I am going to assume from your last post that you do not have the links for the resources and I will give them to you. This is a BIG homework assignment.
Now you have all the tools to read. Let us know how your doing and if you have any questions.
I suggest that you read the entire thread in the resources. You can also pick out some people and read their whole story.
Remember that in the stages of MLC it does NOT go 1,2,3,4,5,6 but can get all mixed up and repeat itself and have more than one stage at once. Depression is the key to the whole thing and it is always present!
I do not understand the anger and resentment at my accomplishmetns.
It may not be something understandable, but let’s look at a few possibilities.
A common one is the too little too late scenario—the perception that you are changing only now as a last resort. He may believe the changes are thus manipulative and not authentic or he is hurt and frustrated because it took this situation to get you to change.
Misery loves company. There is a developmental gap between LBSs and MLCers. MLCers regress and LBSs progress. There is often a conscious or more likely unconscious desire to close this gap. MLCers are in a sort of arrested development and thus rather than attempting to rise to your development they try to regress your development.
They feel life is hopeless and thus they cannot continue with you—since in their minds you are the reason life is hopeless. But they love you and thus need anger to fuel their escape and create justifications. It is not about you.
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Is this unusual? (When you first really change I mean.)
Um, no. this is MLC-normal. Some may cycle backwards to you in their confusion, but if your changes brought about immediate/quick progress and lasting positive changes in him, I would say that it was likely not a midlife crisis. Understand that immediate/quick is relative—a year is quick.
MLC gets worse before it gets better—much worse.
If this is MLC and you think—or worse, expect—that your changes will yield positive results in the short-term, you are setting yourself up for a let-down. There are often threads with titles about how DB is not working because the MLCer is still seeking a divorce or leaving. MLCers seek divorce or leave—not all file; it’s not called a crisis because the rollercoaster ride is fun.
Focus on yourself and accept the process of the crisis.
OK I have not done all that reading. I am trying hard to digest the fist pages.
It is unbelieveable. I live with my H. I sometimes wish I did not. Tonight, he told me that he has been "keeping notes" on me for over 4 years! he has also secretly voice recorded me in the past- trust is not important to him at all I think.
In the last few weeks I have been called a liar, dishonest, evil and he insinuated that I had an "inappropriate relationship" in the past. (HE had the EA, not me)
He also tells me frequently to "pull my head out of my ass."
I do not know how long I can put up with this. I understand detachment. I get it. But every time it happens It tears me down just a little bit more.
He says he loves me and wants the marriage, but I think he has already decided to go, and these behavioral attacks are just trying to run me off.
He does not act like someone who wants a marriage, I am confused and saddened. Tonight he also rationalized his past antics AGAIN. He apologises but says "but" and gives 500 reasons why heacted the way he did.
Makes the apology useless, IMHO.
I have been polite and resisting angry outbursts at all costs. Really I wish he would go away sometimes, I think at least I would have peace.
Wow. I thought I had it bad because my h says hateful things to me via text message. I never thought how it would be if he was still here. While I want him back here, I don't think I could take the hatred face to face. It was hard enough when he was just being distant towards me.
I think you have stumbled upon the realization that it's horrible either way! If they move out, we're miserable, missing them and wanting to work on the marriage. If they're still in the home but hateful, we can't stand it and just want them to get away from us and be quiet.
So, I think it's best either way to not react the way they want us to. (which IMO would be very hard for me to do face to face) When I do that, h gets even angrier and more hateful. So, I've learned now to make whatever communication we have as brief as possible. I also say "I'm sorry you feel that way." My h hates that since he wants to argue and I have learned not to give in to that.
The other thing that has helped me is to think of my h as being handicapped or having some kind of mental breakdown. That's easier for me to understand than the thought of him instantly hating me after all these years. That and when I've been face to face with him, I watch his eyes. I've seen the dead look, but I've also seen the look of love even though the words he says are full of hate. What's going on inside his head must be exhausting and confusing to him. I pray every day for a complete but faster end to his crisis because I can't stand the thought of him being in this much pain.
By the way, I don't know that I would totally believe it when he tells you he has been keeping notes on you and recording you. They say all kinds of weird things and I've found out most of the time they're lying! Just trying to stick that knife in deeper. They're in pain so they want to cause us pain. And I think in a demented way they want to push us away from them because they feel so bad about themselves, they want us to be with someone who will treat us better. Let's face it, we're having a battle of wits with an unarmed person. So don't take too much, if any of it to heart. It will drive you crazy if you don't.
Kickme, There is so much wisdom in 1000ships post. Working on and achieving detachment is so important, but I think it is even more important if the spouse still lives at home. Detachment is a protection for the LBS if it can be used as a shield. The faster the LBS gets it into their head that this crisis wasn't caused by something they did, said, didn't do, didn't say, etc. the easier it is to stop reacting to and start protecting themselves from the spew the MLCer throws out there.
Pain is the driving force that makes the MLCer lash out. It is emotional pain so intense that it can manifest into physical pain as well. As hurtful as it is for us LBSers to hear and witness what the MLCer dishes out it doesn't compare to what the MLCer is feeling. The saving component for us LBSers is that we, if we choose, can learn and understand what is happening to our S where they do not have the mental capacity at this time to realize why they are doing what they do. Until the MLCer looks inside themselves and resolves those internal issues they will not realize it is not the external things that are causing their misery, such as the spouse, children, responsibility or whatever they're blaming it on. Therefore, plain and simple, knowledge is indeed, power.
