Saving my marriage by focusing on ME!

[claire7]

It's just that she has said he is just a good friend and that she can't break all ties because she does not want to hurt him.

She is making her choice. What is YOUR choice? You cannot control what she says, does, thinks. You can only control YOU. Will you continue to engage with her in a friendly way? To pursue her? To go on dates with her? When she continues to make this choice?

Think about a boundary you want to set for yourself. Re-read the threads about BOUNDARIES (which are different than demands-- which you cannot make). Set some boundaries.

You are allowing her to hurt you. Have you addressed this in IC? There seems to be a major self-esteem issue going on here. How can you work on that?

[Oxford1]

It's OK for us to disagree, agreeably, Ox. I was mainly just capturing those thoughts for others following along, in case they could take anything from them. "Passive-aggressive" is just about the worst way to DB, so I was pointing it out.

Your wife is an odd bird, so who knows. Maybe this will all work out for you two. I certainly hope so.


Starsky

Don't get me wrong you are 1000 times correct about MY passive aggressive behavior.
That's what I meant . I have been this way and controlling for a long long time.
So I have been focused on that issue.
My point was maybe that's why now I have been so passive to her. The proverbial walking on EGG Shells comes to mind.

For years in public my friends and family would say"Ox why are you so afraid of your wife"
But once we were alone I was awful! (In terms of arguing and dealing with her previous attacks...I should have just walked out of the room)

[Oxford1]

Ox,

Is your IC helping you with any of this!?!? If not, you need to find a new one, stat. You've been at this for months and are still mostly stuck. How can you find the inner strength (and outside support) to help you get UNSTUCK?

Actually the new one is the MC and we see her seperately. SHE is helping. The waste of money and time was my old IC, I realized she only listened to me vent and bellyache, said two words to me, took my cash and made the next appointment. That was the waste of money The new one has told me that in the four weeks she has seen a big change.

She is making her choice. What is YOUR choice? You cannot control what she says, does, thinks. You can only control YOU. Will you continue to engage with her in a friendly way? To pursue her? To go on dates with her? When she continues to make this choice?

Think about a boundary you want to set for yourself. Re-read the threads about BOUNDARIES (which are different than demands-- which you cannot make). Set some boundaries.

You are allowing her to hurt you. Have you addressed this in IC? There seems to be a major self-esteem issue going on here. How can you work on that?

You are right, I know she once said I deserved to be hurt over what happened in the marriage, but now she cries and says she does not want to hurt me anymore.

I need to put a stop to the pain.

[25yearsmlc]

Why is semen analysis ick? Well, I suppose it's ick in the sense of thinking about his semen on her garments, but so is an STD test ick and so is a paternity test ick. The semen test is to see if she is having sex with OM. That's a good thing to do...to know what is going on. Why do you say Just No?

Emma, have you read the DB books? This type of "snooping" is VERY frowned upon. There's nothing to discover anyhow. We know she's been physical with OM. Nothing new there.

And it's NOT ""a good thing to do" for a reason. We are here to save marriages, not convict our spouses of adultery. In some states it's not even relevant to a divorce and in his case it's not a mystery.
Getting those types of details will further obsess Ox and keep him OFF track, (the "track" I'm referring to, is HIS personal work and growth and LESS obsessing, not more).

Also, "knowing what is going on" is NOT the test for whether something is good for a marriage.

I would urge you to review the chapters on snooping and why it's advised against.'

I'll give you a hint however. If someone KNOWS for 100% certainty that a PA would be a deal breaker, then it may be a good idea to verify it before filing for divorce.

But when you are working thru an affair, and trying to salvage a marriage, when it's not a deal breaker, you don't bother accumulating "evidence" with which to convict/confront or humiliate your spouse.

He's trying to set boundaries AND keep the road home, "paved & smooth", not to make more hurdles for her. She'll have enough as it is. We'll cross that bridge when we get to it.

Do you understand why we say this?

If not, check those chapters out.

