thank you, starsky. thanks for helping me feel better and taking an interest in me. btw, i LOVED that movie, "heaven can wait". i've watched it many times! i remember the endscene very well!
M:63 H:53 S:41, SS:28, SS:25, SD:23 M:15 T:16
Bomb:12/17/11, "I think we should go our separate ways." H moves to his mother's house, 4/1/12 12/21/12: H moves back home, piecing
It's one of my all-time favorite movies. I still get the chills when Julie Christie looks at Warren Beatty and says "Wait . . . you're the quarterback, aren't you!"
if anyone out there has accuray's post about resentment, will you please give me the link? i've been looking for it but i can't seem to get there... thank you, i need it.
M:63 H:53 S:41, SS:28, SS:25, SD:23 M:15 T:16
Bomb:12/17/11, "I think we should go our separate ways." H moves to his mother's house, 4/1/12 12/21/12: H moves back home, piecing
if anyone out there has accuray's post about resentment, will you please give me the link? i've been looking for it but i can't seem to get there... thank you, i need it.
I haven't had time to read your stich but RoRo said you were looking for a couple links. I'll come back and help more, but here are a couple posts for now. I've been posting a lot on JKS, HopingandPraying and Hurt84 lately.
Ok, I'm up to speed. I'm not sure if I can help you or not because I certainly haven't walked in your shoes, but I'll try. Feel free to correct or dismiss me if I'm off base.
When I was reading your initial post, I was thinking "scaredsilly doesn't set and enforce boundaries". I was feeling like you were letting your stepchildren steamroll you and cry to daddy as it were whenever you would try to crack down. The stories about your stepchildren made me nuts. Did you ever watch that show "Nanny911"? The "recipe" for poorly behaved kids on that show was a mother who screamed and yelled but never really enforced anything, and a father who was just checked out and didn't participate in the parenting beyond complaining to the mother that she was yelling at the kids too much.
I'm not saying you play that role, but it seems like your husband may, that he doesn't effectively parent. He wants the love but not the hard work.
I started second guessing myself when you talked about the fact that he felt you were too strict with the kids, maybe you DO enforce your boundaries.
Here's where I'm uncertain -- you can indicate displeasure but then not enforce it. The problem with that is that everyone involved is stuck in a repeating pattern. "I don't like this, but I don't feel strongly enough to make a big issue of it". That lets the offender continue to offend, and everyone to feel badly about your reaction to the whole situation. They know you're unhappy, you're probably unpleasant to be around, the bad behavior continues, lather, rinse, repeat.
If that's your cycle, then creating and enforcing consequences would be the way to break out. If the stepdaughter cooks for friends and doesn't contribute to grocery expenses, you stop putting anything in the refrigerator until what she took is replaced, and you don't give in. You adopt a zero tolerance policy until things are better. This, of course, assumes that your expectations are realistic, and that you've made them known ahead of time. Since this woman is living in her father's house, and she never had to pay for food growing up, she may reasonably expect that she can take what she likes. You'd need to set the expectation up front that you don't enjoy grocery shopping for SD's friends, and that if SD wants to cook for them you expect she'll contribute to the grocery budget and clean up whatever mess she makes. It's all about setting and managing expectations.
What do you think? Do you think you've had unspoken rules?
Do you think you've had lines and boundaries but didn't take action to enforce them?
Did you get stuck in repeating patterns of disappointment?
The other thing I was thinking is that these kids bully you because they know they have more influence with their father than you do. I was wondering if confronting them directly to "clear the air" would help. The stereotypical bully situation is that if you take on the bully, they'll then start to respect you and a friendship can develop. Have you tried to just have it out with them directly? Let them know where you stand, what you'll tolerate, and what you will not?
It seems like your relationship with the stepdaughter will have to get worse before it gets better, but that until you make peace with her, there will be no peace with H.
H clearly feels torn between you and his kids, understands the tension there between you, and can't bring himself to side with you over them. This bothers you, and becomes a wedge in your marriage that creates a constant force to drive you apart. I would imagine that H wants relief from that tension more than anything, which is why when he felt that you agreed to divorce, he finally felt that he could have you both. He can now have a relationship with you that his kids will not object to, and a relationship with them that you don't need to be a part of.
That's my dimestore analysis and I could be way off, but I'm curious about how you feel about these things.
