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#2227562 - 03/05/12 12:06 AM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: WenikiTiki]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
If that 180 of staying in bed earlier works for you and is something you want to keep doing, then by all means... Personally, I'm all in for enjoying the loving arms of a warm quilt in the morning... smile

I could quote everything you mentioned above as great stuff. That's exactly it. Talking about functional things if/as necessary. Responding to inquiries and not feeling the need to share (as opposed to withholding) when there are no inquiries.

See, once we're not in the "score keeping" mode, the R is much like a friend. Not perhaps a BFF, but friendly. If something comes out of your mouth, no big deal. If they're curious, you answer. But you don't have to be providing a detail list of your daily routine or your thoughts. And neither do you need to ask them about the details of their day nor their thoughts. If they offer, treat it as you would any friend. Of course, things like joining them on a trip to the store or for company or sharing thoughts and activities in alternative R's would probably be off limits in most cases. It depends on where a person is in this journey. As things approach 100% transparency (and possibly bff status), that might be possible again.

Just as an example, I took the kids for a little trip this weekend. My W booked the hotel for me, for whatever reason. Instead of telling her to mind her own business, or less confrontational telling her thanks, but no thanks, or even asking her why she was doing that... it was something she chose to do, so I just let it happen. The why's or what her thoughts and experience around that is none of my concern.

The week prior, she informed me that she wanted to have the kids next weekend for their own family outing (expiring tickets to an outdoor event). It bothered me because that was her reason for having the kids two weekends ago (which happened to be a five day weekend I COULD have had the kids)... so it seems "unfair", but the past is just that and I choose to continue living in the present and for the future. I had a negative thought, worked through it, and let it go.

My W decided to ask my oldest to pick some stuff up for her while we were on the trip. Rather than having her find her own method of getting the stuff, I didn't give it much thought. I know that my W was in fairly constant contact with my oldest. Again, I am no longer concerning myself with what the conversations are about or whether my W is inquiring about what "we" are doing, or perhaps even what I might be doing or saying. Again, I pretty much don't think about it, only to mention it here.

My W indicated to me that she was going out socially this weekend with the friends I know supported her emotional separation from me. This was done f2f when I picked up the kids and I KNOW I physically gave off a negative reaction, but quickly composed myself and let it go. When I dropped off the kids, there was someone there (female, W supportive and generally non-communicative with me) and conversation was friendly and engaging with both of them and it appeared that the day's social activities had been cut short for my W much earlier than she suggested on friday. I made no comment on that observation.

The point of all that is, as I mentioned in a prior post, while my W does not appear to be moving closer to me by any measure, she certainly appears much less confrontational or private about her life. And that is a HUGE step from where she was, even just 3 months ago.

I guess in summary, I can say this...

What I am doing, is working...

for me...

cool

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#2229735 - 03/12/12 04:03 AM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: ~ kd ~]
WenikiTiki Offline
Member

Registered: 11/10/11
Posts: 1073
Loc: Hawaii
I was redeading this and I noticed something that may be a problem for my H and I. You wrote about your W going out socially with friends who supported her emeotional separation from you.

My best friend made herself clear when she sent my H some texts when it all came out in the open about OW. She told him she wouldn't be his friend anymore if he divorced me.

I spend a lot of time with her, and H has brought up how she isn't his friend anymore, and he is very critical of her and her whole family. I wonder if he is mad about my continued friendship with her.

Thinking!
Wendy
_________________________
Me 54 XH 55 Sons age 29 & 24 M:32 T:33
D final 9/12
Sold the house, Progress is being made!

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#2229799 - 03/12/12 11:57 AM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: WenikiTiki]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
When all of this started for me, I had a couple friends who were "on my side" and made some comments to my W on their own accord. At the time, it kind of felt at least a BIT balanced, considering all the "friends" that supported my W and I know made derogatory remarks about me, even though not to my face. But I knew from the beginning and had it confirmed here, that type of thing only helps one feel "better", momentarily.

While I hoped to surround myself with people who would support my stand (and aside from those here... those people seem to not really exist IRL), I most certainly distanced myself from those who would decide to be my champions.

To be sure, that left me with very few friends that I could associate with. I have been very "lonely" over the past year and a half.

