3 years after successful DBing and miserable

[LauraOh]

Me too, I was here 6 years ago after the ILYNILY speach.

DB'd my butt off--gave him everything he wanted. He has never been "invested" like me. And he uses porn. I have a thread in Infedelity asking if porn use is like cheating and there was a resounding YES if you want the summary in a nutshell.

I was just so happy to " have him". But he didn't stay happy forever--he got worse and worse and about a year and a half ago I figured I had to make ME happy--he is a lost cause for whatever reason.

So I started working out, lost even more weight (lost quite a bit from the first go-around) started school and I was served last Wednesday. He doesn't want a healthy woman, he wants someone he can dominate and intimidate. He is a bully, with the underlying fear and cowardice that bullies normally hide.

I am here still, DBing, but not with the same intensity at all--more like, I want to learn how to be the best *I* can be--I communicate without fear for the first time in 15 years, I am detached so I can "see" him better, and you know, he is still interesting to me and the whole process is still interesting to me...but sometimes I wonder if this does "work"--yikes!! I guess I will cross that bridge when I come to it.lol.

I think I have been too much of a weeny for too long--he doesn't really know who I am at all right now and is scared of me--says it all the time in fact! I am not sure he would ever want a strong (er) woman. (I am no ballbuster--I just speak up for myself now.lol) We'll see....

[AJM]

I've only been at this a few years now. But it occurs to me that reconciliation - that goal to which many of us strive - is more difficult and the transition to it is really really hard.

Girl, it seems to be me that you haven't forgiven the infidelity? I would guess that you would have to do that and really do that. With or without his help. With or without the marriage, right? It might be a deal breaker for you. That lack of intimacy is one thing that seems like a problem and you may be part of that problem as much as he is. Worth checking - I really don't know - but I am asking the question.

I think in some cases, it works out. In others, it's too much for the WAS to change. They continue, but they don't change. It is a lot for the LBS as well. Don't be too hard on you but I do think it's a good time to answer that question of forgiveness and what about your H you want - the marriage or him or both?

LO - sounds like you have all but made up your mind? You are worth figuring out though - that has to happen regardless so may was well get to it. Via con dios, chica....

Personally, I'm a fan of women who speak up for themselves. I'm not a very good mind reader and I don't want a puppy. There are plenty of men who feel the same, but your H can change. He just has to want to. You did see something in him at one point after all...

Good luck to you both.

AJ

[sandi2]

my H was barely willing to return

I get the impression he was pressured to return. Did he willingly leave his A/OW or was he left by her? Did you do a lot of pleading to get him to go back home?

I think you and I both know that now you are the WAS. You haven't left physically but emotionally. You've made the first step. I lived in that first step for so many years. I'm speaking of resentment.

You worked so hard for your M....and with the hope (and expectations) that your H would at least attempt to put forth a tiny bit of effort. You probably made a lot of changes in yourself as well as trying to "please" him in every area. While you worked like a slave...he laid back and soaked it up. As time went by your heart began to resent him for being so self-centered and lazy about the MR.

This is an area of the heart that can hold hurt feelings for a long time. The resentment turns to a stronger type of anger until it may take one thing to break you.

I have been reading several posts from LBS's and all the smashing they do toward the WAW. If she tells the LBH that it's not him but her....then it's BS. But if she tells him she has not been happy for years....then she's rewriting history. What so many do not seem to understand is that a woman can be deeply hurt by the man she loves...and she will somehow find the strength to push the hurt down deep in her heart...and try to go on with the MR as best as she can. Over the years, a lot of hurt can build up. Maybe she tried to tell him she wasn't "happy"....but he just didn't get it. She isn't sexually attracted to him as much. She feels angry. (He thinks she's in a bad mood.) She begins to distant herself. Then she shuts down.

I lived in the shut-down mode for a long time. I felt dead inside and was almost desparate to "feel" some sort of love...romance...sexual feelings...something!

I don't know that your case is so much about unforgiveness as it is "disappointment". You feel the unfairness in the situation and you're getting PO about it.

You know....I don't blame you one bit. However, you need to decide what you want. Decide what the most valuable thing in life is to you and what you are willing to do to have that. Ask yourself if you can respect yourself with your decision.

There are just a few WAW's here on the board, and we know how you may be feeling right now. Your stitch may be different from mine....but I think I truly understand you.

When I was young, I searched for what would give me happiness....but now that I'm older, I seek that which gives me peace. Decide what is the most valuable to you in life.

You need a support system and I think you will find this board to be a wonderful place. It helped this WAW to stay in M and avoid tearing her family apart.

Take care,
Sandi

[the girl]

Hey, thanks everyone! What great words of insight and wisdom.

LauraOh, I can relate to you a lot. Sandi, I want your headspace!

My H returned to our family because of our three small children. He tells me I have a lot going for me, so that is also why he stays. I think he cares for me as much as he can. He is not able to have deep relationships with people, I think.

Our last argument, when I stated that the porn would end our marriage, I was specific with him about what I meant: The habitual masterbation to online porn and the content of the materials. Habitual sexual activities that exclude me, which have been going on for our whole marriage, mean that I cannot trust him. The content of hardcore porn (not simply playboy) is immensely disturbing to me in every way and actually makes me fear for my safety. So, I defined it for him.

He told me he does not like his habitual use of porn and that he knows it is wrong. He just has not been able to stop. He is doing better than he was a few years ago, so he feels a lot better about himself.

A few days later he told me he is going to sign up for an internet service that gives me a full list of sites he has visited, every day. I also told him I know of a device the FBI uses to search computer files, and that I could purchase that.

