It's really all about connecting/listening/validating. Really, the listening/connecting/validating will "fix" alot more than any explanation you can provide. If she feels understood and heard, she will feel so much safer with you.
I love this, Busto.
Me: 32 H: 32 M 9 yrs #1 D7 #2 S5 #3 D2 Bomb 8/12/11 H moved out 8/14/11 PA started w/H & OW in 1/12 - found out 3/24/12 Got my own place 8/25/12 H & OW move in together 9/15/12 Still married.
Crimson, thank you so much for sharing your story about your dinner with your W and S. Your words towards the end of your post were so profound and a great deal can be learned from just that one post. I'm excited for you and for the turn of events that are starting to happen. Well done!
Me: 32 H: 32 M 9 yrs #1 D7 #2 S5 #3 D2 Bomb 8/12/11 H moved out 8/14/11 PA started w/H & OW in 1/12 - found out 3/24/12 Got my own place 8/25/12 H & OW move in together 9/15/12 Still married.
Crimbo - you continue to grow and it is very obvious from your posts that you have achieved so much by being brutally honest with yourself. The greatest thing I see in you is your newfound ability to live in the moment.
Think of how you just changed a pattern that had been ingrained in you your entire life, one that threatened your family. Think of how hard that is to do, and then it makes it easier to see how you W is struggling with her own questions, the depth of them.
Your journey is very inspirational and many should look to it as a success story.
I am going to title this post: "DEALING WITH THE AFTERMATH".
So as I was leaving IC yesterday (it went well, BTW)w texted that she needed help fixing the garbage disposal at her place - it was backed up and not grinding. I told her that I would go home, grab some tools and head over to take a look at it.
I got over there and played with s for a little bit and then tackled the repair. When I was finished w made some dinner for me (ironically from the leftovers I gave her when she came over for dinner on Sunday). She poured some wine for us and we just kinda goofed around with our soo for awhile. During that time I mangaged to fix a few other minor things at her place. It felt good to be "useful".
We put the baby to sleep and I was fully prepared to leave - but she asked if I wanted to sit on the patio with her for awhile. She poured a bit more wine and we began to chat. I'll skip to the meat of this so you can understand the title above.
Issue #1: Our friend. I think w is reaching a point where she really wants to try again - though we are not "there" yet. What I discovered was that she has some residual issues not necessarily with me, but with a very good friend of ours that I "got in the divorce". When the bomb dropped I stayed with her for about a week as I tried to compose myself. In the meantime, friend had somehow mangaged to ask w once or twice if there was "someone else". I remember at the time wife bellowing on the phone "If that is what she thinks of me then we can just sever all ties!". Apparently w is of the belief that if our friend knew her that long and thought that she would leave me for someone else then she didn't want to be friends with her.
It's a problem because this friend was very much a part of our lives, and she has been a stable spot for me during this whole ordeal. W said that after everything is resolved she doubts she can ever be friends with her again. She said that if I want to hang out with her separately, or with her and our s - fine. But she wants no part of her. Mostly, if not exclusively, because she asked w if she was cheating and w was deeply offended and insulted. They were friends, hung out together, appreciated one another - and she is still in my life. How do I manage this? Is it temporary? Will she ever forgive? Am I suppposed to carve this person out of my life?
Issue #2: Her dad. I didn't expect this, but her father really soured on me during this process. Felt that I basically left w (his daughter!) to suffer in the wind and made everything "about me" during this process. I think he felt that I should have been giving her money and providing for her after she left. He saw his daughter in bad, bad, bad shape physically, mentally and emotionally and traced the root cause to me - and felt like I did nothing to help her. I told her that during that period I felt that her moving out was her establishing her independence and ANY help from me would be read as "you can't do this on your own, let me help" - I felt that she would resent it. As it turns, out - she wanted help from me but never asked for it (well, I guess she did through her lawyer). I think this really angered her father. I get it, it's about him not wanting to see his daughter suffering in the manner that she was. However, I think he is of the belief that I was fat, drunk and happy over at my place looking for ways to destroy his daughter's life. That just wasn't the case. Hell, I am finally getting w to understand that wasn't the case either. It's funny that she has a total different recollection of events than I do. She swears that I said "I'm not giving you a dime!" and I have no memory of that. She also says that I threatened to kick her off of my health insurance when what I actually said was "you won't have health insurance if we are separated/divorced". It's as if she felt that I was being intentionally cruel and threatening when the fact of the matter is I was deeply hurt and scared. Yes, that did make me angry at times - but it was not the dominant emotion AT ALL. Remember when I bought her the bed? I told her if I was that angry and wanted her to suffer I never would have done that - I told her that it broke my heart to know she was sleeping on the floor.