The bottom line in all this is that even if you were the perfect husband/wife, if your spouse is geared for a MLC there would be nothing you could have done to stop or prevent it. Delaying it maybe, but it will eventually catch up to them and they will enter into it with a vengeance.
Detachment is hard to achieve, but once you do it is a relief. It allows you to step back from the drama of the MLCer and begin the vital work on yourself. The most important thing is that you come out on the other side of your journey and know that you will be better than OK and able to handle whatever way your sitch turns out.
1000S and CK thank you. There is a lot of food for thought in these posts. My issue is that I know what I contributed to this mess. HE is not totally to blame..
But from now on... I am taking charge of my anxiety/panic.
I really have been improving over years (old complaints) But I have been "DEAD SEXY spot on" (no AO's) for about 9 weeks.
And I get a tsunami of hate in reply. He is being impossible. I shoot ofr the target (what he says he wants) and the BLEEPING target moves! (now my "sins" are other things)
I guess I just can't "pull my head out of my ass" fast enough.
venting...venting...venting. He seriously was not this way for 20 years. HE is BIG in the church group-- thinks he is just a "great guy".
I think he had a Freaudian slip yesterday. WHen I asked him about the "notes" he has been keeping, I said "They are not really going to heop you get anything. All they are is your opinions of how you think I have been acting.. no one really cares. The only purpose I see in you bringing this up/keeping them is to belittle me".
His reply?... along the lines of; "That's quite O.K. if it is degrading/humiliating to you.".... (wha? why is it "OK" to humiliate me?)
I am going back to re read. The LBS thread was interesting.
I really think he wants to go. But does not have the Kahones to do it. HE can threaten with papers, and mean things, but he is What comes out of his mouth, and his actions do not add up. I have told him that I am watching his actions. (But of course, my interpretations of his actions are always "misguided and wrong") so very, very sad.
I think he thinks he is "detaching" from me everytime he walks out. If we have a conversation, if it gets uncomfortabel for him, he storms out. I really see this as an excuse to go.
I do not have AO's, call names or anything. I just sit there with my heart on my sleave and he denies me.
I don't know how long I can take this. I live with the divorce filing over my head. Recovery seems impossible.(waiting for other shoe to fall) MC pointed that out, too.
He will not listen. MC says the balance of power is akilter .sp? and for trust and recconection to grow- balance needs to be established.
He has promised to stop lying to me. (Big trust issue). Last night I found out he DID tell his mother about divorce filings. (he knows I want privacy around --not entertainment for his family-- with M)
Small lie (i thought he told her-- he denied it)
BUT IT IS STILL ANOTHER LIE. I went all panicky- He just says his way or tough [censored].
He refuses. Tells me to go "pick up my paperwork" if I don't like it. I feel like a dog.
If he has decided to go- why the h$ll does not he GO? This is torture.
I live with the divorce filing over my head. Recovery seems impossible.
Recovery is not within grasp at this point. I was going to tell you that it is not an appropriate goal, but that would be hypocritical of me as well as inaccurate. But it can be your Big Goal. If you were in Med School the Big Goal would be to become an MD, or a specialty beyond that. But what must you do to achieve that goal? Set recovery aside and work on the present. Do what you can and change what you can.
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He will not listen.
He’s in MLC; he’s not going to listen. This is one of those things that you can’t change; learn to Accept. Your MLCer can change it, but he will only do that when he chooses.
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for trust and reconnection to grow- balance needs to be established.
True, but that is not going to happen now. If you work on that as your goal, you will burn out quickly.
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He just says his way or tough [censored].
Straight from the MLC script. I know it sucks, but fighting it will only make things worse. Accept. You get a choice too, but you cannot control him.
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If he has decided to go- why the h$ll does not he GO? This is torture.
He will. You can either speed that up and kick him out, or let him make the decision. There is no right or wrong here. I don’t advocate either because it depends on what the LBS can handle. If the LBS can withstand an at-home MLCer, then do it—you can withstand the torture, but how much? But most MLCer will leave eventually. That doesn’t mean they will not return, but most MLC marriages experience a separation. While he is at home you are learning valuable communication and coping skills for dealing with an MLCer. As you detach and treat you MLCer with respect, dignity while also treating yourself well by setting respect-boundaries, your MLCer will file your behaviour away for later processing. They remember how we treat them. In the moments they are hateful and spew because they think we are standing in their way. It is only later that they are grateful. Years later.
MLC averages 2-7 years and I am of the opinion that 2 years is on the short side. Expect 3-4+. You need to consider whether you are willing and able to handle that and if it is worth it. There are no guarantees for marital reconciliation after that.
Can you Stand? Will you Stand? Is it worth Standing if there is no reconciliation?
Answer those for yourself. But knowing a little about MLC may help you in answering. That hateful spewing is the MLC Monster. And recover may not seem possible for a very long time. If you are like most, you will at some point believe it is hopeless, but reconciled couples felt that way too.
So don't take too much, if any of it to heart. It will drive you crazy if you don't.