The Lure of the Siren

[afa75]

Arsene,
Listen and follow the advice above. You know my sich, how they have helped me make it thus far. I obviously still have a long road to travel, bit they and You have made more it tolerable. You can do this.

[AlkalineThoughts]

Arsene I have a question for you.

Why do you protect your wife from feeling the agony she has caused you? How do you think she will ever learn if she does not know this knowledge?

Arsene: I think THIS ^^^^ is probably the most important post you've had on your thread yet. And it's one that you NEED to answer.

You don't have to answer it here, but you owe it to yourself to toss this around in your head and come to a true conclusion.

We ALL know that you love your W... That you're trying anything and everything to get back together with her.

But all of us outside of your situation are seeing the same thing... What you're doing now is simply NOT working.

For anyone.

Including your D.

I completely understand the social stigma you're dealing with here, and your reluctance to be open and honest with people you aren't particularly close with...

But the biggest issue I see is... well... You're not being honest with yourself right now.

You, much like me, are grasping at straws... searching high and low of ANY signs of a thaw in your situation...

But in that desperation to see progress, you're sabotaging the hard work you've been doing.

The facts are the facts here Arsene... While she MIGHT be rethinking her decision... she's taking ZERO action in rectifying the damage she's done.

A few posts on FB, a couple cryptic conversations, and spending a little more time at the house...

What you see as progress... I see as the strengthening of the limbo you're in...

JMO.

I read a LOT about you "getting back to backing off" and "going back to GALing"... and then a post or two later, you're talking about yet another asinine conversation your W baited you into.

And that wouldn't be a big issue if you were able to simply shrug it off and move on... but at this point... you can't... you analyze, you interpret, and you look for signs of life in the wastelands...

I guess I count myself lucky that my W isn't dropping by the house or trying to have conversations with me anymore...

But you know what? I'm pretty sure I created that lucky streak once I really and truly set the boundaries I set.

And It was the hardest thing I've had to do... To truly realize that I HAD TO stop grasping at every kind word she might say... every moment of doubt she had... and every dying ember of a doomed relationship... because my heart told me that if I tried hard enough, I could reignite that old flame...

But that old flame...

It burned out...

Or more accurately: It burned our F-in old relationship to the ground... and I had to stop staring at those smoldering ashes and remembering how great it USED to be...

Arsene, you HAVE to figure out how to let her go... You HAVE to let her try to find her own way in this world WITHOUT you... because as long as you're there to catch her when she stumbles, you'll be exactly where you are today...

And we all know that's not a place worth living in.

GET YOUR A$$ BACK IN THIS FOXHOLE PRIVATE.

[Denver_2010]

Arsene I have a question for you.

Why do you protect your wife from feeling the agony she has caused you? How do you think she will ever learn if she does not know this knowledge?

Arsene: I think THIS ^^^^ is probably the most important post you've had on your thread yet. And it's one that you NEED to answer.

You don't have to answer it here, but you owe it to yourself to toss this around in your head and come to a true conclusion.

We ALL know that you love your W... That you're trying anything and everything to get back together with her.

But all of us outside of your situation are seeing the same thing... What you're doing now is simply NOT working.

For anyone.

Including your D.

I completely understand the social stigma you're dealing with here, and your reluctance to be open and honest with people you aren't particularly close with...

But the biggest issue I see is... well... You're not being honest with yourself right now.

You, much like me, are grasping at straws... searching high and low of ANY signs of a thaw in your situation...

But in that desperation to see progress, you're sabotaging the hard work you've been doing.

The facts are the facts here Arsene... While she MIGHT be rethinking her decision... she's taking ZERO action in rectifying the damage she's done.

A few posts on FB, a couple cryptic conversations, and spending a little more time at the house...

What you see as progress... I see as the strengthening of the limbo you're in...

JMO.

I read a LOT about you "getting back to backing off" and "going back to GALing"... and then a post or two later, you're talking about yet another asinine conversation your W baited you into.

