Working on LRT to Something else???

[AlwaysTrying]

I was thinking of how much I would have liked a button or pill or magic charm that would allow me to, after I have decided how to handle a situation, stop thinking about it. It's so easy to obsess over an OM or EA.

I apologize if I've already plugged this, but I'm reading a book called "Mindfulness: Finding peace in a frantic world". The book teaches techniques to allow thoughts like those you were having to pass by instead of derailing your whole day. I've found it really helpful. You can read about it here: http://franticworld.com/ or here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Mark_G._Williams

The techniques used in the book have several benefits including decreasing the likelihood of depression, allowing you to be more focused and effective, being able to enjoy the moment you are in instead of focusing on the past or future, and improving memory and a bunch of other weird stuff.

Maybe I've already mentioned it... sorry.

[ces67]

Thanks AT,

Right now I just ordered "No More Mr. Nice Guy". I've mentioned earlier that it feels like I need a catalyst to move things along. Maybe I'm suppose to be the catalyst and just don't know how.

I mentioned earlier that my brother found out from a friend about the pic of W and OM. We talked today. Now I'll first say my brother is my best friend and would do absolutely anything for me. But he was upset, not so much at me but for how he sees my W treating me and how he feels I'm letting it happen. Maybe he's right.

Sandi2 even asked earlier about my confusion between DB techniques and being a doormat. I think I'm really struggling to understand how my normal habits of non-confrontation are contributing to my issues.

My W did put away the t-shirt she normally keeps in the bathroom. This is the one from the OM's drum corp (friend's H). Now we'll see if she gets it back out after her friend leaves.

It also dawned on me that W talked about getting this job with friend and OM to help out. But so far all she's done is spend it on herself and has not helped at all with our bills.

Feeling a little lost for direction this evening. I trust I will be OK, but still feels like I need to do something different and I just can't figure out what that is.

It also occurred to me while talking to my brother, how uncomfortable I am when people are angry with me. I know my brother loves me but it still made me so uncomfortable to listen to him be upset. When I can take emotion out of things, I do very well (work). But with this stuff, I just feel paralyzed to know what to do. Feel like a major wimp admitting that but may as well put it out there so I can deal with it.

[2thepoint]

"It also occurred to me while talking to my brother, how uncomfortable I am when people are angry with me. I know my brother loves me but it still made me so uncomfortable to listen to him be upset. When I can take emotion out of things, I do very well (work). But with this stuff, I just feel paralyzed to know what to do. Feel like a major wimp admitting that but may as well put it out there so I can deal with it."

I don't remember CES, but are you seeing a C? If not you muight wnat to consider doing so. They can help you understand and manage your conflict avoidance issues. It might also help out in other areas of your life.

BTW, I don't think conflict avoidance makes you a wimp.

Something else to also think about. If conflict avoidance is a problem for you, where might the emotions come out in other areas of your life? I mean, if you put a lot of energy in one area it usually mean that another area is being neglected. Conversely, if you don't put energy in an area that might otherwise require it, where is that energy going instead.

Hmmmm

[labug]

You're not a wimp, you just learned coping behaviors that served you well at one time but are not useful any more. You can learn to handle conflict well but it takes work. Learning these techniques is a good thing for all involved in the conflict.

If I can do it, anyone can.

[purgatory]

[b]
Something else to also think about. If conflict avoidance is a problem for you, where might the emotions come out in other areas of your life? I mean, if you put a lot of energy in one area it usually mean that another area is being neglected. Conversely, if you don't put energy in an area that might otherwise require it, where is that energy going instead.

Hmmmm

This ^^^^^^ is a great insight!
I was the opposite of you ces. I would almost go looking for a fight- didn't matter who or what. The whole family (in-laws included) were afraid to make me mad because of the 'attack' that was sure to come. In my therapy, I explored possible reasons and underlying motivations for such anger/aggression. We discovered that throughout my life, if I was kind, open and vulnerable with friends- I would be taken advantage of. So I developed the idea (un-known to my conscience brain) that if I could keep people at arm's length and never let them get too close- I could avoid being hurt (see, I avoided too.) Sadly, I brought this same approach into my M- with the one person who would never exploit my vulnerabilities.

Sorry to hijack- but 2TP's comment struck something in me.