I then said that I don't want him to do this because of my telling him to. I want him to do it because he is concerned about the state of his heart and soul. Because he sees how much porn destroys our intimacy. Because it makes him an awful man.
He rarely goes out of his comfort zone, so the counseling option is out for now. I feel like I need to require it.

He says "I just want to be loved for who I am". He almost moved out last week because I was saying that I could not love him in the current state of habitual porn user.

I just don't understand why men tend to be so reluctant to change. It disappoints me immensely.

I do want peace. I want to do God's will for me. I just don't think tolerating habitual hardcore porn use is God's will. I am praying on this.

[sandi2]

He says "I just want to be loved for who I am".

I think that is a huge issue for men who have a lot of money (for example)......or if he had always had to earn love from others. We all want to be loved for the person we are inside instead of our overt behavior or appearances. There is something in that sentence he gave you that sounds like a little boy from long ago wanting to be loved for himself.

He almost moved out last week because I was saying that I could not love him in the current state of habitual porn user.

I know exactly how you meant that, but maybe you could re-phrase that in the future. Instead of saying you could not love him if he continued the porn, perhaps you could tell him that you love him but that you cannot live in the state of the R that results from his porn use.

In other words, you kind of turn it around for him to see what "you" can or cannot live with.....instead of how bad he is. Does that make sense?

Men need to know that we look up to them and need them to be our strong leader. Instead of making him feel guilty for the porn use, try telling him how much happier you feel when he is free from the grip porn has on him.

I have read how porn activity can lead to deeper & darker things, so you have a right to be very concerned. If you are feeling a degree of "fear"..then that could be your instints telling you to get out before it gets worse.

[the girl]

Sandi,

You are right when you say there is a little boy inside wanting to be loved as is. He was raised by a loving, devout christian family but is not a believer. He tried to be, for 7 years of our marriage, then flipped out, had an affair and told me he has been faking his christianity for our whole marriage.

I am a devout christian, and have been struggling to let go of his unbelief, and accept him as is. I verbally tell him I want him to be himself, and that I am not going to hold it against him (how can you be angry at someone for not believing in God?), but that it grieves me to not be able to share that part of life with him.

His family are very loving and grace filled people. They have loved, forgiven and reached out to their son his whole rebellious life. Many times I think they are too nice to him. That's what most people in my life think of me.

The thing is, I don't love him when I think of the porn use. It is abominable to me. I could learn to love him the way I might love a relative. But not romantically; I can't trust him with my soul. This realization is what has landed me in counseling; I thought I could just stuff it down and make myself love him, and go through the motions. Now, I am so disappointed, so grossed out and so numb I don't know what I am doing.

I have told him all this. I have told him I feel lonely, disconnected. I have repeated myself.

It could be that I am finally and truly grieving all that I have lost to porn over the past 11 years. It feels like a robbery and I am in a dazed, tired state wondering how to rebuild.

[kissak]

Hi "The Girl"

I feel like I understand your sitch. I feel like IM in the same place.

Me and my H were married for 13 years, he left, and after 3years of dbing my butt off, he came back of his own free will. Now after 8 months or so, I feel like Im just not happy.

Its frustrating to get to this point and think it was all a waste of time.

I hope all works out for you.

[AJM]

Hey Kissak. Not to hijack the thread, but I think that when he came back you may have hoped things would be better quickly. I don't think that's how it works. I think it takes years of rebuilding vs. months. Hang in there and find out.

TG, I think I hear a major disconnect between the two of you. But I don't think that it's over or that it's just his porn use that has you saying or doing these things, is it? You sound more like you want that connection and are looking at this as the reason you aren't getting it. Is that possible? Is it possible that your husband, while he does not want to lose you is not going to be perfect enough for you? And maybe feels that at some level?
I'm hearing some things that make me wonder about the concept of unconditional love and how that relates. I'm not saying you wouldn't want change. I'm saying that I hear a lot about how you want him to change. Something about a splinter in his eye (I'm in no way downplaying porn and it's effects)....

Just asking the questions...

[didthehurt]

I don't want to go to counseling with him because I think he needs to go alone for a while. I don't trust opening my heart to him. I am afraid to make any more DBing efforts, as I think my work might be in vain.

TG,

the quote in bold up there speaks volumes...Please dont numb yourself with medication.

I know your husband very well...for i am him...i did the same things, had an affair..etc...even got into trouble with internet chat sites....i;m sorry for you having to be here dealing with this. What i did was got my self a counselor that specializied in sexual issues. It took me about 2.5 years to figure out that the porn is bad. Its as addicitve as cocaine. It really messed up my relationship. I had a beautiful wife, 2 great boys, a great job. My wife seems to be just like you. She came back 3yrs ago. But looking back now i can tell her heart was not into it. She has never forgiven me. Now she wants a divorce. I have finally gotten over the porn. I just hope i can hold onto our family...Remember to forgive is to set a prisoner free only to discover that the prisoner was you.. my heart goes out to you...

[sandi2]

Hate the sin and love the sinner.....is easier when you aren't M to the sinner. I would think that living with a man who is addicted to porn would be like living with a person who has other lifestyles (that I won't mention) that most Christians do not tolarate well under their own roof.

I can easily see how porn would destroy a MR.....and that is exactly what the devil wants to do. That is why it's so evil & destructive. It is addictive and in order to get more satisified results, it often leads to darker areas. I just believe that until he is willing to get help for the problem, there is not a lot of hope in the human realm. However, we know there is power in prayer. If you can totally give him over to God, then that's your best bet right there. Just be prepared b/c with your H being an unbeliever, he will probably sink very low before he starts seeing the Light. Do you have anyone that you can share your burden with and will help you pray for him?

Do you think he sees his parents as some kind of "holy rollers"? I have seen a few kids grow up that rebell against this and take the low road simply b/c they do not want any part of that life. Hope this isn't the case.