And that wouldn't be a big issue if you were able to simply shrug it off and move on... but at this point... you can't... you analyze, you interpret, and you look for signs of life in the wastelands...

I guess I count myself lucky that my W isn't dropping by the house or trying to have conversations with me anymore...

But you know what? I'm pretty sure I created that lucky streak once I really and truly set the boundaries I set.

And It was the hardest thing I've had to do... To truly realize that I HAD TO stop grasping at every kind word she might say... every moment of doubt she had... and every dying ember of a doomed relationship... because my heart told me that if I tried hard enough, I could reignite that old flame...

But that old flame...

It burned out...

Or more accurately: It burned our F-in old relationship to the ground... and I had to stop staring at those smoldering ashes and remembering how great it USED to be...

Arsene, you HAVE to figure out how to let her go... You HAVE to let her try to find her own way in this world WITHOUT you... because as long as you're there to catch her when she stumbles, you'll be exactly where you are today...

And we all know that's not a place worth living in.

GET YOUR A$$ BACK IN THIS FOXHOLE PRIVATE.

GREAT post AT ^^^

[chatterbug]

AT

Awesome post brother.

[Arsene]

I am just heading out Arnse. But you did not understand what I asked you.

I asked you about hiding yourself from her. Pretending that it is not ripping you apart on the inside. Always being upbeat and happy to see her when it is the furthest thing from the truth. Not letting her know how it ruining your heath and you are on anti-depressants so you can function day to day with her random drop-ins and D8's hurt and the consistent ongoing affair.
Nothing about shaming her in public. I do not know why you keep going back to that train of thought.

Is it because it made you uncomfortable so you had to deflect?

This is what DB recommends CB. I don't think that her seeing me sad and depressed and hurt is going to help my case in any way other than have her pity me, which I don't really want. I'm not acting "as if" to protect her CB, I'm doing it to protect myself in a way and to protect my D8 as well as to better my chances at making my W wonder if she is indeed doing the right thing. Again, that is what DB recommends. Is this what you are referring to?

Don't worry mate, I don't feel uncomfortable and didn't think I had deflected anything.

[Arsene]

We ALL know that you love your W... That you're trying anything and everything to get back together with her.

But all of us outside of your situation are seeing the same thing... What you're doing now is simply NOT working.

For anyone.

Including your D.

I completely understand the social stigma you're dealing with here, and your reluctance to be open and honest with people you aren't particularly close with...

But the biggest issue I see is... well... You're not being honest with yourself right now.

Yeah, I can see that mate! I've not been able to contemplate life without W. It just doesn't make sense.

You, much like me, are grasping at straws... searching high and low of ANY signs of a thaw in your situation...

But in that desperation to see progress, you're sabotaging the hard work you've been doing.

The facts are the facts here Arsene... While she MIGHT be rethinking her decision... she's taking ZERO action in rectifying the damage she's done.

I know and this is difficult to accept right now.

A few posts on FB, a couple cryptic conversations, and spending a little more time at the house...

What you see as progress... I see as the strengthening of the limbo you're in...

I have to disagree with you on this one. We went from arguing on a daily basis (or pretty much whenever we met) to actually talking and even enjoying each other's company. I know I'm not there yet but that is progress. I think my W has managed to get through her anger towards me and is starting to realise that there might be something worth thinking about. To me that is progress. As far as the FB stuff and all that you are right, I do let it affect me more than it should, considering what it is.

I do see where you might be coming from AT but with all due respect, our situations are very different and there is no one-size-fits-all solution. The issue of boundaries is one I have considered and one I am no ready to embrace just yet. Perhaps the day will come but that day is not today.

JMO.

I read a LOT about you "getting back to backing off" and "going back to GALing"... and then a post or two later, you're talking about yet another asinine conversation your W baited you into.

And that wouldn't be a big issue if you were able to simply shrug it off and move on... but at this point... you can't... you analyze, you interpret, and you look for signs of life in the wastelands...