[EmmaB]

I would urge you to review the chapters on snooping and why it's advised against.'
[/b]
I'll give you a hint however. If someone KNOWS for 100% certainty that a PA would be a deal breaker, then it may be a good idea to verify it before filing for divorce.

But when you are working thru an affair, and trying to salvage a marriage, when it's not a deal breaker, you don't bother accumulating "evidence" with which to convict/confront or humiliate your spouse.

He's trying to set boundaries AND keep the road home, "paved & smooth", not to make more hurdles for her. She'll have enough as it is. We'll cross that bridge when we get to it.

Do you understand why we say this?

If not, check those chapters out.[/color]

Thank you 25. I have read the chapters. I wasn't really saying he should snoop regardless but what if it is a deal breaker? Does DB accept that at some point a long affair becomes a deal breaker for some people? Also, I don't understand the part I underlined. Is Ox really doing this? I read all his other threads and he seemed to change his mind about what he's doing. He said if she did various things he would end the marriage but she did them anyway and he is still there. If he is setting boundaries what are they? His wife seems to do as she pleases.

My ex husband had an affair. I found out about a night he spent in a hotel with a work colleague. I always thought there was more to it than one night but he always denied that. That was when our adopted daughter was 3. I felt that after all we went through with infertility and then the blessing of adoption this was a terrible insult. I didn't plan right then and there to leave him but I ended up leaving when our daughter went to college. I think all along I never understood how he could do that to me and I never got over it. If I knew about sites like this I probably would have done things differently.

Anyway, where I think I was similar to Ox's wife is that when she was older I realised that I wanted to leave when she was grown. For the last four years or so until she was 18 I planned to leave and finally did it. I never had an affair but in that four years I considered my marriage to be over and felt my husband had no rights over me any more. I didn't date or go out with any men, but I became very independent, gym, trips with girlfriends and so forth. I basically acted as if my husband was not there. I think Ox's wife sounds a lot like me at that time. I regret this now since I've seen how this hurts. I realise now I was trying to hurt him. I asked Ox what he thought his wife's intentions were and I don't think I got a proper answer. If I did I didn't see it.

[EmmaB]

Ox,

I wonder if the real reason you are focused so much on your W and her OM/A is that turning inward and thinking about what YOU need to do to work on YOU (to become the best YOU that you can be) feels too difficult and scary right now.

I hear that. I was in that place for a long, long time. But I assure you, you will not find peace (within yourself, your marriage, anything) until you LOOK INWARD.

Can you set a teeny tiny goal of going ONE day without focusing on your W and her A? What about half a day? What will you do during that time? What can you reward yourself with if you reach that goal?

Is your IC helping you with any of this!?!? If not, you need to find a new one, stat. You've been at this for months and are still mostly stuck. How can you find the inner strength (and outside support) to help you get UNSTUCK?

I realise that the post I just made about my history, when/if it shows up goes against what Claire and everyone is telling Ox to do. My post is all about his wife's intentions when Ox should be focusing on himself as you all say.

I'm sorry I did not stick to DB. I just though a bit of my history might be useful. I don't have a newcomers thread since my marriage is over and I am happy with that and not looking for help but I thought it might give context. Sorry again.

[Oxford1]

Sorry for not answering your question, I try to post while I am I between appointments and occasionally I miss a post. I try not to avoid anyone on purpose.

The truth is I think my wife at some point prior to 2011 had decided she was leaving when S16 graduated high school. I think it really was 50/50 partially to escape from his severe anxiety and depression. ( thank god that's in control) the other was to leave me.

It has begun to be clear as day that she was blaming me for her unhappiness. She had an opportunity when she was in high school to be on broadway. Her father cut that off, her mom had been a singer and had a few affairs and he blamed the " show-biz" life.
She wanted to go to NYU for theater..no, Syracuse for communications..no...and so on.

She ended up in something she liked but always felt there was more.

Every problem in her life became my fault...I deserved some of it there was stuff I did I am ashamed of ( not infidelity).

She befriended our so called Tour Guide and I noticed he targeted her. He and his long time live in stayed with us for a week and he would knock my kids out of the way to get her attention.

She ate it up.

