Sex was great, then we married part 3

[GoatGal]

And Grey--PLEASE---some guys jump in here to help because I just can't go there--- some of the things you alluded to about your physical....um.. "discomfort" with your situation, lead me to believe you may have ethical/moral/religious? objections to dealing with "things" in a more practical way.

(If you know what I mean.)

I guess I don't understand about that.
Is it because now you're married and you think that is something reserved for your W?

Just wondering...

--GG

[Grey]

Your marriage is not crumbling.
You are not in a SSM--yet---and you may never be!

Yes, my marriage is in danger. Absolutely. Every marriage is, it sounds like, at one point or another.

And I am in a SSM by definition, which you can read here for free.

I couldn't do what you're doing. Life is to short to stay unhappy for so many years simply because someone married someone else. Sometimes divorce actually is better. I'm not the one to tell you that, but I wouldn't do what you're doing, it sounds too damaging for too long in your life, and with no real solution in sight. I understand you're getting stronger, but maybe you'd be even moreso after divorce? Nobody should be trapped by anyone for so long.

[GoatGal]

PS: Claire is right ^^^

One thing that jumps out again is that it really pushes your buttons when your W jokes about all the encounters she had before you, and since you're feeling neglected, this would bother anybody.

At the very least, you could tell her that hearing about her previous lovers upsets you and you wish she would refrain from discussing them around you.

Not to criticize her, just to state a boundary of yours.

I don't think any of us would like to have our spouse's previous sexual adventures paraded in front of our faces, especially if we weren't getting any of that.

[Grey]

And Grey--PLEASE---some guys jump in here to help because I just can't go there--- some of the things you alluded to about your physical....um.. "discomfort" with your situation, lead me to believe you may have ethical/moral/religious? objections to dealing with "things" in a more practical way.

(If you know what I mean.)

I guess I don't understand about that.
Is it because now you're married and you think that is something reserved for your W?

Just wondering...

--GG

If you're talking about masturbation, yes, I do that. Pretty much every guy does, including happily married guys with great sex lives.


But one thing I never had before was random erections or wet dreams. It's embarassing, even dangerous when it comes to work.

But it also doesn't address the "need." It's not an itch to scratch, it's a physical connection that I promised never to share with anyone else. It's the ultimate expression of love. I could go on but DB explains a lot of that and I have always believed that part is true.

[GoatGal]

Grey,

Right now your marriage is only in danger because it sounds like you're thinking about why you might have to end it.

You can't go on averages and ratios, no matter what the books say.

If you don't have sex for three months because something occurs (illness, argument, whatever), but then have it three times a week for the rest of the year, it's not a SSM.

You're looking at the glass as half full.

Think of all the wonderful things you DO have!

---GG

[MrBond]

"You stopped hurting because your wife left you for longer than I've known my wife."

Um no. I stopped hurting because I realized that it wasn't about me. It was about her. The internal struggles she had were hers to deal with.

And let's re-iterate again. You DO NOT have a SSM. You have a M where your W has a health issue and is trying to deal with it. You keep insisting that you're not all about sex, but that's all you talk about.

No one said you had to permanently live like this, but you seem to make alot of assumptions of what people are telling you. Haven't you noticed that for some reason, the majority of posters to you are in agreement, yet you are the only one who insists on arguing back? Maybe you're the one who's not "getting it".

You hurt because you get validation through sex. We all get it. We all understand. But for some reason you repeat this again and again as if you think we don't. It doesn't matter how loud or long your repeat this, we understand. Now it's up to you on what to do from this point on. You've had both wonderful perspectives from women AND men and argue with all of them.

If you really want help with this, then try seeing from our POV. If you only want to hear the sound of your own voice, then a diary would be better. WE are trying to help you. We've taken time and effort to help you which you don't seem to want despite constantly asking.

[Grey]

"You stopped hurting because your wife left you for longer than I've known my wife."

Um no. I stopped hurting because I realized that it wasn't about me. It was about her. The internal struggles she had were hers to deal with.

And let's re-iterate again. You DO NOT have a SSM. You have a M where your W has a health issue and is trying to deal with it. You keep insisting that you're not all about sex, but that's all you talk about.

No one said you had to permanently live like this, but you seem to make alot of assumptions of what people are telling you. Haven't you noticed that for some reason, the majority of posters to you are in agreement, yet you are the only one who insists on arguing back? Maybe you're the one who's not "getting it".

You hurt because you get validation through sex. We all get it. We all understand. But for some reason you repeat this again and again as if you think we don't. It doesn't matter how loud or long your repeat this, we understand. Now it's up to you on what to do from this point on. You've had both wonderful perspectives from women AND men and argue with all of them.