Accuray
Married 18, Together 20, Now Divorced M: 48, W: 50, D: 18, S: 16, D: 12 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 7/13/11 Start Reconcile: 8/15/11 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 5/1/2014 (Divorced) In a New Relationship: 3/2015
OMG! i think your last paragraph is right! i never thought of it that way. luckily, his daughter no longer lives with us. and she did ignore the boundaries i set but if i went to her father, i was the villain. so she and i just had a horrible relationship the last year she was there. i was retired and she was always there. he father was out of town six months of the year.
i see the hard feelings between his daughter and i as the problem he can't deal with. i don't know how to fix it. i went to the daughter's house after the bomb and apologized to her for my actions (not my feelings but my reactions to them, however i didn't say that to her). i told her i could have reacted differently and that i was sorry.
it seems she and her father have been talking about it all and of course, he feels sorry for her and blames me. he's said that he, "pushed my children away for you".
i just don't know how to get to where he does not feel he has to make a choice? he asked me how i would act if them came to visit (when he as still living here). i told him i would treat them with love and respect. but i'm not getting the chance to prove that to him. he doesn't live here so i never see them together.
i've read a lot lately and i've come to believe he suffers from guilty daddy syndrome.
he says he loves me, "very, very much". i love him very much, too. but the kids (mainly daughter, sons are not a problem) between us.
i sent him a link to retrouvaille and asked him if it would be something he would consider. i said it's a place for "last resort" marriages and that it would be a lot cheaper than a divorce (he's very frugal). he said he would take a look at it.
do you think i should suggest a three-way meeting with his daughter, him, and i?
thank you for looking in on me. i value your opinion so much. i've read a lot of your posts and you seem so wise.
M:63 H:53 S:41, SS:28, SS:25, SD:23 M:15 T:16
Bomb:12/17/11, "I think we should go our separate ways." H moves to his mother's house, 4/1/12 12/21/12: H moves back home, piecing
I would only apologize to his daughter if you felt you were in the wrong. That wasn't the confrontation I had in mind. It would go more like "I feel like you don't respect me. I'm married to your father, I'd like to stay married to your father, but I also have limits in terms of how I will be treated. I'm not asking you to like me, but I would like to find a way for us to have a relationship based on mutual respect. We have had some tough times in the past that both of us contributed to, I'm willing to let that go. What do you need from me to feel that we can have a productive relationship?" etc. etc. etc. Listen to what she has to say, validate what you agree with. If you don't agree, tell her so, but do it from the perspective of looking for compromise versus arguing. It's ok to agree to disagree. You're looking to be conciliatory, but you're not looking to be submissive, now or in the future.
It might be that after she has that conversation with you a weight will lift from her shoulders as well because she'll know you're not holding a grudge and the air has been cleared.
I would not do that with H present, I would do it one-on-one, and then tell H you did it, but don't go into the details.
Even though she no longer lives with you, you will still need to set and enforce boundaries, and clearly going to H is not effective enforcement. You need to think about how you can enforce your boundaries yourself via what you will and will not do. "I will not be spoken to like that, if you speak to me in that manner, I will simply walk away". "I will not clean up after you. If you leave dirty dishes, they will stay dirty until you or your father wash them". Those consequences are about what YOU will do.
Labug may be able to help you more as I know she's done quite a bit of work on boundary setting.
I definitely think the key to your sitch lies in reaching an accord with the daughter without H involved at all. You'd almost benefit from going to an MC with her versus H.
That's not to say that you're going to come out with a Hallmark holiday card relationship with her, just a relationship that you both understand and agree to. You could then present that to H as "the way things are going to be" and he can accept or reject it. If he's willing to work with you, then you'll need to set boundaries there too -- H shouldn't take sides. He should just excuse himself and tell the two of you to work it out. That way he doesn't have to make choices. If either one of you comes to him to complain about the other, he should tell you to "talk to the hand". That way, he can have whatever relationship he wants with both of you without getting caught in the middle.
This is going to come down to boundary setting and enforcement assuming you can hammer out an understanding with SD, that would be your simultaneous challenge.
Accuray
Married 18, Together 20, Now Divorced M: 48, W: 50, D: 18, S: 16, D: 12 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 7/13/11 Start Reconcile: 8/15/11 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 5/1/2014 (Divorced) In a New Relationship: 3/2015
thank you. that's very good advice. however, my stomach gets into knots when i think about trying to talk to her. we have not spoken since the time i went to see her in december.
i could call her but i'm sure she would see it's me and not answer. i could text her but she probably wouldn't reply.
also, with her father and i separated and with him living with his mom, i wonder if she would feel she doesn't have to communicate with me. i'm no longer in good standing so she will have even less respect for me.
do you think i should ask her father to facilitate a meeting between the two of us? i don't feel as if i command respect from either of them right now and they may feel i'm overstepping my boundaries without his blessing.
but without a better relationship with her, i know he will choose to stay apart.
M:63 H:53 S:41, SS:28, SS:25, SD:23 M:15 T:16
Bomb:12/17/11, "I think we should go our separate ways." H moves to his mother's house, 4/1/12 12/21/12: H moves back home, piecing