Then S18 had a girlfriend of a different religion, my wife and I did not agree how to handle it, believe me my approach was right. This OM attacked me sided with the wife and the fun began.

Anyhow, after she ran away she missed my S16 and S21, she wanted to move back home for an in home separation. Which we did. We eventually cancelled the divorce but she just can't let go of OM.

I had an interesting meeting with the MC tonight.

I believe that the changes my wife has seen are a combination of the forums and of my MC. A lot of what my MC tells me about behaviors and actions line up exactly with DB and this site.

She also told me to Stop renting space in my head to the OM .....where have we heard that before....DB maybe?

Anyway, now the only thing my WW is afraid of is that the second she dumps OM the old me returns...

I guess it will take time for her to realize the old me is dead...

[25yearsmlc]

Every WAS fears that the marriage they left, in which they were very Unhappy, will return if they return.

IOW, your w fears that you will revert to your old self as soon as she gives OM up.

consistent change + sufficient time = change she can believe in.

You have to give it time, & you have to be consistent, and you've done neither.

So look at the title of your thread and get back to YOU.

What are your 180s? What are your GAL?

You cannot detach without GAL, and we hammer the GAL for one reason only....

it works.

[25yearsmlc]

Ox, Emma,

see if this story helps illustrate the point some of us are making. It's a true story.

I grew up with a neighbor who was a retired Army Colonel. He had been a POW for several years, in Vietnam.

He and his wife had 5 kids. Years before they moved into our neighborhood, the Colonel had had an affair with some OW.

How did I, a young 17 y/o girl know that the Colonel had had an A?

Oh, I knew b/c everyone knew that b/c "Mrs Colonel" made sure we all knew, so we would not think he was such a great guy.

There were times I wanted to ask the Colonel about his POW experiences. But Mrs. C- would steer the topic away. I truly believed for years, that she was protecting him from a bad memory.

Then l learned that she simply didn't like him getting that type of attention. At the time we knew the family, the Colonel was kind, funny, handsome, strong, and really just a great guy. Yes, we DID admire him.

In contrast, She was a bitter woman, with a snide remark ready for her h at every turn. From how he grilled the meat to a reference letter he wrote for my h, she could NOT give that man a compliment to save her soul. She never praised him in front of her kids or us and she would undermine any compliment others would give him. In short, she lived to make him pay. I'm not exaggerating. She was NOT kind to him at all. I guess She never let him forget what SHE had endured.

Today, only 1 of their 5 kids is married and it's his 2nd or 3rd marriage. The others are all single. 2 never married, and the other 2 keep on getting married repeatedly.

The choice that Mrs C- made was the worst of all choices.

She could have divorced him. She could have gone to counseling and therapy and learned to forgive him. But instead she made the worst but most tempting choice; she stayed married AND stayed miserable.

She never let Colonel forget his sins.

She held it over his head like the sword of Damacles.

She threw it in his face (or threatened to) every time they fought.

She did NOT Forgive him and she did not even try to. Not in a serious humbling way.

Ironically, from where we sat, from what WE saw, HE was the victim and she was the wrongdoer....she was not a woman we sympathized with.

She should have let him go when she found out about the A; or as soon as she realized she could not forgive him; or she should have learned how to forgive.


She could have left her children a beautiful legacy. She COULD have taught and passed on to them, the concepts and practices of true forgiveness, real redemption, deep love and full commitment.

Instead, she passed onto them suspicions, distrust, cynicism, bitterness and big time grudge holding. She did not think he "deserved" forgiveness -- so she overlooked how many others were affected by her choice not to forgive.

I wish she had heard what I heard a few years back, which was

"Holding onto anger, to punish someone else, is like lighting yourself on fire,

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-----
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to get smoke in their eyes."


Emma, please don't take offense. But does any of this resonate with you?

Ox, you?

[MrBond]

Emma,

Your POV would be great to show what the attitude of a WAS is like. Since you held it all in and didn't want to actually work with your H to save the marriage, instead choosing to let it eat away at you, you could probably present insight as to what NOT to do.

You should start your own thread and share your story.