[AlwaysTrying]

I'm glad you ordered the Nice Guy book. It covers exactly the area you are describing. Like Labug said, these are old coping behaviors that won't work for you any more and you can un-learn.

some quotes from the book:

More than anything, Jason wanted to be liked. He saw himself as a very generous, giving person. He prided himself on not having many ups and downs and for never losing his temper. He revealed that he liked to make people happy and that he hated conflict. To avoid rocking the boat with his wife, he tended to hold back his feelings and tried to do everything "right."

For Nice Guys, these survival mechanisms took the form of the following life paradigm:
● IF I can hide my flaws and become what I think others want me to be
● THEN I will be loved, get my needs met, and have a problem-free life.

It is this paradigm, formed in childhood, that guides and controls everything Nice Guys do in their adult lives. Even though it is based on faulty interpretations of childhood events, it is the only road map these men have. Nice Guys believe this map is accurate, and if they follow it correctly, they should arrive at their desired location — a smooth, happy life. Even though this life script is often highly ineffective, Nice Guys frequently just keep trying harder, doing more of the same, hoping for different results.

[ces67]

Thanks all,

2 - I do see a counselor but not on a regular basis. I did call yesterday and have an appointment monday morning. You're right in that human nature typically shows that if we hold stuff in, it will eventually come out in other ways that are less healthy. For me, early in my M the lack of conflict came out in melancholy type behaviors. I wasn't pleased so my moping behavior was how I expressed it. Looking back that was probably very passive-aggressive of me and may be where my W felt controlled.

I think the struggle still exists to some degree in my current sitch. But given that I know my W doesn't really care about how I feel, I work to just GAL and show a happy ces. I will definitely be talking to my IC about this.

Labug - I went to a men's retreat back in October where a lot of these same issues came up for me. At that retreat they said the very same thing you did. My behavior was a way to cope that worked for a while and now it doesn't and I have to find a healthier way to cope. Still learning what that looks like though. Thanks for the encouragement.

P - yep, different coping mechanism, same result - keeping people at a distance. Its interesting, the way you describe how your in-laws felt towards you is how I have felt towards my W and also how my family nows feels towards her. She hasn't always been as angry as she is now, but I have certainly lived with the criticism. This goes back to what 2 was saying and I need to spend some more time diving into that topic.

AT - I read the first few pages of the book online and definitely saw myself. The quote you listed above:

"To avoid rocking the boat with his wife, he tended to hold back his feeelings and tried to do everything 'right.'"

That fits me to a T. I kept trying to get it right and when the criticism and unhappiness kept coming from my W then I just felt like a failure and withdrew even more. I often felt more valued and appreciated at work than I ever did at home and while I didn't live at the office, I certainly applied myself there more.

Only 1 more day of the friend invastion. My interactions with the friend have been good but there still seem to be times when she looks like she expecting me to go off or act crazy or something. W actually talked a little with me about the kids show last night. Friend wasn't even around to see it.

My brother is very frustrated because he doesn't understand what I am trying to accomplish with the DB tactics. I also have to continue questioning if I am using them effectively or am I mis-applying them to fit my conflict avoidance ways. As I've said, I've seen small signs of hope but overall, but still no actual efforts towards our marriage. Our joint MC stopped back in September of last year and the limbo continues.

[Rick1963]

Ces yes it is a marathon. Sometimes I just want to say ef it. But I still have hopes that it will work out. My brother stopped telling me to give up since he knows where I stand and he is supportive now. People have DBed for years before anything positive happened. I am sorry to tell you but we are very new to this. We are at the beggining stages. So there is a long road ahead. I too do not like conflict the difference is that after a while I would blow up. Keep posting it really helps to look at what you write and get a picture of who you are. Have a great one

[AlwaysTrying]

It makes me sad that people act like you're from another planet for trying so hard to fix a marriage rather than give in to your hurt pride.

Most people got married for a reason. Figure it out and get back there. It makes me really sad for the kids involved that people are too self-centered to work through their problems.

[ces67]

I think its like the book describes. These are people that care about us and are more concerned about "ending our pain" so to speak as opposed to restoring our marriage. Intentions are good but the benefit is rather short-term related to the ongoing challenges of a divorce.

I did get a little more information from a "legal consultant" by calling my company EAP group (vs. the website I looked at).

It certainly wasn't an optimistic outlook if I end up going the D route. All the more reason to deal with the financial and M issues now.