your next R goes the same way.

Bottom line, accepting limbo is a sign your growing and serious. Any time you're feeling impatient recognize that's God's way of telling you you're trying to control and avoid the growth he is trying to give you to make your life better.

[CORC320]

You're right Zeus, I'm just so tired man. She has just moved on like I was a nobody, she has this little party girl life thing going on and the kids and I are a distant memory. I am fixing me and I was trying when the marriage was in a flat spin. I'm in counseling, divorce group and trying to get right with God. I'm just so tired of hurting and wondering if there is any hope at all. Honestly I don't know what else to do?

[MrBond]

Actually, you never did describe what your marital issues were. What caused her to have an A the first time? What thins needed to be changed? What were her complaints about the M?

[CORC320]

She said it was because I went to the gym to much. I wasn't allowed to talk about the affair, well kinda, but she had the opinion that I shouldn't bring it up. So I got resentful and angry. So I really can't answer your questions. I didn't think the marriage was bad. I worked out of town and while I would be gone she had like a pseudo family with this guy. I forgave for a lot of stuff, but I just wasn't strong enough to push through it alone. I swear dudes I asked for counseling nearly every week. I got so desperate I asked her to read a book called after the affair just to see if it helped and she wouldn't. It has always been up to me to change and get help, but she was offended by the mention that she might need to get help. I really don't know what else to do. I mean hell I have had my girls 14 days in a row and before that it was 10 with her having a 2 day period. She had to go out of town because she had plans. I am just super confused.

[MrBond]

Not enough information. Dig deep and write down the issues. Think about the little things she would say under her breath. Or the things that bothered her.

[CORC320]

Well she just text me and told me that she dropped the papers and that I should be getting them soon.

[CORC320]

I'm out guys there's no hope now, but thanks for the advice.

[MrBond]

"I'm out guys there's no hope now, but thanks for the advice."

I can tell you that there is alot of hope.

But if you want to end it. Good luck to you.

[CORC320]

So what am I supposed to do? I have been fighting for almost 2 years since her affair. How much longer should a guy fight for? If there was some sign of life in my marriage I would continue to fight, but she doesn't even talk to me. At what time do I need to cut bait and go?

[MrBond]

I fought for my M for almost 4 years before my W started to even start turning thins around.

Only you can say when it's time to quit. If you want to quit, go ahead. There's no shame in that if you gave it your all. But hard to give you advice when you keep saying there was nothing wrong with your M to begin with.

[CORC320]

I know that there was issues in my marriage. She just didn't talk about it or let me know. I said the things I did wrong in my first post. She filed doesnt that mean it's over?

[Fartiltre]

She filed doesnt that mean it's over?

NO!!! - it's over when YOU decide. Nobody can decide that for you, but you!

[MrBond]

I know that there was issues in my marriage. She just didn't talk about it or let me know. I said the things I did wrong in my first post. She filed doesnt that mean it's over?

Of course not. There have even been M's on here that already D'd and then got back together again.