I've known and had been reminded here, that one cannot control another. So I cannot prevent someone from making negative comments to and about my W any more than I can control them from telling me to "get on with life, let her go", etc... and encouraging me to get out and meet new people and go on dates because I "deserve to be happy"...

So while inwardly, I have been struggling with feeling "safe" to be with those I was friends with pre-bomb and therefore disengaging with any and all who would attempt to sway me or encourage me one way or the other and therefore being lonely for the absence of familiar faces, outwardly I may be appearing to be in huge depression and withdrawing from the world and human contact. I am not concerned with how others may perceive my behaviour (although that's not entirely true and if confronted with my time spent alone, I do my best to articulate my choices).

For me, THAT is setting appropriate boundaries. It is DBing my friends (and family) in the same way that I have been DBing my W.

In saying the above, for me it is very clear that (while I still cannot say that I want to R with my W) I am being very careful to ensure there are no external barriers that would prevent an R with my W, other than my own (appropriate) personal behavioural changes that might be necessary. Because I KNOW how I would feel if my W suddenly wanted to R and I would have to associate with those whom asserted such negativity about me, to my W. And how it would be wrong of me to assert that she not be friends with these people who are familiar to her and "safe" for her. Or worse, having her family members "disown" her, if she chose to R.

Here is what we speak of in DB, though... repeated over and over, ad infinitum...

Do what works for you. Do the things that you can live the rest of your life with... Make choices that set the precedence for yourself into the future and do not change your core values or the "true you"... because choices to the contrary only create an unbalanced future for us...

Like the financial aspects of my SA (and potentially D), I was never concerned about the money. I KNOW I can always make more money. I also know that I can always make new friends. I can always remain friendly with those whom I have been friends with in the past, but I do not need to hold them close. I know I can protect myself and while it feels good and IT IS GOOD to have friends that you KNOW will have your back if something goes wrong... I have met a lot of people "out there" who would have my back, and not encourage negative behaviours in myself, nor act negatively towards my W in the name of "supporting" me...

We all know the saying that 25 has in her sig...

"Would you rather be right, or would you rather be married..."

That saying is not a judgement, but an open and honest question we need to ask ourselves.

It is OK to choose to be right...

It is OK to choose to be M...

It is OK to choose to associate with people who may not be M friendly...

It all depends on what our goals are...

It is up to your H to be mad about your friendships... not for you to change them BECAUSE he might be (or is) mad about it... rather for you to change it, if it is right for you...

In the same way, it is OK for me to be upset with and not associate with those people who spoke negatively about me, to my W.

IF my W wanted to R, I would have to make a choice to be with her which would include everything and anyone and any behaviour that comes with her...

BUT...

It is NOT my place to tell her to choose her friends over me... to choose her family over me... to let go of any behaviours she is attached to, in order to be with me...

That is her choice...

In the same way that I would not deny that right for anyone I might have a R with in the future...

In the same way that it is my right to change because I want to and not to placate my W or anyone else who might become involved with me in the future...

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#2229838 - 03/12/12 01:47 PM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: ~ kd ~]
WenikiTiki Offline
Member

Registered: 11/10/11
Posts: 1073
Loc: Hawaii
Very well put! Now to ponder it all.....

Thanks!

Wendy
_________________________
Me 54 XH 55 Sons age 29 & 24 M:32 T:33
D final 9/12
Sold the house, Progress is being made!

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#2231781 - 03/19/12 01:17 PM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: WenikiTiki]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
Over the past week I have been thinking more and more about moving on. I decided I am ready. I have also decided that I will file D if and when I am both ready and have reason to. If my W wants D sooner than that, it will be up to her.

I have a few things left at the house that I'll be making arrangements to get out of there. Anything else that she does not "tag" as mine for removal at that time, I'm not concerned about. She can toss that stuff. I wanted to wait until the weather got better as I did not want to risk damage to the items, so the weather is better...

I had come to this conclusion prior to picking the kids up this past weekend. There was some miscommunication around the "flex" schedule and I inadvertently and unintentionally appeared to have agreed to taking the kids to an event that I know they do not want to go to. I had not actually been contacted by the host of the event and made no personal commitment to the event host. I was also unclear about the schedule and we decided that I would have the kids for part of spring break.

I admitted that I misunderstood and did not intend to commit myself and the kids and that I was OK if my W wanted to take them next weekend.

