Walking in Muskeg III

[Queen_of_Swords]

Hey Brooklyn, I've become expert at reading that new variant of English language of typo and even (omg) textese!

No worries. Yes it's all interesting, but also wearing ,something you know better than anyone here.

So, this morning, I text the H. a "Good morning P " a new habit (along with regularly asking things he can freely turn down so he gets used to saying "no").

This is 180 in my case as I never did this during our marriage - just to call or contact him at work. My perception ( and old childhood programming kicking in) then being that he wouldn't want to be bothered with interruptions.

Well, lo and behold. H gets chatty with me. It has happened before although very rarely. In the last month or so it seems every 4-5 days he'll go beyond a simple " Morning" response and engage until he has something else that needs his attention.

Small thing, but notable.

[dl443322]

SC, I would think about not making it every morning and at times just a simple good morning. I understand that you want him to get used to being able to say no. I have a problem with that myself.

But, if it were me, I might not like to have to do it all the time.

Just my opinion. You know best.

And yes, it is wearing. That's why I stopped trying to understand it and just accepted it as is. It became too much for me to try to analyze it and stopped me from moving forward.

[Queen_of_Swords]

Thanks Brooklyn, I had thought of that, not doing it every morning, but then I thought, if I were in his office, I would greet him daily. That's what I let guide me,asking myself what would my behaviour be if I was just a friend he knew in the office?

It is just the simple greeting with his name attached, and I don't expect a response or go beyond that unless he initiates it as he did this morning.

It's strange and somewhat surprising none the less, considering the dynamic of the walkaway.

As far as the requests that he can say "no" to, they're not every day, they happen about once a week. Nothing big like an invitation to dinner or anything like that though, just simple things sometimes absolutely ridiculous/fun things .

[Queen_of_Swords]

Not much more to report lately.
Notice my voice has dropped in pitch considerably over time.
H. has continued to chat me up via TM in the mornings. It's kind of strange.
He doesn't even seem to mind the small bits of flirting...does a lot of LOL and smiley faces.
We are supervising a Bday party for one of our kids this weekend. He has offered to pick up the party goods and food.
We'll see how it goes.

I'm lately trying to push away negative thoughts about what he thinks about me and just not care.
So what if he thinks I'm controlling, so what if he thinks I'm not attractive,so what ...bla bla bla bla? I am who I am, I am a good person, honest, true and loyal and if he doesn't accept me or the changes I've worked so hard for others have,can and will.

[Queen_of_Swords]

Had the party. Kids are done in, H. has left.
Kids had a good time. H had a good time as did I.
It was a nice party held at another venue.
H. helped clean up and I allowed him to go into what was once our home on his own, to put stuff away.
A departure for me since he left. I changed the security codes and asked for his only key when he did go.

Youngest begged him to stay. I told H. he could stay if he wished. He told our youngest and me that he had housework to finish at his apartment. I asked if he had please taken the extra soda, as it was a constant temptation. He laughed and said he knew it was, and it was in his car.

We said our goodbyes.

I don't know. I feel disconnected from him and hardly care what he does or does not do, what he does and does not think about me anymore.
I've worked my heart out over these last couple years to change myself and try to save my M.
Perhaps it wasn't worth saving once he walked out, he shows absolutely no movement forward. Is doing nothing more than existing day to day far as I see and know.
One of my siblings said something interesting to me when I mentioned there may be a possibilty of an EA or PA: " You really think he has the energy and initiative to pick up with someone else?" My sibling also believes that if I fought him he'd cave oompletely on access to the kids too and just give up. I could see that happening myself.

[Queen_of_Swords]

Every day it seems I get closer to "done".

Journaling-

I'm getting ever more numb and indifferent where he concerned. He's a stranger now and someone that seems to believe that I am not worth fighting for and neither is the family we created. His behaviour certainly shows this.

I am getting resigned and closer to acceptance of the thought that this person I cared deeply about and for, for 26 years, stopped loving and caring about me a long time ago, because he sees love only as a feeling, and is not about a choice, a decision made and actions taken.
That feeling for him is gone and love died, and can't be restored or sustained. He loves our kids, but not me. Simple.

A bitter and upsetting pill to swallow, but swallow I must.

I don't think I can keep on hoping for R anymore. After 2 years? Really? With this little change in the situation, with all the work I've accomplished and is ongoing with me personally, with my kids growing all the time, with me living in this marital limbo?

I must be delusional or freaking Pollyanna not to see the writing on the wall.

[Queen_of_Swords]

Update -
Had a discussion with H. this evening.
He decided since the kids were close to being out of school for summer he could increase his visits and do a little one on one with each child. I had no objection, so this evening he came to pick up one to be with after work. He came back around 8PM to drop child off. Then he wanted to leave. Both my kids were begging him to stay longer. I looked at him and said, " Could I talk to you for five minutes?"
He didn't say yes or say no. I waited, and asked " Well?" He gestured with his eyes to a room, and we went. The conversation best I can remember went like this:

Me - " See how they are, this has been going on all week and I'm running out of things to tell them." How do you wish to handle this?"