Now it seems that she has conveyed a monsterous image of me to her dad and step-mother that they are fully bought into. I agree that I wasn't the best husband ever, but I never, ever sought to hurt her. My heart was breaking, I wanted her back and I was just trying to find a way to deal with the pain. It was like I was 90% dead on the inside and expected to function and rationalize like normal.
When she told him that I wrote "the letter" and read some of it to him she said all he really said was "nope....you have given him 8 years of your life.....move on....he's making it all about him".
I had a good relationship with her father, I told him to never worry because I was taking good care of his daughter....I thought I was. Now I feel awful because in his eyes I violated that and left his daughter (and grandson!) in the cold to suffer. How do I deal with this if/when the time comes? It seems as though he views me as a monster now. W told me that he has issues from his marriage to w's mom and may be projecting some things on me. Still - it's hard to navigate.
Issue #3: The house. W said that she doesn't know if she could ever move back into our house again because of emotional reasons. She asked if I would ever consider moving. Which I am OK with, but like most of our state/county we are upside down a wee bit and couldn't really sell. How do I make my way around this? I like the house, don't want to move and can't afford to move anyway right now. Will she ever be able to live comfortably there again? Is there anything I can do that would help her feel more at home there?
Sorry for the novel. Just have a lot to process. W texted me this morning to see if I made it home OK, she thanked me for all my help around the house and told me not to take on any shame or guilt because of how her father feels.
Crimson - a few quick thoughts (typing on my blackberry is difficult).
Sounds like some very promising developments. Regarding the friend, it is probably best for you to simply validate your W's feelings on the matter. Time will tell if there is ever to be an opportunity to resurrect the R with the friend. If you and your W are able to R then the capacity is there for your W to forgive and maybe there will come a time with the friend as well.
The issue with the house is not uncommon. I think it was Busto who said he had to sell his house for the same reason as your W has indicated. Being under water is a drag but perhaps you could lease to someone else untill the market improves.
Regarding her father, I think you are going to have to let your W work through this with her father. There is probably no constructive thing you can do at this point. At least not until you and your W have fully reconciled. I think this is why we are often told to be very careful about what we say and who we tell about the issues in our sitch's. For me, I've not discussed the "specifics" of my sitch with anyone other that my IC. I did not want to have to deal with untangling messes if we get back together, so I keep my mouth shut.
All in all, things are really looking up for you! Bravo!
Me51 W53 S17 S14 M22 T25 Bomb-9/11; A-11/11; I move out 11/11
It's easy to find our bottom, it is our top that requires cultivation.
Every rough spot adds to our emotional constitution. -Barney Fife
I think you can let all of these issues wait for now. There is not much you can do about your w's relationship with your mutual friend. Just validate her feelings and let her handle it unless she asks you do to something specific. I mean, I wouldn't go out and invite your w and this friend together to dinner anytime soon, but I can't see that there's anything affirmative for you to do in this sitch.
The image of you that your fil has will have to be broached initially by your w if you do R. She is one who told her dad these things and she will have to approach him when the time comes. You can help by doing your part to make your relationship with him as smooth as possible and try to understand where his antagonism is coming from (it sounds like you already do). The only thing I can think of to do right now is to affirm to your w that you would value a good relationship with your fil again someday. That way she doesn't feel that there would be bad feelings on both sides if she decides to R with you.
As for the house, maybe you could get some information from a real estate agent as to its market value, lease value, etc. and present it to w if she asks about it again. That way, she knows that you took her concerns seriously. I wouldn't jump the gun and put the house on the market right away or anything. But just do some research in the meantime so you can respond to her when she raises the issue again.
All good stuff!
Mimi
M:37; H:37; M:10 years;T:13 years;no kids. Bomb ("I love you, but don't feel things for you I should":1/08/12 Separated (H living with various friends:1/18/12 Separated (H rented his own apartment:3/4/12