It appears that my W is now punishing me for that choice and so has indicated it's not her problem and that I will have the kids for the weekend, back on Sunday... which... by omission, means that the spring break monday, tuesday, part wed is now not part of the flex agreement...

Totally expected...

Just journaling about it... I'm perfectly fine with that.

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#2231819 - 03/19/12 03:25 PM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: ~ kd ~]
25yearsmlc Offline
Member

Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 10308
Loc: west coast
KD

just so I have this straight...

did you decide to move on because of this miscommunication, and the follow up,

which appears punitive or thoughtless on her end, due to the "flex schedule" except

that she honestly thinks you agreed to?

Friend, I'm Just asking...
_________________________
m:51 H:55
M: 30 yrs
S25,D23,D15
H goes ALASKAN, solo,2005
I file Sep 2/06
Piecing 7/07
Retrovaille Weekend 8/08
M Restored 8/08

Be Happy OR be "Right"

FORGIVENESS: Your way out of hell

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#2231820 - 03/19/12 03:52 PM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: 25yearsmlc]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
Good question, 25.

Absolutely not moving on because of some specific event.

I did not want to move my stuff because of the weather, but I also did not want to move my stuff because they are 80 year old antiques that I don't want to get damaged in storage, so on the off chance that things might have been resolved between the two of us, it would be better for those items to move as little as possible.

I admit that this "punishment" on the flex schedule from my W is just a reminder of what I don't want, it was by no means the reason.

I'm ready to move on. Something I can honestly say I've been working myself to over the past 3 months. And I can honestly say that this behaviour from my W has not really had any affect what soever. As I mentioned, I actually expected some retaliation and grinned when I read the response.

I have truly accepted that my W's path is away from me. I have truly accepted that my path, precludes my W. And I'm really OK with that.

cool

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#2231823 - 03/19/12 04:03 PM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: ~ kd ~]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
Just to be clear, I completely understand that she may have felt that I agreed to what she was thinking when she originally "asked", which was "the kids have an event and I (she) thinks they should go" to which I responded, "ok, if you want them to go, then I'll be OK with that".

What I "heard" was that she committed them to the event and would be taking them. What she apparently heard was that she told me about the event and I agreed to take them.

Honest mistake on both parts. I actually asked my kids and they DO NOT want to go. And truth be told, neither did I. So when the miscommunication was brought to light, I let my W know that while I did not want to take the kids, that I was open to her taking them (really, I am ok with that possibility)... In the lesser of two evils, I'm OK with offending the host over having my kids do something they don't want to do which is also not really age appropriate for them (actually something oriented towards kids ages 3 to 6; unless it was family relation based).

Well... apparently SHE does not want to go to the event, either... smirk So the only thing I can think, and it doesn't matter (I'm ok with taking any heat on this) is that she is passing the buck and washing her hands of any responsibility...

Hey, I get it... if I felt ok with passing the buck and blame... well, why not... wink

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#2231846 - 03/19/12 04:48 PM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: ~ kd ~]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
lol... ok, last little add on, here...

We actually don't have a flex schedule. We have a fixed schedule which is "open to flexibility should we both agree."

Again... easily understood miscommunication...

and again, as I mention above and really sure and sincere of... I am completely OK with moving on, now... this misunderstanding has no bearing on making or keeping that choice...

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#2232077 - 03/20/12 12:19 PM Re: AtLRT for 4... and more... [Re: ~ kd ~]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
Just a quick follow up and I appologize to those who read my thread and expect more interesting tripe... smirk

Much quicker than expected, my W has back peddled and has agreed to what I thought was the original agreement, which was her having the kids this weekend and me picking up some time during spring break.

I did expect the spew to happen first which could have come in the form of "get your stuff out of the house" or "when are you filing D?"... although I'm not convinced that won't happen within the week, yet... lol...

Anyhow, no matter... and it's understandable that my W's response indicated that she was concerned I would retaliate by denying her time with the kids next month (or any future date) as per our SA... That thought never crossed my mind as I was willingly offering the weekend to my W as my response to the miscommunication and obligation that I unwittingly but apparently placed myself in.

Just for your clarification 25, again... this "event" did not cause me to make a choice to move on and this change also does not change my choice to move on... smile

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