H - " I'll talk to them."

M - " So you wish to do this unilaterally, not as a united front?"
He thought for a moment ( I could see he was very uncomfortable with this conversation he had difficulty finding the words to say, was getting red faced, a little teary eyed, stretching his neck, coughing a little, sniffing.)

H - " I guess we better address this together."
M - " It doesn't have to be addressed right now, but this is something that is not going to go away, no matter how much you wish it to, and I can see by your physical reactions, that you really wish this would all disappear.
Look, I know you're uncomfortable with me. In fact I get the distinct impression that you'd rather be anywhere else and that you dislike me."

H - "It isn't that I dislike you. I just wasn't expecting to do this now."

M - " I know this is difficult for you, I know you'd prefer I'd make arrangements to speak with you about things like this in advance. The fact is life happens and I have to deal with things as they happen, on the fly. I can't often talk to you about this stuff given your preferences, but it does have to be dealt with. I deal with stuff like this every day H. I don't enjoy it, but I do it because it's necessary.

H - Silence. Fanning himself because he's feeling really hot and uncomfortable.

M - "Would you rather go somewhere else for this conversation where it's cooler?"

We moved to a different area of the house.

M- " I can see you're very uncomfortable."

H- "Yes I have a headache and my back hurts."

M - " Do you know why?"

H - " Not really"

M - "You're perceiving this conversation as a life or death conflict right now H. Your back hurts because your adrenal glands just flooded your body with stress hormones. Your head hurts from the adrenaline reaction that you've had to suppress. Tell me, did you feel like running or did your hands ball up?"

H - "Both. I had to conciously unclench my hands."

M - "So you didn't know whether to run or fight."

At this point we discussed how he saw his parents fight as a kid, and that he felt many of these same things growing up. How he didn't learn conflict resolution from them or even the difference between a fight, an argument, a difference of opinion or a discussion.

M - " Can you keep living his way H? Can you continue to have to deal with me if every time I provoke this response?
You are associating me with all these lousy feelings, but you know I'm not the cause, just the trigger.
I'm not the only one you respond this way to. It has to be bleeding out into other areas of your life. ( I mentioned a few names of people. He agreed he had many of the same feelings with them.)
We're talking. I'm not angry, yelling, screaming at you , name calling or threatening. This is not life or death, I'm not an axe murderer.
( He began to laugh at this, I smiled in response)
If I were then you should be having this response!"

H - " I know, this doesn't feel good."

M - As I see it H. you have a choice here, stay stuck, back there in survival mode as you were as a kid. Or do something. Are you happy being stuck, happy feeling this way in every interaction you have with me?
You have been a witness to what I've gone through dealing with my own garbage.
IMO you're at a crossroads and have two ways to go here, deal with and process this pain, to go through it to make those feelings diminish and not have them control your behaviour....or....choose to keep on avoiding and trying cover up those feelings. You've seen how that works in your own family H.
Addictions, alcoholism, overeating, serial marriage. How well does it work?

H - "My uncle drank and ate himself to death."

M - H., I don't want that for you. With me or without me, I want to see you succeed, be healthy and well. To be able to deal with what we're dealing with and not feel like you need to run, fight, or freeze anymore.

It's your choice H. I can't do this for you. I can't even help you with it.

H.- " I know."

M - I am not your mother H., I'm your wife. Please repeat it.
( He did.)

M - "Choose wisely grasshopper." ( He smiled at that.)

[Queen_of_Swords]

I am exhausted today. I've done almost nothing workwise. I guess that talk with my kid's Dad took more out of me than I thought it did.

Tonight he comes to pick up the other child for one on one time.
I think I'll be posting an update tonight too.

He is scheduled to pick them both up tomorrow night as well.
Stay tuned if you're interested.
Typing here is the only stress relief I can manage right now, besides exhausting myself physically.

[Jack_Three_Beans]

You might not like this Scylla.

Reading the conversation, without knowing the tone of voice used, it sounds like you talk down to him, more of a superior than equal.

For you to determine if that is the case.

You have said you like my POV.

I cannot say that I would respond well to that.

What strikes me is that it seems that you want him to jump to your conclusions and are pulling him by the nose ring there, instead of leading him to them.

[Queen_of_Swords]

I understand your perspective Jack. I can see what you're saying.
My tone of voice was conversational and calm. No histrionics. I put down what I could remember. There was more.
Perhaps it is as you say I was trying to lead him by the nose.
I don't know what I can do about that to be honest,I have been avoiding R talks as much as I can or discussions about our kids.

After two years he's still waffling, neither moving forward or backward. Whatever he does or does not do I will have to cope with regardless.


We'll see what happens. Truth is I'm >.< this close to giving up on him. For me I'm not even sure I want him back if he gets so upset merely talking to me. What's the point?