If you really want help with this, then try seeing from our POV. If you only want to hear the sound of your own voice, then a diary would be better. WE are trying to help you. We've taken time and effort to help you which you don't seem to want despite constantly asking.

You are misinterpreting a lot, and leaving out some of the most important parts, particularly therapy.

I have listened. And I've followed a lot of advice.

But I'm following more advice now instead from Michele's books and my own therapist. The things you say in disagreement about me simply aren't true in the first place so I don't know why I continue to try to change your mind.

As for my wife ever talking about past relationships and past sexual experiences, that part doesn't really bother me in and of itself----it's the combination othem getting it and her giving ultimatums about what she did with them and would never do again, all while our physical relationship is gone.

I don't know what you expect me to talk about here then. I didn't come here to talk about how good my life is, and it is good. Does that not make sense?

I also didn't realize there was a time frame on a SSM. Michele certainly didn't mention that, and I'm also sure any SSM that lasted for years and years started at some point in the first few months.

I don't think this last part will get through, but it's inherently the most important part. My wife and I are good. I'm struggling, yes. I can't turn it off, and expecting it to last for months or years wouldn't help anybody change how they feel about it in the present. But we're talking more, working more closely together on things, and I've changed a lot, in particular with the dogs, and she likes it.I AM being patient, even when I occasionally feel rejected.

So for now, I'm focusing on my therapy. I'm getting better sleep thanks to these new habits, and that helps a lot, despite one of the puppies being sick and waking us up twice this week in the middle of the night. So when I say it's not all doom and gloom just because 3 years IS too long for me to have no progress, also know that it doesn't look like it's going to be that way either because of the changes I've made and because of my wife at least getting the opportunity from me to know what's bugging me so much from time to time.

[GoatGal]

Grey,

It's funny that you didn't pick up on it, but in one of my last posts to you, there was an empathy test.

How do you think you did?

I know you don't know me, but we have been writing back and forth for weeks now.
Not a peep from you about how tough things are for me, it's just right back to you. I almost feel like you didn't read it because it wasn't about YOU.

And, off the top of my head, I can't recall you ever thanking anyone here for offering their time to help you.
The responses from you have pretty much been that we don't know what we're talking about it, while you justify why you have the right to see the situation the way you do and choose to feel so hurt by it.
It is extremely ego-centric.

The fact is, your situation is a relatively mild one in the big picture and there are so many positives, yet you don't see them or don't value them.

There is definitely a disconnect here.

As some vets have said, the way you come across here is indicative of your style of communication off this forum.


So probably you communicate in much the same way with your wife.

It's not a style that's going to do you a lot of good long term.

Just food for thought. No need to defend yourself. It is what it is.

Did you ever say why you've been in therapy? What are the issues that led you there? Just curious.

--GG

PS: What you focus on INCREASES, what you ignore, DIMINISHES.

[Grey]

I've thanked a bunch of people, many separate times, including in individual posts.


You asked why I'm in therapy; I'm in therapy because I like it, frankly. It was great for me after med school, then I moved out of state. I doubt I'll ever stop therapy---it's a fantastic tool. I've said it before and I'll say it again, not everybody needs therapy, but every one of us can benefit from it.

I don't mean to make it sound like I don't care about you or anyone else just because I don't ask a lot of questions. But this is my first experience with forums. I think the most frustrating part is I'm not coming across right and the format isn't exactly the most effective way of communicating, let alone giving life-changing advice.

But to say I don't value the positives is inaccurate. It's grossly inaccurate, actually. I'm not offended, I just really don't think this forum (or any forum, for that matter, albeit I'm inexperienced) is effective. For one, it's broken up; you can't read everything about the situation even in one thread. Second, people forget things, or maybe don't read them, maybe misinterpret them outright, or maybe I don't write them accurately enough. Still, me forgetting the positives in reality seems to be less accurate than others forgetting the positives I've written about, particularly therapy and changes as a direct result of talking with my wife.

I'll say it again---------I appreciate your help. I sincerely do. But no matter how good I do, nobody here will ever really know. I don't see a lot of success stories, and yet I feel like I'm having more success than most, and I'm grateful I found these books and some advice and therapy relatively quickly.

For what it's worth, I can't imagine what I would have been like since finding this forum if I hadn't found it. Hearing much worse stories DOES help put things into perspective (even if it doesn't completely eliminate my own problems immediately), and venting here is a good outlet----just TALKING about it is theraputic. I wish it had more to do with people directly trained by Michele and her research, but I learned the hard way.

[GoatGal]

My point is, you always have a "reason" why you respond the way you do.

It comes across as a lot of self-defense of your initial position and not a lot of movement away from that.


It's your call whether you want to make some changes in yourself, for yourself, or keep beating your head against the wall.