I guess I count myself lucky that my W isn't dropping by the house or trying to have conversations with me anymore...

I don't know if I agree with you here either mate. When she stops showing an interest I'll be wondering. Right now, I like that she is interested, my issue is I don't like that I can't resist her. I want to keep her interested but distance myself from her emotionally and even physically.

But you know what? I'm pretty sure I created that lucky streak once I really and truly set the boundaries I set.

Again, not something I want to do now. I don't think this is the right time to set such a boundary as yours in my sitch.

And It was the hardest thing I've had to do... To truly realize that I HAD TO stop grasping at every kind word she might say... every moment of doubt she had... and every dying ember of a doomed relationship... because my heart told me that if I tried hard enough, I could reignite that old flame...

But that old flame...

It burned out...

Or more accurately: It burned our F-in old relationship to the ground... and I had to stop staring at those smoldering ashes and remembering how great it USED to be...

Arsene, you HAVE to figure out how to let her go... You HAVE to let her try to find her own way in this world WITHOUT you... because as long as you're there to catch her when she stumbles, you'll be exactly where you are today...

Yup mate. That I have to do. Total agreement with you on this. The toughest thing to do as well.
Much easier said than done when there is a kid involved as well as the constant contact which is now needed for me to stay in this country.

And we all know that's not a place worth living in.

GET YOUR A$$ BACK IN THIS FOXHOLE PRIVATE.

Thanks for your time AT. I truly appreciate your input. Cheers!

[Arsene]

I wasn't trying to slam you Arsene. I just think that if you can't tell someone, 'I don't know if you know, but my W and I are currently separated', then you are protecting her, and you are silently in denial of reality. You are trying to pretend that things are different than they really are. In fact, I see you doing this with your daughter in some ways. I'm just not sure how healthy it is for her, and you, to continue living your lives with the idea that your W will be coming home. It is what is right now. And you should always live life acknowledging what IS... IMO. Hopefully that 'IS" changes and you can begin living life with a new reality... but not yet.

If any of that makes sense...

It is hard Arsene. No one is saying that it isn't.

I didn't take offense Denver. I know and understand what you are saying and I have been thinking about it for a while. Perhaps that is why yesterday I mentioned it to a few people at work, to begin to make it more real to ME. It still feels unreal mate.

I still don't think I was doing it to protect my W, though. Really, it was more to protect my reality, or my embellished vision of reality. I suppose I told myself that once it is final, I'll tell people but as long as I'm in limbo, it's no one's business (and really, I still don't think it is in many ways). In this country you learn to answer what people expect you to answer and avoid lengthy explanations. The thing is, the way my life looks right now, what the heck do I need to make it final? It does look pretty final right now, doesn't it?

Thanks Denver,

[Arsene]

Between males telling them this allows the other males to step up and carry the work load for awhile. But in time it also allows them to step up and tell Arnse to step up and commit to his responsibilities at work again.

I am speaking from a male point of view. No disrespect intended Tori.

Thanks CB but this doesn't apply as I'm self employed and if I stop committing to my responsibilities at work, my D8 doesn't eat. That is motivation enough.

I teach in-company and therefore am not part of the staff. Every one there is my student, including the big boss. I don't really have "colleagues" and most of my students speak so little English that this level of conversation would be very difficult. There is also a very stiff student-teacher rapport in this country which makes opening up to students almost impossible.

[Arsene]

I kindly disagree. At work, it's no one's business that you and your W are separated, unless you and your coworkers are friends.
Family? that's another story. They don't need details, though.

I do agree that you must let your W travel her own path, though.

Agreed Tori. My family knows. My close friends know. Most people I see more a few times a month know, either through gossip or because they've been privy to a conversation. I didn't think I was hiding it from anyone but I also didn't feel the need to advertise it to everyone.

[Arsene]

Thanks Bill,

Good post. I see what you're saying mate. I guess I've answered it in my answer to Denver. Cheers!