Have I any hope...?

[bashy]

Just read that back and felt a douchebag. I'll offer without mentioning money if I should offer at all?!

[bashy]

Well it really is all over. I blew it. Can't believe all I've worked towards in recent months was ruined by me giving into my emotions and doing the opposite of what I was meant to do.
I'll be brief:
Stayed in WAW on Sunday for Father's Day.
Had a lovely meal with WAW and D.
D went to bed.
WAW and I had a bottle of wine and chatted about her.
I listened and asked her loads of questions about her potential college course etc.
This is when it spiralled out of control.
She talked about my faults in marriage which I've gone over in earlier posts.
I agreed with her but then proceeded to blow it all by firstly going on about how that wasn't the real me, I've changed (which she agreed with) and that I think she has feelings for me still. I ask why she took me back the last time we split when I dumped her. She says it was because I told her I'd win her back and I was persistent.
This went on. Spiralled out of control. I told her I had dated once but it didn't feel right becuase I loved her. She then tells me she has met someone.... I go quiet. Not angry. Ask things about him. She backtracks saying it's nothing serious. Propbably won't last (I get the feeling it was to shut me up going on about us - it worked). I walked away. Then calmed down. Told her I was happy for her.
Next day after sleeping in separate beds. All is normal. Small talk. I leave D to school and go home. On way home she texts me for info. on broadband. I flirt with her. She replies with lol. I ring and tell her I love her, I will not give up on her. We will get back together and I will be there for her and D no matter who she meets.
Then I get home and ring her again to ask will she come for a day trip on my birthday in a few weeks with me. Shes at work and stressed. This makes things worse. Tells me it isn;t a good idea. That it's over. She doesn't love me etc etc etc

So i'm in a down place right now. Haven't contacted her at all since then (two days now), have just made my first appointment with a councillor, but have never felt as low even when she first said she was splitting with me.

I feel my heart has been ripped open again and feel like giving up. I know in my heart of hearts she loves me but is sooo damn stubborn and scared.

Please someone help.

[pilot]

The good thing about DB is odds are you did not kill yourself with one bad day. Probably set yourself back a bit, but just refocus on working on you, and keep with the DB, and that is your best shot at a better life with our without your W.

[Thornton]

IMO you need to stay dark. She told you some things (remember don't believe anything she says) and you need to back off.

You started pursuing her, its time for a 180, go radio silent.

Just my opinion..

[bashy]

I agree Thornton. I can't keep this up. It's killing me. No more contact unless it's D related or her dad gets badly sick again.

[bashy]

Well it seems that me detaching and not always being there for WAW has hit her hard. I informed her that I would be stopping mortgage payments but starting paying child maintenance as I need my own place and because our house is lost ie negative equity by 48,000 etc.
She asked could I help pay her deposit plus go as guarantor on a new place for her and she doesn't have anyone despite having a big family.
I said no as I can't take risk of her temporary job ending and me being left to pay her rent.
She went ballistic. Told me I'd have to take daughter full time and that this was all for D and not her.
I stood my ground and said no. I simply have to concentrate on my life and a new home for me and D.
Huge row which ended in me not giving in.
I wonder what's next?!?!

[loualea]

Hi Bashy
that is a consequence of leaving you and not being a boring housewife.. she gets to have and pay her own mortgage.. no one goes guarantor for a stranger..which is what she has decided she wants.with you

I think standing your ground is the logical thing to do. she can not have it both ways...
Loua.

[bashy]

So collected the D today from WAW and had a chat with her after our row. We both apologised and said we shouldn't have rowed like this within earshot of D.
We talked candidly about plans for selling home and, despite what I said in the posts above, I offered to go guarantor. The reason? I will be remaining with my dad which gives me, for the first time ever, substantial disposable income to enjoy life ie GAL and live a little after struggling for years supporting my family. As such I am fine with securing a home for my D and reassurances from WAW that if anything did happen in future that could result in me being liable for rent that she would ensure that it doesn't. Although I suppose this can never be certain!
Anyway, we briefly talkedabout our chat on Sunday and the fact that supposedly she has a new man. And one thing struck me which has been mentioned in other posts by vets....I LISTENED TO WHAT SHE WAS SAYING and I noticed something for the first time but which has been a recurring thing when she has discussed our breakup.... she said that I needed to give her the space that she give me when we broke up before. Now this may not seem substantial to anyone reading this but she has said this at least a half dozen times to me. It is as if she wants me to step back to see how she feels about herself, about us and about her future and what she wants.
I told her I hoped she would be happy with this new person. She said she hopes so too and then jokingly said would I like to know his name.... WTF!!! What did that mean. Then she again brought up the fact that I had dated a girl in recent months. Truly it was for a bite to eat and cinema but I realised immedately that I could not hurt her because I loved my WAW. My WAW asked me what did she look like and a few other things that I now forget. But I wonder why she did that?
I know we shouldn't try and mind read but this converation today got me thinking. Is she testing me? Does she still have feelings for me but is scared of me going back to my old ways?
One thing I can say is that I feel much better that we are getting on again and patched things up despite the fact she might have another man. Another thing is I feel really good knowing I am going to have money for the first time in years to do things Ive always wanted to do and take my D places whenever I feel like. My first counselling session will start next week and I know there will be blips along the way but as of right now I feel much better.
ANy thoughts on what my WAW said would be greatly appreciated.

[bashy]

So it's been a strange week. For the first time since I started this process i've really discovered what detaching means. It doesn't just mean going dark... but detaching myself from my WAWs life/problems/concerns/worries etc.
I've been trying to do that but, and there is always a but with me, she has been in constant contact this week about trying to get a new place for her and D as well as organising a financial adviser for applying for an IVA.
While I really don't mind helping her she really only ever contacts me now when she needs a favour. Ofcourse, she'll say it's not for her but for our D, so I'm left to feel guilty.
However, I'm starting to feel something stir inside me. Is it anger, hurt, resentment? I'm not sure.
So today I was busy online looking at a few things to buy for myself when it's my WAW ringing. I decide to decline the call. She tries again. I decline. Fifteen minutes later another call. I decline it again. I text her and say I'll ring in 15 minutes.
30 minutes later she rings again after I don't get back to her. I decline the call. I wait an hour and ring her. The first thing she asks is "Where were you doing?' with a kind of nosey laugh. 'Just busy with stuff', I say. She goes on to talk about her new place she's trying to get.
My question is.... what the hell is going on and what do I do about it? Should I proceed with not answering calls like before? Making her wonder what I'm doing? Turn off my phone so I'm not tempted to answer?
She's toying with me and I can't deal with it!

[JayMan]

I think it's fantastic that you waited on the calls.

Not to be some ignorant jerk, but just to teach yourself patience, and that you can be in control of some situations.

Your W is obviously jealous - my W had an EA, and told me how wonderful her life was, and how great OM was, culminating in a one-night stand; then when I detached and basically ignored her, she came back, dropped OM, talked about how disgusting and humiliating it was that she had ever been with him, and she never spoke to him again. Later on, she told me it was totally unsatisfying sex, and that it just made her feel dirty and awful and used.

I can't say that's your exact scenario, but I do know that there is a significant power in saying, "I will be treated as a husband, and no less." Now, you MUST be an H in every sense of the word - maybe not romantically and physically right now, but don't you dare try to set a boundary, and not exemplify to your W the man you are trying to be!